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General Cricket => Latest Matches => Topic started by: alexhilly1492 on July 17, 2019, 08:28:14 AM

Title: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 17, 2019, 08:28:14 AM
with the world cup over, we can move out focus to some proper cricket!

first test vs ireland and then an ashes series.

as discussed in the lions thread could be an experimental england side which id be wary of!

would like to see as many first choice as possible (minus w/c and niggles) and would go something like this:

Burns
Sibley
.......
Root
S Curran
Foakes
Ali
.......
Leach
Wood
Broad


Sam Curran at five i know will be mocked but i think he will one day be a batting all rounder such as watson. he clearly has the talent with the bat and against ireland why not give him the opportunity.

Ashes squad to be something like:

Burns
Sibley
Roy
Root
Bairstow
Buttler
Stokes
S curran
Leach
Archer
Anderson/Broad

Broad/Anderson
Wood
Vince
Foakes

I know we wont pick 15 but they're who i expect to be in squads
I dont like Vince in there but the selectors do

announcement for Ireland is apparently this afternoon so we'll see
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on July 17, 2019, 08:40:29 AM
For Ireland I'd expect

Roy
Burns
Foakes +
Root
Stokes
Bairstow
Buttler
Ali
Woakes
Broad
Archer

For the ashes Id like to see:

Burns
Roy
Foakes
Root
Stokes
Bairstow
Buttler
Archer
Broad
Anderson
Leach
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 17, 2019, 09:35:51 AM
Woakes just had one hell of a world cup, if he doesnt at least get in the Ashes squad you'd say he has been hard done by.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 17, 2019, 09:39:12 AM
Woakes just had one hell of a world cup, if he doesnt at least get in the Ashes squad you'd say he has been hard done by.


forgot about him... swap woakes for S Curran!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: richthekeeper on July 17, 2019, 09:42:41 AM
Woakes ahead of Broad for me
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 17, 2019, 09:56:00 AM

forgot about him... swap woakes for S Curran!

Personally if they play on a pitch like the last ODI, why would you even take a spinner. Take a full on seam attack, Root can chuck some pies down if needed.

Burns
Sibley
Roy
Root
Bairstow
Stokes
Buttler
S Curran
Woakes
Archer
Anderson

On drinks: Leach, Vince, Ballance, Broad.

Although Broad almost definitely will play and i bet Ballance gets yet another go
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 17, 2019, 10:20:45 AM
It feels like forever since we've had test cricket!, Excuse my ignorance but where exactly do Broad and Anderson sit in the pecking order these days from an English supporters point of view? With Woakes having sensational world cup and Archer touted as the next big thing, where do the old lads fit in?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 17, 2019, 10:24:23 AM
anderson plays, broad is a back up
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: KettonJake on July 17, 2019, 10:54:32 AM
I'm there for day 1 against Ireland.

I won't be as quick as others to write Broad off.

However if Ballance plays test cricket again I may take up baseball.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 17, 2019, 12:27:09 PM
I'm there for day 1 against Ireland.

I won't be as quick as others to write Broad off.

However if Ballance plays test cricket again I may take up baseball.

i certainly think broad has a place but he seems to be the most likely to be left out, based on what selectors have done previously.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 17, 2019, 12:28:04 PM
I agree with the first part Jake, can't write Broad off yet. The Aussie attack worries me but we've got some great options and real pace, which we maybe haven't had for a while.

The real issue is our top three. Burns for me deserves a go, then maybe Sibley and Roy 3? Not convinced with any of that though!

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 17, 2019, 01:22:40 PM
Err, not quite what we were expecting

England squad for Ireland Test: Joe Root (c), Moeen Ali, James Anderson, Jonny Bairstow (wk), Stuart Broad, Rory Burns, Sam Curran, Joe Denly, Lewis Gregory, Jack Leach, Jason Roy, Olly Stone, Chris Woakes.

