Custom Bats Cricket Forum

General Cricket => Players => Topic started by: Kieron_BT on February 26, 2019, 12:16:20 PM

Title: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Kieron_BT on February 26, 2019, 12:16:20 PM
Another blow for South Africa through the kolpak system?

https://yorkshireccc.com/news/view/7366/olivier-signs-for-white-rose

3 year deal - Great signing for Yorkshire
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: goodarmcindy on February 26, 2019, 12:33:43 PM
The system can't be right when so many are choosing to walk away from international cricket in favour of playing county cricket.

Plus, I saw someone mention on Twitter that Kolpak status is closely linked to EU membership. What happens to Kolpak players in the event of a no deal Brexit?
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Manormanic on February 26, 2019, 12:36:58 PM
They're getting in now whilst the option exists is the word.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: goodarmcindy on February 26, 2019, 12:40:21 PM
So there must be a guarantee on status if signed before 29 March. No wonder he went for a three-year deal.

Who else might be coming over? ABdV signed a T20 deal yesterday...
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: alexhilly1492 on February 26, 2019, 12:40:34 PM
not good for SA!

first abbott and morkel now olivier just as he hit some form for them and earned his spot in the side
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on February 26, 2019, 01:04:58 PM
You're got to question the heart and passion of some of these South Africans. de Villiers and Morkel had outstanding international careers, but Abbott, Roussow, Viljoen, de Lange, Ingram and Olivier all know that the national side will lose many iconic players in the coming months. Yet rather than wait in line they give up.

Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Kulli on February 26, 2019, 01:27:33 PM
Kolpak deal is reverdsable in  double quick time though isn't it?

Ryan Maclaren was a Kolpack one day and a test player virtually the next wasn't he? it's not like theres a 5 year cooling off period.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Manormanic on February 26, 2019, 01:51:27 PM
Rudolph too. If the South Africans don't impose a cooling off period, there is no other reason for there to be one.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: mo_town on February 26, 2019, 02:18:16 PM
Was his performance in the test series an audition for a good deal with Yorkshire?
What is the reason behind talented players opting for a kolpak deal?
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Kulli on February 26, 2019, 03:09:19 PM
Was his performance in the test series an audition for a good deal with Yorkshire?
What is the reason behind talented players opting for a kolpak deal?

Security and cash. Long contact on (i'm guessing nearing 100k a year) vs whatever they make as a SA contracted player but without the risk that they could be dropped/injured at any time.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: dt-second-hand-cricket on February 26, 2019, 03:19:54 PM
Security and cash. Long contact on (i'm guessing nearing 100k a year) vs whatever they make as a SA contracted player but without the risk that they could be dropped/injured at any time.
totally understandable when looking at long term financial security for him, he could easily save himself over £150000 and that would set him up for life in SA - Rand seems very weak as it has been for a while, so he is probably getting 5x his SA salary minimum and the money will go much further when he gets back to SA - also doubt he is the type of player to get long term and big IPL/BBL contracts in the future - just a shame for him and SA that he will not be playing for them for the foreseeable future
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Manormanic on February 26, 2019, 03:24:29 PM
Security and cash. Long contact on (i'm guessing nearing 100k a year) vs whatever they make as a SA contracted player but without the risk that they could be dropped/injured at any time.

Aside from the possibility of the Kolpak door closing on him, I suspect the logic is thus:
1. Olivier may not be a first pick in any format. In tests, as well as he bowled, he would likely be behind Steyn, Philander and Rabada in a four man attack and if they went five man Mulder or Phelukweyo offering more with the willow would count against him. Ngidi, meanwhile, will be first reserve.
2. In terms of his financial future he is not the type of player chosen for T20 leagues, so this is his easiest him of cash. Given the South African economy, who can blame him?
3. Doors have hardly closed. If in 18 months the selectors say dude, you're first pick, he can negotiate ways around things.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: shadowlight on February 26, 2019, 03:26:06 PM
I would have to say financial stability could be the number one reason.  If Steyn, Philander and Rabada are around do you see Olivier making the team, unless they play 4 quick's?  I do not see that happening that often.  Also, he was not selected for ODI team, which means that he was only considered for test match and when you are 4 or 5th in the queue, the financial stability comes in to play, especially if your contract with SA v/s Yorkshire has substantial difference.  This also, gives him to option of going down the t20 route in off season.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on February 26, 2019, 03:39:05 PM
Aside from the possibility of the Kolpak door closing on him, I suspect the logic is thus:
1. Olivier may not be a first pick in any format. In tests, as well as he bowled, he would likely be behind Steyn, Philander and Rabada in a four man attack and if they went five man Mulder or Phelukweyo offering more with the willow would count against him. Ngidi, meanwhile, will be first reserve.
2. In terms of his financial future he is not the type of player chosen for T20 leagues, so this is his easiest him of cash. Given the South African economy, who can blame him?
3. Doors have hardly closed. If in 18 months the selectors say dude, you're first pick, he can negotiate ways around things.
Olivier might not be first choice but Steyn and Philander are at the ends of their respective careers. Aside from Rabada the next in line would've been Ngidi and Olivier.
Sitting on the bench for the next 5-7 Tests was hardly going to harm Olivier's place in the pecking order
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: RPC/Blueroom Cricket - Adie on February 26, 2019, 04:26:15 PM
Money talks

