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General Cricket => Cricket Training, Fitness and Injuries => Topic started by: alexevo94 on April 22, 2019, 02:59:11 PM

Title: Planting my front foot
Post by: alexevo94 on April 22, 2019, 02:59:11 PM
Are season started on Saturday and mine didn’t get off to a good start. 4 ball duck but I keep having the same issue we’re im planting my front foot and most of the time I’m LBW. I haven’t been able to buy a run dating back to last year. I’ve noticed that early in my innings my feet just don’t move and if they do it’s just because I’m conscious of it. Wondering if anyone can help with some friendly advice.

Cheers
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Psi on April 22, 2019, 03:10:36 PM
Why don't you use a trigger motion as the bowler bowls, moving your front foot to point a little towards the bowler, then you may be in a better place to adjust the position of your front foot to the correct line as your weight goes forward  when facing fast bowling.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: strang on April 22, 2019, 03:36:40 PM
Why don't you use a trigger motion as the bowler bowls, moving your front foot to point a little towards the bowler, then you may be in a better place to adjust the position of your front foot to the correct line as your weight goes forward  when facing fast bowling.
I've been looking at vids on youtube of this and been trying it in the nets, as my get out from lbw was way too high, maybe around 40%. Still getting used to the idea but it does make you more alert on your feet.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: LateBloomer on April 22, 2019, 05:37:59 PM
I have, in the past, also planted my front foot when out of form which made me a sitting duck for any sort of inswing or seam. This was part of my trigger movement which had become more exaggerated over a few years

The way I got over it was to stay as still as I could for as long as possible. I am now at the point where I have almost zero trigger, my only conscious movement before the bowler releases is the pick up and hinge. I recommend this back to basics approach, trigger movements are overrated

Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 22, 2019, 05:43:12 PM
What @LateBloomer says.
Practice moving your head to the ball, with some tennis ball drop feeds. Progress to underarm feeds and then throw downs.
Moving your front foot into different positions.
Quite often planting your front foot is caused by over striding, but mainly it is caused by moving your foot to the ball rather than your head.

Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 22, 2019, 05:48:35 PM
Classic red herring. The problem isn't your foot, the problem is your bat. It keeps missing the ball. Solve that, and you won't be out lbw.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Kez on April 22, 2019, 06:37:56 PM
Classic red herring. The problem isn't your foot, the problem is your bat. It keeps missing the ball. Solve that, and you won't be out lbw.

Could be, but also possibly a not a total red herring though. Feet in the wrong place may mean bat can’t get to ball...
Without seeing it, it’s hard to suggest the best course of action.

Improved bat path and looking to play straighter I reckon will help too.

Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 22, 2019, 07:38:30 PM
Could be, but also possibly a not a total red herring though. Feet in the wrong place may mean bat can’t get to ball...
Without seeing it, it’s hard to suggest the best course of action.

Improved bat path and looking to play straighter I reckon will help too.

The problem is the bat. What is causing the problem with the bat is impossible to say without a video, and it would be unprofessional to guess.

Of course, feet in the wrong place is also likely to be a symptom, not a cause. It could be the setup, it could be the thought process. Lots of batsman plant their foot but still score stacks of runs.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Gurujames on April 22, 2019, 07:45:48 PM
What guard do you take? If you feel confident off of your legs take a centre or middle and off guard. I find that helps me.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: edge on April 22, 2019, 08:19:06 PM
If you're getting out lbw a lot I'd put good money on your head falling over to off. Similar to posts above - a trigger isn't a good fix for this, standing still and balanced at the crease is. See if you can video yourself in the nets or get someone to watch your batting, should give you a better idea of what's causing the problem.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: brokenbat on April 22, 2019, 09:09:05 PM
If you're getting out lbw a lot I'd put good money on your head falling over to off. Similar to posts above - a trigger isn't a good fix for this, standing still and balanced at the crease is. See if you can video yourself in the nets or get someone to watch your batting, should give you a better idea of what's causing the problem.

Exactly. Your foot is probably moving, but Just going across (because your head is falling over). Try a slightly open stance (very slight), and focus on NOT moving.. a good way to achieve this would be to look to play the on drive every ball (this will give you feel for staying balanced).
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Seniorplayer on April 22, 2019, 09:10:37 PM
Forget your front foot Lead with your head  and the rest will follow
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Chompy9760 on April 24, 2019, 12:58:59 PM
I've used a couple aproaches to try to combat getting the front foot in the wrong place.

1.  Using a more upright stance, which gets the head back towards 'over off stump' instead of slouching which puts the head outside off.
2.  Extending the line of the stumps and drawing them on the pitch with a marker, outside the crease in front of you.  Then every front foot shot you play, you have a good look at exactly where your front foot is landing, relative to the stumps.  This may not solve your problem, but it will make you more aware of it, and may surprise you at the extent of the problem!
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Big Mac on April 24, 2019, 01:19:12 PM
I will echo the advice to lead with your head, if you watch the ball well and try and get your head to the ball that makes a massive difference. Leading with your head and bringing the bat down straight are pretty much all you need to score runs tbh, footwork be damned. In addition that there are a couple of schools of thought of how to solve this problem.

Option 1) Spend lots of time in the nets fixing your technique until you become a lean, mean, run scoring machine. Lots of hard work involved here.

Option 2) Skip the hard work and just embrace your flaws and foibles.

My bat is down in my stance, and my head causes me to fall over to the offside and my front foot used to stop me getting to the ball if it's straight or on the pads.

In the interests of laziness, I stopped trying to fix the problem and simply opened up my stance so I take guard facing mid-on. My head still causes me to topple only now I topple straight down the wicket and don't get trapped LBW in addition to being able to flick the ball off my pads.