England squad for pre-Ashes camp: Joe Root (c), Moeen Ali, Jimmy Anderson, Jonny Bairstow (wk), Stuart Broad, Rory Burns, Jos Buttler (wk), Sam Curran, Joe Denly, Lewis Gregory, Jack Leach, Jason Roy, Ben Stokes, Olly Stone, Chris Woakes, Mark Wood.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: JTtaylor145 on July 17, 2019, 01:34:16 PM
I was going to query Joe Denly's selection but then I see he averages 56 in the Championship this season. The squad looks a little bit light on batting to me. I would have liked to have seen Northeast or Sibley given an opportunity.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 17, 2019, 01:51:50 PM
Olly Stone, really...........
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 17, 2019, 01:55:42 PM
Also nice to see them taking 2 spinners into the squad seeing as the ball didnt turn at all on Sunday. Well selected
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 17, 2019, 02:35:29 PM
Joe Root (c) - ok
 Moeen Ali - needs to perform
James Anderson - wont play
Jonny Bairstow (wk) - ok
Stuart Broad - ok, needs ot perform but proven test bowler
Rory Burns - desperately needs runs
Sam Curran - ok
Joe Denly - ok, in decent form for kent needs a few still
Lewis Gregory - deserves a chance, not sure hes quite test level, arguably better white ball
Jack Leach - must play
Jason Roy - ok
Olly Stone - not sure about this hasnt played a lot
Chris Woakes - ok
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 17, 2019, 02:38:27 PM
Jos Buttler (wk) - ok
Ben Stokes - ok
Mark Wood - ok

Can add archer after a rest to these three for the ashes

Burns and roy will need runs, sibley can be considered harsh done by, for me he deserved a run out against Ireland and an ashes start. I think the selection was between him and denly, denly is in possession and averaging 56 in champo this year so he got the nod. If he struggles sibley to come in and open roy to 3

all in all not bad but not exciting, we could just as easily get rolled as smash them, should be an exciting series - im not confident at all though
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 17, 2019, 02:51:04 PM
Joe Root (c) - ok
 Moeen Ali - needs to perform
James Anderson - wont play
Jonny Bairstow (wk) - ok
Stuart Broad - ok, needs ot perform but proven test bowler
Rory Burns - desperately needs runs
Sam Curran - ok
Joe Denly - ok, in decent form for kent needs a few still
Lewis Gregory - deserves a chance, not sure hes quite test level, arguably better white ball
Jack Leach - must play
Jason Roy - ok
Olly Stone - not sure about this hasnt played a lot
Chris Woakes - ok

Seems like theyll use Lewis Gregory like a watered down version of Ben stokes, hope he gets a good go though. Very good player
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 17, 2019, 06:19:41 PM
Its a somewhat odd squad - aside from anything else, they have no option but to play six bowlers in the Ireland game.  In addition, I'm not sure what benefit Bairstow playing gives (he's played as much cricket as Jos and Stokes, and Foakes could have done with the run out).

On the other hand, it resolves that Roy will play in the Ashes, and that Jennings won't.  It also implies that Somerset have done something to annoy the ECB bigwigs!

I suspect Anderson will sit out, along with one of Woakes and Gregory. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 17, 2019, 06:36:25 PM
Canít remember who opened with burns last match it wasnít Jennings I donít think.
Looking at the squad Roy must be opening and unless Iím missing something Denly is playing and batting 3 just ahead of Root.

But I may of missed something obvious
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 17, 2019, 07:57:24 PM
Canít remember who opened with burns last match it wasnít Jennings I donít think.
Looking at the squad Roy must be opening and unless Iím missing something Denly is playing and batting 3 just ahead of Root.

But I may of missed something obvious

It was Jennings.
He was dropped for the Test before and Denly opened, then he got recalled and Denly moved down to number three.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on July 17, 2019, 08:45:28 PM
Weird squad that. Woakes to fill the glaring hole at 5?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Buzz on July 17, 2019, 08:50:02 PM
The assumption is that Woakes Curran and Mo will play to beef up the batting.
Jason is going to open with Rory.

To be honest the top three are going to have to be massively on it as Tim Murtagh will be a huge handful.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 17, 2019, 09:37:51 PM
Weird squad that. Woakes to fill the glaring hole at 5?

Curran at 5?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: golders on July 18, 2019, 03:03:51 PM

I don't like that squad at all. Only 5 Specialist batsmen and lots of bits and pieces
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 18, 2019, 04:40:50 PM
Sibley has got to feel gutted really.

The Ireland squad only having 5 batters is because of the resting of players. Do you then just pick someone on a false basis to play 1 game? Or see if someone like Curran or Woakes can bat higher up?

13 picked.... Is Anderson actually fit to play? Mo, Woakes and Curran have to play to bulk out the batting. Broad will play. So that leaves 2 from Gregory, Leach and Stone.