Canít blame him one bit really.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Manormanic on February 26, 2019, 04:29:39 PM
Olivier might not be first choice but Steyn and Philander are at the ends of their respective careers. Aside from Rabada the next in line would've been Ngidi and Olivier.
Sitting on the bench for the next 5-7 Tests was hardly going to harm Olivier's place in the pecking order

In 18 months or so when that happens, he will be substantially better off and likely Yorkshire would be supportive. You have to remember that a Kolpak contract is substantially more lucrative than a standard overseas one.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on February 26, 2019, 08:53:35 PM
Olivier reportedly rejected a two year deal with CSA. Thereís talks of him wanting to try and cash in some of the lesser T20 leagues and T10 leagues.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on March 20, 2019, 06:56:31 PM
Olivier has now said he wants to play for England!
This is getting silly now...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/cricket/news/12173/11670666/duanne-olivier-has-future-england-call-on-his-mind-ahead-of-starting-yorkshire-career (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/cricket/news/12173/11670666/duanne-olivier-has-future-england-call-on-his-mind-ahead-of-starting-yorkshire-career)
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: liscon12 on March 20, 2019, 07:03:13 PM
Good news for Yorkshire, he'll be trying like hell to take as many wickets as possible.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: InternalTraining on March 20, 2019, 07:25:42 PM
Olivier has now said he wants to play for England!
This is getting silly now...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/cricket/news/12173/11670666/duanne-olivier-has-future-england-call-on-his-mind-ahead-of-starting-yorkshire-career (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/cricket/news/12173/11670666/duanne-olivier-has-future-england-call-on-his-mind-ahead-of-starting-yorkshire-career)

He'd be 30 y/o old by then. He could've had a longer international career in SA and also made money with the international T-20 circuit. Bad call by him, he is so exciting bowler to watch.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: billyb on March 20, 2019, 08:09:38 PM
Completely disagree with Olivier trying to declare for England. Makes a mockery of an already wobbly system.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on March 20, 2019, 08:37:27 PM
Completely disagree with Olivier trying to declare for England. Makes a mockery of an already wobbly system.

This!
If it's realistic that he gets picked or not isn't the issue, it's the fact the system exists that it's even a possibility
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: ppccopener on March 20, 2019, 09:03:42 PM
It is daft. Good pub quiz thou how many players have full test caps for two different countries.

I can only think of
Kepler weasels, SA and AUS
and
Imran tahir(I think) PAK and SA.

Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: liscon12 on March 20, 2019, 09:08:35 PM
Boyd Rankin Eng-Ire
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on March 20, 2019, 09:09:06 PM
It is daft. Good pub quiz thou how many players have full test caps for two different countries.

I can only think of
Kepler weasels, SA and AUS
and
Imran tahir(I think) PAK and SA.

I don't think Tahir every played international cricket for Pakistan, did he?

Boyd Rankin springs to mind as the most recent one.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: SD on March 20, 2019, 09:10:50 PM
I don't blame the player in a situation like this, it is his job and like most people outside of sport, job security and his long term financial future will unavoidably play a big role in decision making.  I am a lawyer and many of my contemporaries have left the UK in search of greater rewards aboard.  I hold nothing against a sportsman who does the same.

I do have concerns about him playing for England having already played test cricket though.  I have no issue with someone born overseas who has made a life here playing for England, but I don't think changing country having already played international cricket should be permitted.
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: ppccopener on March 20, 2019, 09:11:17 PM
Boyd rankin yes good one

Tahir not 100 per cent..Iíll check
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: SD on March 21, 2019, 09:57:31 AM
There will be a few who played for India in the years leading up to partition who went on to play for Pakistan
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: alexhilly1492 on March 21, 2019, 10:31:50 AM
It is daft. Good pub quiz thou how many players have full test caps for two different countries.

I can only think of
Kepler weasels, SA and AUS
and
Imran tahir(I think) PAK and SA.

test caps, only rankin and kepler

ODI on the other hand there has been quite a few

morgan (ireland - england)
joyce (England - Ireland)
rankin (Ireland - England - Ireland)
Dirk Nannes (Netherlands - Australia)
Luke Ronchi ( Australia - New Zealand)

im sure there has been more too!

Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: Manormanic on March 21, 2019, 11:08:01 AM
There have been a few - Albert Trott, Billy Midwinter, John Traicos and the Nawab Pataudi
Title: Re: Yorkshire sign Duanne Olivier to Kolpak deal
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on March 21, 2019, 11:25:02 AM
15 Test players

10 ODI players

7 T20i players

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cricketers_who_have_played_for_two_international_teams