The trade off was I no longer get into good positions to play the cover drive but I bat longer so I feel it's worth it.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: strang on April 24, 2019, 02:38:00 PM
Lead with the head it is.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Cys1 on April 24, 2019, 02:47:33 PM
Got to agree with Kez. Tough to say what the cause of falling over is without seeing some footage.
It could be something in your stance (closed off stance, weight leaning towards offside etc) or you just simply moving too early before the ball is being bowled that could cause this or even a combination of them.
It's more about identifying the correct line and then moving the body to play it. You need to give yourself the best chance to do this and generally this would mean that you need to be as still as possible for as long as possible and to be in a balanced position at delivery.
Trigger movements, standing more upright etc unfortunately will not help if you if you don't get this right. Try only moving when the ball has been delivered and also do some drills where you hit the ball on the ground without moving your feet. This should force you to stay balanced, hit the ball late and also to lead with your head ( shoulder ) instead of your feet.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 02:52:34 PM
Christ, "Lead with your head" is such a tired old cliché. Pietersen (good batsman, but clearly not a coach) said it once on sky sports and now everyone repeats it endlessly. Its basically useless advice no matter how many people repeat it. What if the head leads you into totally the wrong position? Then what?

"Lead with the head" can go into the same stupid cliche box as "don't run on a misfield" and "never hit against the spin".

@alexevo94 post a vid mate and I'll actually give you some useful advice.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Kez on April 24, 2019, 03:42:33 PM
Obviously their is more to it than “lead with your head”...

To compare it to don’t run on a midfield is total rubbish though.
Yes it need greater clarification but so does “the bat is the problem it’s missing the ball” (captain obvious)

And if we are going simple... base, weight transfer and bat path. Job done.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Big Mac on April 24, 2019, 04:09:22 PM
Christ, "Lead with your head" is such a tired old cliché. Pietersen (good batsman, but clearly not a coach) said it once on sky sports and now everyone repeats it endlessly. Its basically useless advice no matter how many people repeat it. What if the head leads you into totally the wrong position? Then what?

"Lead with the head" can go into the same stupid cliche box as "don't run on a misfield" and "never hit against the spin".

@alexevo94 post a vid mate and I'll actually give you some useful advice.

Getting your eyes in line with the ball early and trying to get your head over the ball doesn't get you into totally the wrong position, which is kind of the point.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 04:26:18 PM
Getting your eyes in line with the ball early and trying to get your head over the ball doesn't get you into totally the wrong position, which is kind of the point.

On the contrary, an over-riding obsession with getting the head in line with the ball leads to the exact vulnerability to late inswing/inseam that OP describes. Its actually more likely that he is leading TOO STRONGLY with the head, and getting it outside the (post-deviation) line of the ball.  Telling him to lead even more with his head is only going to make the problem worse.

The key to playing swing is to avoid overcommitting to playing a particular line, but instead using smaller movements to get into a more balanced adaptable position, where you can access the ball whether it moves in or away, and then trust in your hands to instinctively adjust to any late movement.

I've been coaching a group of teenagers this winter this exact thing using tennis balls half covered in tape and throwing them at them at 70mph with random swing directions. Teaching them to use small movements, stay relaxed, and trust their hands has improved their skills considerably - if I had said "lead with your head", they'd still be getting clean bowled every ball.

Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 04:30:42 PM
Obviously their is more to it than “lead with your head”...

To compare it to don’t run on a midfield is total rubbish though.
Yes it need greater clarification but so does “the bat is the problem it’s missing the ball” (captain obvious)

And if we are going simple... base, weight transfer and bat path. Job done.

You say that, but no-one else mentioned the bat, did they. Everyone was banging on about the position of the foot, the head, everything except the one thing that really matters - the bat. The one thing worse than stating the obvious is missing the obvious.

Now you mention it, "Weight transfer" is another tired old cliché that needs to be put out to pasture permanently. Meaningless pseudoscience. It doesn't even make the slightest bit of sense.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Cys1 on April 24, 2019, 05:43:57 PM
Cliche? From the person who just used ‘trust your hands’
I’d not be that quick to judge if I were you.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 24, 2019, 06:03:15 PM
Christ, "Lead with your head" is such a tired old cliché. Pietersen (good batsman, but clearly not a coach) said it once on sky sports and now everyone repeats it endlessly. Its basically useless advice no matter how many people repeat it. What if the head leads you into totally the wrong position? Then what?

"Lead with the head" can go into the same stupid cliche box as "don't run on a misfield" and "never hit against the spin".

@alexevo94 post a vid mate and I'll actually give you some useful advice.

Douglas Jardine wrote it in the 1940s.

It is the best and most successful coaching method. But happy for you to tell me it won't work.

In this case it absolutely works. From 5 year olds to 85 year olds.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 24, 2019, 06:10:10 PM
On the contrary, an over-riding obsession with getting the head in line with the ball leads to the exact vulnerability to late inswing/inseam that OP describes. Its actually more likely that he is leading TOO STRONGLY with the head, and getting it outside the (post-deviation) line of the ball.  Telling him to lead even more with his head is only going to make the problem worse.

The key to playing swing is to avoid overcommitting to playing a particular line, but instead using smaller movements to get into a more balanced adaptable position, where you can access the ball whether it moves in or away, and then trust in your hands to instinctively adjust to any late movement.

I've been coaching a group of teenagers this winter this exact thing using tennis balls half covered in tape and throwing them at them at 70mph with random swing directions. Teaching them to use small movements, stay relaxed, and trust their hands has improved their skills considerably - if I had said "lead with your head", they'd still be getting clean bowled every ball.
I couldn't disagree with this more.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on April 24, 2019, 06:20:42 PM
Buzz talks a lot of sense about cricket.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 06:23:05 PM
I couldn't disagree with this more.

Excellent! Praise indeed from you.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Kez on April 24, 2019, 06:25:29 PM
Agreed bat path is the key. But can’t have a good bat path if you body is aligning you incorrectly.

Pseudoscience or just using simple terms to explain something complex. Some idiots call things tent pegs and charge lots of money for the privilege. Call things what you want, they may not scientifically be totally accurate but if it gets the point across it doesn’t matter.

And at no point has anyone said to over commit with the head movement, which of course will cause other issues.

There is also many different ways to skin a cat... Gayle, Sehwag, Cook, ABdV, Buttler. All great players but each have a different methods. End of the day it’s a simple game that we make very difficult
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 06:40:18 PM
Agreed bat path is the key. But can’t have a good bat path if you body is aligning you incorrectly.

Pseudoscience or just using simple terms to explain something complex. Some idiots call things tent pegs and charge lots of money for the privilege. Call things what you want, they may not scientifically be totally accurate but if it gets the point across it doesn’t matter.