If Anderson isn't fit -
Burns
Roy
Denly
Root
Bairstow
Mo
Woakes
Curran
Gregory / Stone
Broad
Leach
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 18, 2019, 04:59:31 PM
Given that Burns, Roy and Denly are not shoe ins, yes, you give someone the chance. Sibley, Rhodes, Malan, Northeast, Stoneman, whoever. Or you take Foakes. He batted 3 in the Lions game for a reason...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on July 18, 2019, 05:15:36 PM
Howís this Virdi guy ? Seems decent spinner.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 18, 2019, 05:32:53 PM
Given that Burns, Roy and Denly are not shoe ins, yes, you give someone the chance. Sibley, Rhodes, Malan, Northeast, Stoneman, whoever. Or you take Foakes. He batted 3 in the Lions game for a reason...

And then bat them at 6 though? Because with Roy and Denly playing the powers that be have obviously given them 1st crack at the top spots. Then Root and Bairstow bat 4 and 5.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 18, 2019, 08:34:30 PM
Agree with others we seem a batsman short, at least one. Denly 3 and could well have an Ashes spot. Experienced player at 3 with two young batsmen seems a good idea.. Don't subscribe that after 30 there's no place in the side.

For what it's worth I think Malan should be around the side this summer, but I would play Foakes and Bairstow as a specialist bat.

That won't happen thou, I reckon we are still no closer finding the best young batsmen not in the team.

We won't find out against Ireland but be interested to see what the forum view is.

I think

Sibley
Livingstone
Clarke
Hameed
Lawrence

But is one of them so much better than the other

Seems a bunch who are good but nothing outstanding.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: golders on July 18, 2019, 08:53:38 PM
Still think Hildreth massively hard done by, been so consistent over the years.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 18, 2019, 09:19:47 PM
And then bat them at 6 though? Because with Roy and Denly playing the powers that be have obviously given them 1st crack at the top spots. Then Root and Bairstow bat 4 and 5.

Well, if the alternative is Sam Curran at 5 or 6?

Ideally no. Maybe Root moves down one or Roy bat's five, depends who you go for. But... Go for someone, bacause we won't play six bowlers in the Ashes, and it'd be better to look at someone who might fill that gap. Even if the first test side is fixed, you don't know what will happen, so give the next cab a bit of experience.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 18, 2019, 09:22:43 PM
Agree with others we seem a batsman short, at least one. Denly 3 and could well have an Ashes spot. Experienced player at 3 with two young batsmen seems a good idea.. Don't subscribe that after 30 there's no place in the side.

For what it's worth I think Malan should be around the side this summer, but I would play Foakes and Bairstow as a specialist bat.

That won't happen thou, I reckon we are still no closer finding the best young batsmen not in the team.

We won't find out against Ireland but be interested to see what the forum view is.

I think

Sibley
Livingstone
Clarke
Hameed
Lawrence

But is one of them so much better than the other

Seems a bunch who are good but nothing outstanding.

Could be any of Stoneman, Lyth, Robson, Gubbins, Bracey, Ballance, Malan, Brown, Westley, Lawrence, Northeast, DBD, Crawley, Clarke, TKC, Duckett, Hameed, Livingstone, Davies, Banton, Sibley, Rhodes, Hain...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on July 18, 2019, 09:47:06 PM
I want to believe in Hameed, but it just doesnít seem to be happening. Indeed it may not happen until he changes county/dumps his dad as coach.

I still think Malan deserves another couple of chances. Mind you, Iím still touting this mental Ashes XI:

Roy
Bairstow
Woakes
Root
Malan
Stokes
Foakes
Ali
Rashid
Archer
Anderson
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 18, 2019, 09:54:39 PM
I want to believe in Hameed, but it just doesnít seem to be happening. Indeed it may not happen until he changes county/dumps his dad as coach.

I still think Malan deserves another couple of chances. Mind you, Iím still touting this mental Ashes XI:

Roy
Bairstow
Woakes
Root
Malan
Stokes
Foakes
Ali
Rashid
Archer
Anderson

Roy and Bairstow opening with Woakes at 3, that's mental enough...but only two quicks plus Stokes and two spinners?? Even more mental! Not even got to no Butler yet!  :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on July 18, 2019, 10:18:06 PM
Well, if the alternative is Sam Curran at 5 or 6?