And at no point has anyone said to over commit with the head movement, which of course will cause other issues.

There is also many different ways to skin a cat... Gayle, Sehwag, Cook, ABdV, Buttler. All great players but each have a different methods. End of the day it’s a simple game that we make very difficult

If you don't understand the science, you can't coach. You're just left to resorting to repeating clichés that you read in a book written by some other idiot with no actual understanding either. I collect coaching manuals going back to 1890, and 90% of them just repeat the same old incorrect and unhelpful clichés. Say what you like about ponty, and he and I have had disagreements in the past, but at least he makes the effort to try to understand the science.

Bottom line is, of all you understand about coaching is a bunch of sayings that you have read in coaching books or heard other coaches saying, then you don't know anything at all.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 24, 2019, 06:59:25 PM
If you instinctively adjust to the line of a swinging ball you will knick off. It is only a matter of time. You meed to be able to hold your shape.
But that is a different thread to planting your front foot.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Cys1 on April 24, 2019, 07:36:11 PM
It would be very naive to think that so many successful players and coaches would mention this cliche’ without there being any truth to it.
But let’s just have a look to see if this does have any science to it.
Lead with your head is a simplified way to convey the idea that for best results when playing off the front foot your body needs to aligned with the ball. It’s not a wholly accurate description of everything that needs to happen when playing off the front foot but it covers most parts which makes it an ideal term to use for the majority of cricketer who do not have the opportunity to get good 1:1 coaching.  The secret is that you need your body to move towards the line of the ball and leave you in a position make contact with the ball and play an attacking or defensive stroke that should ideally not get you out. You would then be looking to transfer Force from your bat to the ball as optimally as possible. Based on sound physics principles we know that Force is linked to Mass ( Weight ) and therefore weight transfer ( another cliche ) into the line of the ball is essential to maximize the Force imparted onto the ball on contact with the bat. This would be rather difficult to with your head leaning backwards and hence the expression lead with your head.

I think that you would find a lot of science at the heart of many of these cliche’s. They are all just simplified and palatable ways of trying to convey more complex principles.

Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Cys1 on April 24, 2019, 07:50:46 PM
Having read the above again I can understand why people rather stick to “lead with your head”
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Seniorplayer on April 24, 2019, 07:57:19 PM
On the contrary, an over-riding obsession with getting the head in line with the ball leads to the exact vulnerability to late inswing/inseam that OP describes. Its actually more likely that he is leading TOO STRONGLY with the head, and getting it outside the (post-deviation) line of the ball.  Telling him to lead even more with his head is only going to make the problem worse.

The key to playing swing is to avoid overcommitting to playing a particular line, but instead using smaller movements to get into a more balanced adaptable position, where you can access the ball whether it moves in or away, and then trust in your hands to instinctively adjust to any late movement.

I've been coaching a group of teenagers this winter this exact thing using tennis balls half covered in tape and throwing them at them at 70mph with random swing directions. Teaching them to use small movements, stay relaxed, and trust their hands has improved their skills considerably - if I had said "lead with your head", they'd still be getting clean bowled every ball.
Trust your hands to adjust to late movement is following the ball a sure way of getting a nick behind
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Kez on April 24, 2019, 08:06:00 PM
I’ll  take it SLA you are making wild generalisations rather than attacking me. And I guess you have multiple degrees and letters before and after you name that mean you know it all.

And Cys1 has put it quite nicely, coaching is about being able to transfer complex skills across in an easy digestible format for the learner. Which ultimately the means player doesn’t need to understand that they need to use a proximal to distal kinetic chain to achieve maximum exit velocity. But means if they have a have a stable base and rotate their trunk quickly and extend their arms during the pull shot it will travel off the bat quicker than before.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: edge on April 24, 2019, 08:31:49 PM
The key to playing swing is to avoid overcommitting to playing a particular line, but instead using smaller movements to get into a more balanced adaptable position, where you can access the ball whether it moves in or away, and then trust in your hands to instinctively adjust to any late movement.
Aka the Keaton Jennings method?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 08:50:34 PM
If you instinctively adjust to the line of a swinging ball you will knick off. It is only a matter of time. You meed to be able to hold your shape.
But that is a different thread to planting your front foot.

Complete rubbish. Of course you adjust to the line of a swinging ball, what else do you do, just proudly hold your pose as the ball smacks into off stump?

Honestly, you don't half talk some crap.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 08:52:55 PM
It would be very naive to think that so many successful players and coaches would mention this cliche’ without there being any truth to it.
But let’s just have a look to see if this does have any science to it.
Lead with your head is a simplified way to convey the idea that for best results when playing off the front foot your body needs to aligned with the ball. It’s not a wholly accurate description of everything that needs to happen when playing off the front foot but it covers most parts which makes it an ideal term to use for the majority of cricketer who do not have the opportunity to get good 1:1 coaching.  The secret is that you need your body to move towards the line of the ball and leave you in a position make contact with the ball and play an attacking or defensive stroke that should ideally not get you out. You would then be looking to transfer Force from your bat to the ball as optimally as possible. Based on sound physics principles we know that Force is linked to Mass ( Weight ) and therefore weight transfer ( another cliche ) into the line of the ball is essential to maximize the Force imparted onto the ball on contact with the bat. This would be rather difficult to with your head leaning backwards and hence the expression lead with your head.

I think that you would find a lot of science at the heart of many of these cliche’s. They are all just simplified and palatable ways of trying to convey more complex principles.

Scientifically speaking, this is complete gibberish. It's beyond wrong, it doesn't even make sense.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 08:54:24 PM
Aka the Keaton Jennings method?

No, pretty much the exact opposite. Keaton liked to hold a pose and hope for the best, kinda like buzz advocates.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 08:57:11 PM
I’ll  take it SLA you are making wild generalisations rather than attacking me. And I guess you have multiple degrees and letters before and after you name that mean you know it all.

And Cys1 has put it quite nicely, coaching is about being able to transfer complex skills across in an easy digestible format for the learner. Which ultimately the means player doesn’t need to understand that they need to use a proximal to distal kinetic chain to achieve maximum exit velocity. But means if they have a have a stable base and rotate their trunk quickly and extend their arms during the pull shot it will travel off the bat quicker than before.

Giving them advice that is completely wrong is not going to help. The player might not need to understand the science, but the coach sure as hell does. The level of understanding on this forum is... disheartening.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 24, 2019, 08:59:27 PM
No, pretty much the exact opposite. Keaton liked to hold a pose and hope for the best, kinda like buzz advocates.
Nope, Jennings over strides and is stiff and wafts his bat towards the ball with "an instinctive" hand movement.

Holding your shape is different.

Enough of the ranting though. Everyone has their own methods, if that works great.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 09:04:56 PM
Nope, Jennings over strides and is stiff and wafts his bat towards the ball with "an instinctive" hand movement.

Holding your shape is different.

Enough of the ranting though. Everyone has their own methods, if that works great.

Completely wrong. His problem is and always has been that he simply plays the line rather than proactively hitting the ball. Obviously this leaves him incredibly vulnerable to the slightest bit of lateral movement.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: DorsetDan on April 24, 2019, 09:06:50 PM
When is the SLA coached forum net for us plebs to learn the wise ways of science and the meaning of life?

@alexevo94 can you just modify your existing technique slightly to plant your foot to cow and swing your pro willow with fury like 99% of successful amateur cricketers/ forum members to just end this whole discussion :D "the problem is your bat. It keeps missing the ball" - SLA gem #1. Did that help at all? :D
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Batoff on April 24, 2019, 09:08:20 PM
The level of understanding on this forum is... disheartening.

Please do feel free to leave at any time...
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: NT50 on April 24, 2019, 09:12:42 PM
Honestly, you don't half talk some crap.

Pot, kettle, black.

Your superiority complex is embarrassing and strange.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 09:13:51 PM
Please do feel free to leave at any time...

Nah, I think it's important that someone calls out the bullshit bad advice and pseudoscienctific nonsense that is constantly peddled here.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Kez on April 24, 2019, 09:21:56 PM
When is the SLA coached forum net for us plebs to learn the wise ways of science and the meaning of life?

Don’t we all have to wear grey shorts and share gear to be invited?

Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: DorsetDan on April 24, 2019, 09:25:42 PM
Yep, sandals, Hawaiian shirts and club kit bag all around
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: jayralh on April 24, 2019, 09:26:27 PM
@SLA you should create your own blog where people can agree to whatever you say. And they can tolerate the way you talk. I never read a sensible topic from you since you joined.

You can say whatever to me but I had to tell you that.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 09:30:29 PM
It would be very naive to think that so many successful players and coaches would mention this cliche’ without there being any truth to it.
But let’s just have a look to see if this does have any science to it.
Lead with your head is a simplified way to convey the idea that for best results when playing off the front foot your body needs to aligned with the ball. It’s not a wholly accurate description of everything that needs to happen when playing off the front foot but it covers most parts which makes it an ideal term to use for the majority of cricketer who do not have the opportunity to get good 1:1 coaching.  The secret is that you need your body to move towards the line of the ball and leave you in a position make contact with the ball and play an attacking or defensive stroke that should ideally not get you out. You would then be looking to transfer Force from your bat to the ball as optimally as possible. Based on sound physics principles we know that Force is linked to Mass ( Weight ) and therefore weight transfer ( another cliche ) into the line of the ball is essential to maximize the Force imparted onto the ball on contact with the bat. This would be rather difficult to with your head leaning backwards and hence the expression lead with your head.

I think that you would find a lot of science at the heart of many of these cliche’s. They are all just simplified and palatable ways of trying to convey more complex principles.

You don't transfer your weight 'into the ball'. At best, you transfer your weight from one foot to the other. Nothing goes 'into the ball'. Any additional bat velocity generated is negligible. The most likely impact is that the last minute movement of your head leads to a poor connection.

There's a reason why baseball hitters are consistently able to hit the ball 150m without their weight moving onto the front foot. Try to explain this pseudoscienctific gibberish to a baseball coach and they'd think you were retarded.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 09:31:49 PM
Don’t we all have to wear grey shorts and share gear to be invited?

You wear whites to nets?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: goodarmcindy on April 24, 2019, 09:38:42 PM
I came into this thread because I too have this issue and a few seasons ago I was out nearly every week LBW playing around my front pad. The only thing I found that helped was to introduce a small trigger movement that saw my back foot point down the ground, which, I think through making me momentarily imbalanced, meant my front foot had to move to find a more natural position. It's certainly helped me play straighter better.

However, reading the whole thread has now seen me looking up baseball coaching techniques, and from what I can see (and what I already thought) isn't weight transfer fundamental to a baseball swing? Don't most batters transfer weight back in a load up phase before an explosive movement fires the weight forward? That weight might not move forward of the front leg, but it has to go somewhere, no?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Kez on April 24, 2019, 09:45:12 PM
But baseballs fly completely differently to a cricket ball due to the aerodynamics of the seam. Added to the fact the only hit full tosses means the balls travel further...

And the mechanics of a FF drive is totally different to that of a baseball swing...


Of course I don’t wear whites to nets... I was commenting on your magical T20 league where the best players turn up in shorts
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: DorsetDan on April 24, 2019, 09:45:44 PM
So how do baseball players hit a ball miles? Just by standing still and generating bat acceleration in to the ball with the hands? Of course they don't teach about loading, launching and following through... of course a golf swing is all in the hands and that is how pros approach the game. Nothing to do with the hips/ legs/ body. Absolutely not.

I'm off to chastise myself for biting yet again
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 09:50:45 PM
I came into this thread because I too have this issue and a few seasons ago I was out nearly every week LBW playing around my front pad. The only thing I found that helped was to introduce a small trigger movement that saw my back foot point down the ground, which, I think through making me momentarily imbalanced, meant my front foot had to move to find a more natural position. It's certainly helped me play straighter better.

However, reading the whole thread has now seen me looking up baseball coaching techniques, and from what I can see (and what I already thought) isn't weight transfer fundamental to a baseball swing? Don't most batters transfer weight back in a load up phase before an explosive movement fires the weight forward? That weight might not move forward of the front leg, but it has to go somewhere, no?

Google 'rotational mechanics'. There is little to no linear weight transfer involved in a baseball hit. It's all about the 'proximal to distal kinetic chain' as Kez would put it, or 'hips, arms, wrists' as we always teach our hitters.