Ideally no. Maybe Root moves down one or Roy bat's five, depends who you go for. But... Go for someone, bacause we won't play six bowlers in the Ashes, and it'd be better to look at someone who might fill that gap. Even if the first test side is fixed, you don't know what will happen, so give the next cab a bit of experience.
Curran (or Woakes) at 6 makes some sense, because that's potentially only one Stokes injury away anyway, but having no number 5 bat and giving Lewis Gregory a random game instead of testing out the next batsman in is bizarre. Can't see how we're not going to call up another batsman at some stage in the Ashes, so given the chance it's daft not to give Sibley (or whoever) a run out first.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Komdotkom on July 19, 2019, 01:21:41 AM
For the Ashes, England has to play Anderson and Woakes along with anyone who can move the ball in the air. The limp wristed and spineless Australian top/middle order are absolutely useless when the ball is doing a bit, and will fold like a deck of cards. England could bat reverse order and still be fine, you'd only be chasing 30.
I predict another series whitewash, and I'm Australian. On fairly flat bouncy wickets in Australia it might be different, but our blokes just don't have the patience, concentration or balls to tough it out and wait for the conditions to suit them.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on July 19, 2019, 07:37:20 AM
Roy and Bairstow opening with Woakes at 3, that's mental enough...but only two quicks plus Stokes and two spinners?? Even more mental! Not even got to no Butler yet!  :D

Not as mental as you may think.

Cricket is partly a mental game, Bairstow and Roy are simple souls, just let them keep doing what they are doing

With no other obvious candidate, everyone keeps saying what a great batting technique Woakes has, let him do it

2 quicks with both Stokes and Woakes in support, lessens the workload on both of the previously mentioned

2 spinners will play on Australiaís arrogance/aggression

Butler is unlucky, but he will take over from Morgan soon and will have World Cups and T20 World Cups to plan for, let him concentrate on that
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 19, 2019, 08:03:36 AM
Not as mental as you may think.

Cricket is partly a mental game, Bairstow and Roy are simple souls, just let them keep doing what they are doing

With no other obvious candidate, everyone keeps saying what a great batting technique Woakes has, let him do it

2 quicks with both Stokes and Woakes in support, lessens the workload on both of the previously mentioned

2 spinners will play on Australiaís arrogance/aggression

Butler is unlucky, but he will take over from Morgan soon and will have World Cups and T20 World Cups to plan for, let him concentrate on that

Sorry, missed Woakes as a bowler as got perplexed by him being at 3!  :D

Big ask to have him at 3 still for me mate but each to their own. A decent technique for a number 7/8 doesn't make him a top 3, especially following Roy and Bairstow. Also think the Aussies would rather see Foakes coming to the crease than Butler. Although I can see your thinking, it's not for me.

 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 19, 2019, 11:41:08 AM
For the Ashes, England has to play Anderson and Woakes along with anyone who can move the ball in the air. The limp wristed and spineless Australian top/middle order are absolutely useless when the ball is doing a bit, and will fold like a deck of cards. England could bat reverse order and still be fine, you'd only be chasing 30.
I predict another series whitewash, and I'm Australian. On fairly flat bouncy wickets in Australia it might be different, but our blokes just don't have the patience, concentration or balls to tough it out and wait for the conditions to suit them.

That's pretty scathing haha! But is England really any stronger? Personally I can't see this being anything other than a great series, both sides have massive question marks in my opinion. Both sides have their stars and both their unknowns.

As much as you can look into the A series, they haven't lost a game, the bats are making good runs, the reserve bowlers are doing their job. Add to that the most prevalent run scorer in county cricket is Australian, I feel like our stocks are reasonably healthy.

I honestly think it will be one or the more competitive series we have seen in a while.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: billyb on July 19, 2019, 01:33:19 PM
I think Australia have a good chance of winning the series. Don't underestimate them.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: JTtaylor145 on July 19, 2019, 02:31:01 PM
I think the series will follow the trend of the last few...

Closer series at home for England vs Australis (the 3-0 scoreline flattered us previously)

Absolute whopping when Australia play at home against England. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on July 19, 2019, 04:43:52 PM
Sorry, missed Woakes as a bowler as got perplexed by him being at 3!  :D

Big ask to have him at 3 still for me mate but each to their own. A decent technique for a number 7/8 doesn't make him a top 3, especially following Roy and Bairstow. Also think the Aussies would rather see Foakes coming to the crease than Butler. Although I can see your thinking, it's not for me.