Ironically, there was once a thing called 'linear mechanics' that was taught to kids, but it was (No Swearing Please). No pro hitter ever hit like this. It was debunked and abandoned 20 years ago.

It would be great if we could debunk and abandon similarly wrong ideas in cricket, like leading with the head or transferring your weight into the ball, but as you can see from this thread, people are incredibly irrationally attached to them.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 09:51:55 PM
But baseballs fly completely differently to a cricket ball due to the aerodynamics of the seam. Added to the fact the only hit full tosses means the balls travel further...

And the mechanics of a FF drive is totally different to that of a baseball swing...


Of course I don’t wear whites to nets... I was commenting on your magical T20 league where the best players turn up in shorts

Lol, what. No they don't. You're really out of you're depth now.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 09:54:16 PM
So how do baseball players hit a ball miles? Just by standing still and generating bat acceleration in to the ball with the hands? Of course they don't teach about loading, launching and following through... of course a golf swing is all in the hands and that is how pros approach the game. Nothing to do with the hips/ legs/ body. Absolutely not.

I'm off to chastise myself for biting yet again

Neither baseball nor golf involve linear weight transfer.

I mean, geez, feel free to argue about cricket but are you really going to argue with me about baseball too? Ever heard of dunning kruger syndrome?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: jonny77 on April 24, 2019, 10:07:58 PM
I love it when everyone gets along. Such great use of a forum to talk to everyone like they're idiots and they know nothing. It really makes me feel like listening to that person and feel lucky to have the opportunity to learn and expand my tiny little brain. Think England are looking for a coach soon SLA  :D
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 10:13:34 PM
I love it when everyone gets along. Such great use of a forum to talk to everyone like they're idiots and they know nothing. It really makes me feel like listening to that person and feel lucky to have the opportunity to learn and expand my tiny little brain. Think England are looking for a coach soon SLA  :D

International cricketers shouldn't require advice on biomechanics.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: DorsetDan on April 24, 2019, 10:27:03 PM
No one was talking about linear weight transfer but just for funsies... force equal, force on to back foot, force on to front foot. You can call it “just transferring weight from one foot to the other” but that is the definition of linear weight transfer in to the ball :)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JY4RhGd6bjs

Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 10:33:06 PM
No one was talking about linear weight transfer but just for funsies... force equal, force on to back foot, force on to front foot. You can call it “just transferring weight from one foot to the other” but that is the definition of linear weight transfer in to the ball :)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JY4RhGd6bjs


Errr.. No its not.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: DorsetDan on April 24, 2019, 10:37:45 PM
Centre of mass moves from back foot to front foot during the swing and you don’t call that a transfer of weight? Interesting. Have a great night
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Cys1 on April 24, 2019, 10:37:57 PM
Wow, your coaching sessions must last for days! Possibly why it took the whole winter to teach some kids to maintain balance with the high tech method of using the taped up tennis ball.
I always thought that the purpose of good coaching is to eventually not have to coach at all and to get people to be able to identify and rectify mistakes during match situations.
Whatever is good for your business I suppose?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 10:42:17 PM
Centre of mass moves from back foot to front foot during the swing and you don’t call that a transfer of weight? Interesting. Have a great night

No, I don't call it a linear transfer, because its not, its rotational. Do you even understand that term? Why the (No Swearing Please) are you arguing with me about this when you clearly don't know what you're talking about?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 24, 2019, 10:46:08 PM
Wow, your coaching sessions must last for days! Possibly why it took the whole winter to teach some kids to maintain balance with the high tech method of using the taped up tennis ball.
I always thought that the purpose of good coaching is to eventually not have to coach at all and to get people to be able to identify and rectify mistakes during match situations.
Whatever is good for your business I suppose?

What a rather sad selection of random off-target insults.

Rather than dragging form the level of the conversation, why don't you respond to the discussion about basic physics? If you're out of your depth, there no shame in just admitting that and apologising.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: edge on April 24, 2019, 10:55:34 PM
SLA you must be a politician of some kind with the way you answer a different question to the one anyone asks. First you turn a conversation on LBW problems into one about weight transfer, then when anyone engages with that you change the question to whether it's linear vs rotational. It's almost like you're not interested in the actual topic and just want an argument! Apropos of nothing, what is your opinion on Jimmy Anderson's bowling in overseas conditions?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: DorsetDan on April 24, 2019, 11:00:25 PM
Apologies to the OP for taking the bait. I hope the LBW problems gets fixed and you can make full use of those tasty bats you have 👍
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Psi on April 24, 2019, 11:42:50 PM
Not really an expert on this, and I definitely don't want to join the slanging match, but I found it quite difficult to 'lead with the head' at first. Only when someone suggested leading with the left shoulder going down and the head naturally following over the ball did I manage to get properly balanced on the drive shots. But I'm still not great at following a fast swinging ball unless I've somehow picked the delivery right from the bowler's hand.

Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Cholrudee on April 25, 2019, 03:08:32 AM
Deep breaths InternalTraining  :)
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 06:22:18 AM
SLA you must be a politician of some kind with the way you answer a different question to the one anyone asks. First you turn a conversation on LBW problems into one about weight transfer, then when anyone engages with that you change the question to whether it's linear vs rotational. It's almost like you're not interested in the actual topic and just want an argument! Apropos of nothing, what is your opinion on Jimmy Anderson's bowling in overseas conditions?

On the contrary, buzz recommended leading with the head (bad advice likely to make the problem worse), Kez first brought up weight transfer, and then goodarmcindy asked a question about baseball that I was happy to answer. It's not me changing the topic.

If you're going to resort to your preferred personal insult approach, at least get it vaguely accurate, eh?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: enlightened on April 25, 2019, 06:22:45 AM
Winchester anyone?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 06:27:22 AM
Not really an expert on this, and I definitely don't want to join the slanging match, but I found it quite difficult to 'lead with the head' at first. Only when someone suggested leading with the left shoulder going down and the head naturally following over the ball did I manage to get properly balanced on the drive shots. But I'm still not great at following a fast swinging ball unless I've somehow picked the delivery right from the bowler's hand.
Pointing the front shoulder at the ball as you move into your address position is a useful rule of thumb for aligning the bat path, yes.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 25, 2019, 06:28:06 AM
This thread reminds me of going to my local golf range.
The coach there has lots of people queuing up for lessons. And they come back every week. It is a great business.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: edge on April 25, 2019, 06:32:26 AM
On the contrary, buzz recommended leading with the head (bad advice likely to make the problem worse), Kez first brought up weight transfer, and then goodarmcindy asked a question about baseball that I was happy to answer. It's not me changing the topic.

If you're going to resort to your preferred personal insult approach, at least get it vaguely accurate, eh?
Further illustrating the point really - exactly where did I insult you (or anyone else for that matter) personally? 🤔
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 25, 2019, 06:34:47 AM
Pointing the front shoulder at the ball as you move into your address position is a useful rule of thumb for aligning the bat path, yes.
Very little difference between this and leading with your head. In fact the principle is the same.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Kez on April 25, 2019, 06:38:56 AM
Very little difference between this and leading with your head. In fact the principle is the same.

Exactly what I was just thinking... just a slightly different way of saying it...
Like it was said around 4 pages ago, use whatever terms/ language work for you/ your players.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Psi on April 25, 2019, 06:45:11 AM
Yes exactly. Good coaches find key phrases that work for particular players. This might mean highlighting something that's not strictly in the science, but enables the best mechanics to happen in the background. But I do wonder if other people had difficulty in leading with the head rather than pointing with the shoulder.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 07:13:31 AM
Further illustrating the point really - exactly where did I insult you (or anyone else for that matter) personally? 🤔

Apart from the bit where you accused me of being a dissembling politician? You gonna play innocent now?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 07:15:58 AM
Very little difference between this and leading with your head. In fact the principle is the same.

Nope. Completely different. Competent Batsmen don't lead with their heads, they do point their front shoulder. Leading is not pointing, shoulders are not heads.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 07:17:43 AM
Exactly what I was just thinking... just a slightly different way of saying it...
Like it was said around 4 pages ago, use whatever terms/ language work for you/ your players.

It's not though, it's totally different. Leading with the head is terrible, unscientific advice. Pointing the shoulder AS you are moving is entirely different.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: strang on April 25, 2019, 07:18:45 AM
Mental to come back to this thread after just 24hrs and about 25 posts of fighting.
The thing I am going to take from all this is...
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 25, 2019, 07:24:00 AM
I would love to know how you can lean into a shot with your shoulder but leaving your head behind.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 07:35:46 AM
I would love to know how you can lean into a shot with your shoulder but leaving your head behind.

That's a really daft comment that demonstrates nothing other than that your haven't actually read a single thing that has been explained to you.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: AJ2014 on April 25, 2019, 07:44:53 AM
My understanding is to play as late as possible, only on front foot if it's a full pitched,
other option is to stand way outside the crease,  only a very good keeper will dare to stand up
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Big Mac on April 25, 2019, 07:47:27 AM
I would love to know how you can lean into a shot with your shoulder but leaving your head behind.


(http://66.media.tumblr.com/a9c22ee6d35ed73caaed4cfb435430a7/tumblr_neu07hCdHM1qzk2apo6_500.gif)

Textbook batting technique there, pay close attention to the rotational transfer enabled by the hips.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: alexhilly1492 on April 25, 2019, 08:03:28 AM
That's a really daft comment that demonstrates nothing other than that your haven't actually read a single thing that has been explained to you.

please post a video of you leaning into a drive with your shoulder and your head remaining where is it.... its not possible
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 08:16:33 AM
please post a video of you leaning into a drive with your shoulder and your head remaining where is it.... its not possible

Hi Alex, I think you've made a typo, we were talking about "leading", not "leaning". Its a d, not an n.

You might lean into a shot with your shoulder (although don't overdo it) - but you do this AS you are moving your feet, not before you are moving your feet. Nothing should "lead" anything else - the front leg and upper body should move together. Leading with your head causes you to overbalance and lose control of your momentum at the vital moment, this is just as bad as the fatal error of only moving your foot and nothing else. Try to move forward whilst maintaining your balance and keeping your head and shoulders roughly level (whilst also aligning your shoulders with the position to expect to intercept the ball).


Looking back, its actually Buzz that made the initial mistake.

Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 25, 2019, 08:28:51 AM
I can't agree with the idea that nothing should lead anything else, that isn't how our bodies work.
But it is clear we aren't going to agree.

I will leave this with the simple point that the movement of the heaviest part of your body causes the rest of your body to move. This is a well established principle.

If your move your foot at the same time as your head you have to make a second movement to push your weight forward from your back foot. This is fine.

But when you get a surprise short ball you will not be able to move.

Mistake is an interesting choice of word, but given the topple method has been successfully coached for over 100 years I would suggest there must be something in it, despite your dislike for it.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: alexhilly1492 on April 25, 2019, 08:31:53 AM
Hi Alex, I think you've made a typo, we were talking about "leading", not "leaning". Its a d, not an n.

You might lean into a shot with your shoulder (although don't overdo it) - but you do this AS you are moving your feet, not before you are moving your feet. Nothing should "lead" anything else - the front leg and upper body should move together. Leading with your head causes you to overbalance and lose control of your momentum at the vital moment, this is just as bad as the fatal error of only moving your foot and nothing else. Try to move forward whilst maintaining your balance and keeping your head and shoulders roughly level (whilst also aligning your shoulders with the position to expect to intercept the ball).


Looking back, its actually Buzz that made the initial mistake.

i disagree with this on a personal level as (as a few people on here will be able to confirm) i have a large issue where i back away from the ball, unless i really concentrate on leading (and leaning) and getting my head towards the ball, if im concentrating on that, my head goes first, followed by my feet (to stop me falling over) and then my shoulders and arm/bat come through the line almost simultaneously)

if im playing a clip off my legs again its effectively a straight bat shot, head toward ball, foot follows, arms and bat through the line, wrist "break" on impact to guide ball to leg.

off side, head first, feet follow, arms and bat through ball

back foot shots, head toward line of ball, feet follow arms and bat come through.

when i dont concentrate on getting my head to the ball it my feet both go to leg, head leans back wild swing and miss
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Big Mac on April 25, 2019, 08:32:48 AM
I will leave this with the simple point that the movement of the heaviest part of your body causes the rest of your body to move. This is a well established principle.