Thatís why they wonít let me be a selector- they donít share my radical vision!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 19, 2019, 05:49:41 PM
Surprised there are such low expectations of the Aussie side. England donít have the dominance in tests we have in one daters

Look at both bowling attacks over 5 matches and you might see a close series

Starc, hazlewood,Lyon and Cummins if they can all stay on the park and fit could do well in our conditions.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 19, 2019, 06:28:59 PM
I am really interested to see what the pitches are going to be like for the Ashes. When you consider what we got for the World Cup (although I realise that was an ICC event).

But we have never ever played an Ashes series this late ie. Starting in August. You have to go back to 2005 for anything close and they started on 21st July.

There has been a lot of cricket on these pitches.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 20, 2019, 12:12:19 AM
Surprised there are such low expectations of the Aussie side. England donít have the dominance in tests we have in one daters

Look at both bowling attacks over 5 matches and you might see a close series

Starc, hazlewood,Lyon and Cummins if they can all stay on the park and fit could do well in our conditions.

I'm not even sure Hazelwood will get a game, he has struggled in the A tour games and something tells me they will go with Pattinson's county experience and ability with the bat.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 20, 2019, 09:33:40 AM
I'm not even sure Hazelwood will get a game, he has struggled in the A tour games and something tells me they will go with Pattinson's county experience and ability with the bat.

Might they even learn from last time and use Siddle?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 20, 2019, 02:45:42 PM
This is going to be such an interesting match. Paine says it's not a test shoot out but it sure looks like it to me.

https://www.cricket.com.au/news/australia-ashes-tour-match-australia-a-brad-haddin-xii-graeme-hick-xii-tim-paine-travis-head/2019-07-20?mode=amp (https://www.cricket.com.au/news/australia-ashes-tour-match-australia-a-brad-haddin-xii-graeme-hick-xii-tim-paine-travis-head/2019-07-20?mode=amp)

Teams are below -

Hick XII: Joe Burns, Cameron Bancroft, Steve Smith, Peter Handscomb, Matthew Wade, Mitchell Marsh, Tim Paine (c, wk), Michael Neser, James Pattinson, Jackson Bird, Chris Tremain, Nathan Lyon

Haddin XII: David Warner, Marcus Harris, Kurtis Patterson, Travis Head (c), Marnus Labuschagne, Will Pucovski, Alex Carey (wk), Pat Cummins, Mitch Starc, Peter Siddle, Josh Hazlewood, Jon Holland.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 20, 2019, 04:50:02 PM
If itís an ashes shootout for the Aussies, seems bizarre that Siddle is ahead of Pattinson in the pecking order.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 20, 2019, 04:50:54 PM
Might they even learn from last time and use Siddle?
Doubt Siddle will cause any concerns to England bowling at 78mph
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 20, 2019, 06:37:16 PM
Doubt Siddle will cause any concerns to England bowling at 78mph

You've seen England's top order bat, right?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on July 21, 2019, 09:36:16 AM
Doubt Siddle will cause any concerns to England bowling at 78mph

Darren Stevens ....
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Komdotkom on July 21, 2019, 11:04:31 PM
This is going to be such an interesting match. Paine says it's not a test shoot out but it sure looks like it to me.

https://www.cricket.com.au/news/australia-ashes-tour-match-australia-a-brad-haddin-xii-graeme-hick-xii-tim-paine-travis-head/2019-07-20?mode=amp (https://www.cricket.com.au/news/australia-ashes-tour-match-australia-a-brad-haddin-xii-graeme-hick-xii-tim-paine-travis-head/2019-07-20?mode=amp)

Teams are below -

Hick XII: Joe Burns, Cameron Bancroft, Steve Smith, Peter Handscomb, Matthew Wade, Mitchell Marsh, Tim Paine (c, wk), Michael Neser, James Pattinson, Jackson Bird, Chris Tremain, Nathan Lyon

Haddin XII: David Warner, Marcus Harris, Kurtis Patterson, Travis Head (c), Marnus Labuschagne, Will Pucovski, Alex Carey (wk), Pat Cummins, Mitch Starc, Peter Siddle, Josh Hazlewood, Jon Holland.