Hang on, am I messing up by not leading with my belly?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on April 25, 2019, 08:34:03 AM
@alexevo94 if you can get past the pages of pointless opinions by someone that believes they are gods gift to cricket and the coaching world I have a couple of tips that really helped me 3 seasons ago when I was having the same problem (8 of my 10 dismissals that season were LBW)

Firstly i opened my stance a little so i was slightly more front on and i moved my guard from 2 (middle and leg) to leg stump. I very side on before this but I found my front pad was not going down the wicket more across and over.

Secondly ensure your left eye, assuming your a Rh bat is looking down the line of your shoulder, this will aid with the bat path coming to meet the ball at a straighter angle and in your back light have bat straight, ie not high up angled towards 2nd or 3rd slip.

Third a very small trigger movement back and across leading with the back foot but keeping your weight going forward to meet the ball.

I found these really helped and I didn’t find i needed lots of coaches using words or phrases from text books or made up ones. I just found something that worked for me. Finally enjoy batting, so much of our troubles in in our minds and we obsess over the perfect shot or technique.
Good luck with it mate
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 08:43:11 AM
I can't agree with the idea that nothing should lead anything else, that isn't how our bodies work.
But it is clear we aren't going to agree.

I will leave this with the simple point that the movement of the heaviest part of your body causes the rest of your body to move. This is a well established principle.

If your move your foot at the same time as your head you have to make a second movement to push your weight forward from your back foot. This is fine.

But when you get a surprise short ball you will not be able to move.

Mistake is an interesting choice of word, but given the topple method has been successfully coached for over 100 years I would suggest there must be something in it, despite your dislike for it.

"I can't agree with the idea that nothing should lead anything else, that isn't how our bodies work."

I've no idea where you get these nonsensical ideas. Clearly its not a science textbook of any  sort. Normal people are perfectly capable of moving multiple body parts simultaneously, and there is nothing unusual or difficult about performing a lateral movement of centre of mass without leading with the head.

"the movement of the heaviest part of your body causes the rest of your body to move. This is a well established principle. "

The head isn't the heaviest part of your body though, this is just rampant nonsense. If your head is heavier than your leg, you have serious medical issues. and before you try to justify this nonsense with "oh well so and so said this", I can assure you I know that this myth is oft-repeated. Its still wrong.

"If your move your foot at the same time as your head you have to make a second movement to push your weight forward from your back foot."

No you don't. Again, I have no idea where you got this idea from. If you move your front leg/foot and upper body simultaneously, then your COM is also moving by definition. No second movement is necessary.

"But when you get a surprise short ball you will not be able to move. "

Why would you have moved at all before picking the length? We're talking about moving forward to address a full delivery, not pre-delivery movements. What on earth are you coaching? How is it possible that you're this confused about something so simple.

"the topple method has been successfully coached for over 100 years"

We thought the earth was flat for over 1000 years, it was still bullshit.


I would really recommend you put a moratorium on your coaching activities until you've taken the time to grasp some of the basic physical principles of biomechanics. If you're teaching this nonsense to students, you're doing them a serious disservice.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Big Mac on April 25, 2019, 08:45:32 AM
@alexevo94 if you can get past the pages of pointless opinions by someone that believes they are gods gift to cricket and the coaching world I have a couple of tips that really helped me 3 seasons ago when I was having the same problem (8 of my 10 dismissals that season were LBW)

Firstly i opened my stance a little so i was slightly more front on and i moved my guard from 2 (middle and leg) to leg stump. I very side on before this but I found my front pad was not going down the wicket more across and over.

Secondly ensure your left eye, assuming your a Rh bat is looking down the line of your shoulder, this will aid with the bat path coming to meet the ball at a straighter angle and in your back light have bat straight, ie not high up angled towards 2nd or 3rd slip.

Third a very small trigger movement back and across leading with the back foot but keeping your weight going forward to meet the ball.

I found these really helped and I didn’t find i needed lots of coaches using words or phrases from text books or made up ones. I just found something that worked for me. Finally enjoy batting, so much of our troubles in in our minds and we obsess over the perfect shot or technique.
Good luck with it mate

Yep, this is more or less what I did (Minus the trigger movement) and it worked pretty well.

Absolutely agree with forgetting about trying to get a perfect technique and just finding one that is right for you even if it looks different from everyone else.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 08:46:17 AM
i disagree with this on a personal level as (as a few people on here will be able to confirm) i have a large issue where i back away from the ball, unless i really concentrate on leading (and leaning) and getting my head towards the ball, if im concentrating on that, my head goes first, followed by my feet (to stop me falling over) and then my shoulders and arm/bat come through the line almost simultaneously)

if im playing a clip off my legs again its effectively a straight bat shot, head toward ball, foot follows, arms and bat through the line, wrist "break" on impact to guide ball to leg.

off side, head first, feet follow, arms and bat through ball

back foot shots, head toward line of ball, feet follow arms and bat come through.

when i dont concentrate on getting my head to the ball it my feet both go to leg, head leans back wild swing and miss


There are degrees of bad technique. Changing from no technique at all (backing away from the ball, wild swing with head in the air) to poor technique may lead to a small improvement in outcome, but it doesn't stop it being bad technique and bad advice.

You'd be better off getting some actual coaching advice from a competent coach.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 08:48:47 AM
@

Secondly ensure your left eye, assuming your a Rh bat is looking down the line of your shoulder, this will aid with the bat path coming to meet the ball at a straighter angle and in your back light have bat straight, ie not high up angled towards 2nd or 3rd slip.


Minor quibble, but surely this depends on the batsman's dominant eye?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on April 25, 2019, 08:54:16 AM
I would love to know how you can lean into a shot with your shoulder but leaving your head behind.

Perhaps it's like "wobble seam"?
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: HellomynameisJ on April 25, 2019, 09:13:39 AM
A few practical ideas that don't involve completely overhauling your technique. In the interest of forum self preservation I must stress that these are just things I adhere to and help me, but they might help you.

1. Hit Balls, as many as you can. When everybody else goes in for a beverage after training, grab a mate and hit another 50 balls.

2. Watch videos. Monkey see monkey do, I think its extremely overlooked in coaching at club level, and you don't need a professional film crew or to even watch footage of yourself. Get on YouTube and watch videos of the pros, slow motion replays, I always went to videos of Mike Hussey. Just watch and identify what they do well.

3. Keep your head/eyes level. Whether you lead with it or not, if your eyes aren't level and your head isn't still, it's going to be hard to hit a moving target consistently.

4. Don't stress too much, you'll find a way. Simply you might just be over aware and over correcting. Trust your process, if it worked in the past it can work again. I think it was Matt Renshaw who had a shocking run of form that saw him lose his test spot because he couldn't buy a run in shield cricket, but was told to sing a song in his head while he was facing up, essentially clearing all the conflicting messages in his mind and letting the countless hours in the nets and muscle memory do their job.

Anywho, all the best.
There are lots of good points on this thread and some not so good ones, back yourself, trust your process and don't forget to enjoy it.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: alexhilly1492 on April 25, 2019, 09:22:10 AM

There are degrees of bad technique. Changing from no technique at all (backing away from the ball, wild swing with head in the air) to poor technique may lead to a small improvement in outcome, but it doesn't stop it being bad technique and bad advice.

You'd be better off getting some actual coaching advice from a competent coach.

i have and he concurred with @Buzz this lead to me having my best season last year
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: enlightened on April 25, 2019, 09:28:05 AM
Best way to not end up overthinking every shot you attempt to play? Don't read this thread. You don't need perfect technique to score runs … look at Steve Smith!

Whether it's leaning or leading, weight shift or rotation (eh!) just try to keep your head still, play the ball under your head if possible (straight deliveries only obviously) and have your momentum moving towards the ball. Practice in the nets until you find what works for you (a trigger movement may help) and unless you have any aspirations to play at county level ignore the rest.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 25, 2019, 09:37:13 AM
Minor quibble, but surely this depends on the batsman's dominant eye?

I am a big fan of leading eye discussions, my leading eye is my right eye and I line up my eyes with my helmet visor to get a similar outcome to Chris, whose leading eye is, I guess, his left eye.

I have a theory (totally disproved in a highly scientific poll on here) that your leading eye should be your outside eye. But that has been discussed previously !!
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 09:44:45 AM
I am a big fan of leading eye discussions, my leading eye is my right eye and I line up my eyes with my helmet visor to get a similar outcome to Chris, whose leading eye is, I guess, his left eye.

I have a theory (totally disproved in a highly scientific poll on here) that your leading eye should be your outside eye. But that has been discussed previously !!

Most people have a dominant eye just as most people have a dominant hand, this has nothing to do with cricket and isn't something you can change.

I'm not aware of any particular advantage or disadvantage associated with the inside or outside eye being the dominant eye - although you can quite spot that outside eye dominant batsmen tend to have slightly more open stances (top half, at least) and they have to bring their head around more to get a good view of the ball.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 09:55:48 AM
just try to keep your head still, play the ball under your head if possible (straight deliveries only obviously) and have your momentum moving towards the ball.

There are plenty of examples of shots where your "momentum" (ie movement of your COM) doesn't move towards the ball. Pretty much any backfoot cover drive to a spinner is played whist COM is moving towards the leg side, lots of hook shots are played with COM moving towards the offside, cuts and bf drives to pace bowlers are often played with COM moving vertically upwards (often the batsman jumps in the air) and a wide variety of shots, for example sweeps, dabs and some drives, are played with no significant movement of the COM at the moment of contact (and hence no "momentum") at all.

Whenever there is movement of the COM towards the ball through contact, it tends to be a coincidence rather than a factor in bat speed or connection quality.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: enlightened on April 25, 2019, 10:20:02 AM
There are plenty of examples of shots where your "momentum" (ie movement of your COM) doesn't move towards the ball. Pretty much any backfoot cover drive to a spinner is played whist COM is moving towards the leg side, lots of hook shots are played with COM moving towards the offside, cuts and bf drives to pace bowlers are often played with COM moving vertically upwards (often the batsman jumps in the air) and a wide variety of shots, for example sweeps, dabs and some drives, are played with no significant movement of the COM at the moment of contact (and hence no "momentum") at all.

Whenever there is movement of the COM towards the ball through contact, it tends to be a coincidence rather than a factor in bat speed or connection quality.

Yes … I know that. But the OP is planting his foot and getting caught lbw and so I assume the ball is straight and of good to full length in which case you would be unlikely to be playing a cut, a hook or a back foot drive. Thought you might have sussed that yourself.

I didn't mention bat speed or connection quality - getting your momentum moving towards the ball is more about getting yourself in the right position, not necessarily about how hard you hit it.

Anyway - I've given my advice based upon my experience and it makes a lot more sense to me than anything you have posted.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 10:29:33 AM
Yes … I know that. But the OP is planting his foot and getting caught lbw and so I assume the ball is straight and of good to full length in which case you would be unlikely to be playing a cut, a hook or a back foot drive. Thought you might have sussed that yourself.

Anyway - I've given my advice based upon my experience and it makes a lot more sense to me than anything you have posted.

Right, but even with a drive, its not actually necessary or particularly beneficial to shift your COM as you hit the ball. There are plenty of examples of batsmen who have their body weight forward and over on their front foot before the ball arrives and then simply hit the ball from a stable base purely with their upper body.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: enlightened on April 25, 2019, 10:37:54 AM
Right, but even with a drive, its not actually necessary or particularly beneficial to shift your COM as you hit the ball. There are plenty of examples of batsmen who have their body weight forward and over on their front foot before the ball arrives and then simply hit the ball from a stable base purely with their upper body.

That's because they have already got into position. I give up - I'm out of here. Your obstinacy must be almost as legendary as your coaching.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: SLA on April 25, 2019, 10:53:43 AM
That's because they have already got into position. I give up - I'm out of here. Your obstinacy must be almost as legendary as your coaching.

I think perhaps you're just using the term "momentum" incorrectly. It might make sense to you, but if it doesn't make sense to anyone else its not much use.
Title: Re: Planting my front foot
Post by: Buzz on April 25, 2019, 11:45:26 AM
Going to stop the conversation for now as I think there is plenty for the poster to think about.
And a load of other waffle.