Seems a bit one sided to me, the Haddin XII has all the batsmen. The Hick team is 3 out all out with Smith, Wade and Paine the only three that know one end of a bat from the other. Should be interesting to see how it unfolds, I really like this as a warm up to the Ashes.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: sgcricket on July 22, 2019, 01:43:42 AM
Teams look evenly matched to me. Should be a good hard game. Want to see Wade back in the team.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 22, 2019, 06:59:46 AM
It is such an interesting way to warm up for an Ashes series. Have an 'A' Tour, which isn't really an 'A' Tour and is basically masquerading as the players that aren't playing in the World Cup getting time in the middle against the red Duke ball.

Then play a 1 off selection game against each other so you can control everything that happens rather than some crappy 3 day warm up against a  county 2nd XI.

When you think about the preparation we got in Australia this is ridiculous.

This Austrailian team I think are going to be one of the best prepared sides for a long long time.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: cricketbadger on July 22, 2019, 08:54:20 PM
Think it's a great idea and use of the time over here. All building towards a very interesting series I'm sure. Can see it going either way
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Buzz on July 23, 2019, 09:37:09 AM
Jimmy out for the game against Ireland. Probably rested as a precaution.
Means Broad will almost certainly play.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on July 23, 2019, 09:59:27 AM
Likely debuts for Stone and Gregory then? Batting order should be interesting, be like a club side with all the allrounders.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 23, 2019, 10:58:24 AM
Likely debuts for Stone and Gregory then? Batting order should be interesting, be like a club side with all the allrounders.

  :o

First innings batting order: Burns, Roy, Denly, Root, Bairstow, Curran, Woakes, Ali, Gregory, Broad, Leach

Second innings, Well, Moeen got runs and Joe D played a poor shot, plus Woaksey wants to pop away on time so: Burns, Roy, Woakes, Root, Ali, Bairstow, Denly, Curran, Leach, Gregory, Broad.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on July 23, 2019, 12:18:39 PM
I am not sure why Australia would come in with low expectations to this series.  They look a better batting unit than England, particularly when England have no one established in any of the positions 1-3.  Obviously Australia's weakness against the moving ball and on pitches that you can't leave on length on will balance out the advantage but Austalia still look stronger.

Bowling wise, things should be very different to the last series in Australia.  I couldn't comprehend England picking a load of medium fast seamers who were cannon fodder in Australian conditions whilst Wood, Plunkett and Rashid who had the pace bounce and turn to be a genuine threat only played in the one day series.  England look like having a much more balanced attach this time round, although the fitness if Wood and of Archer is a blow.

From an Australian perspective, they haven't looked the same as a unit since Newlands.  When you see both the amount of reverse swing they got, and how early in the innings they got it I have no doubt that they cheated with the ball throughout that series.  Will be a big test for them.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 23, 2019, 12:42:23 PM
Australia currently playing against themselves and likely Test starters Warner, Harris, Head and Patterson all got out to English type seamers like Bird and Neser.

If thereís a fraction of movement Australia will struggle to score 200 in an innings. Despite Englandís mishmash top 3, weíll still hammer Australia
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 23, 2019, 01:43:47 PM
England team named.  Gregory and Anderson miss out, Roy and Stone debut and Leach plays! 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 23, 2019, 02:38:22 PM
Australia currently playing against themselves and likely Test starters Warner, Harris, Head and Patterson all got out to English type seamers like Bird and Neser.

If thereís a fraction of movement Australia will struggle to score 200 in an innings. Despite Englandís mishmash top 3, weíll still hammer Australia

I still fail to see how England are going to fare any better? They have just as many question marks. Who's to say 200 won't be enough?

Both teams have good bowling lineups, I would say Australia probably have more depth in the reserves and the huge advantage of a world class spinner. Whereas England have the advantage of Ben Stokes as an all-round option.

Batting wise it's anyone's guess, but Australia on paper have a more experienced top order whereas englands middle order is stronger, but from what I've seen Australias tail is seemingly more competent than englands. Honestly I could go back and forth all day, but the reality is that it's unlikely to be as simple as one team "hammering" another.



Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 23, 2019, 02:44:37 PM
Early prediction 2-1 England

Wins at edgbaston and OT for England

Lose at lord's

Lucky draw at headingly

Oval draw
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 23, 2019, 02:45:11 PM
Australia currently playing against themselves and likely Test starters Warner, Harris, Head and Patterson all got out to English type seamers like Bird and Neser.

If thereís a fraction of movement Australia will struggle to score 200 in an innings. Despite Englandís mishmash top 3, weíll still hammer Australia

I hope you're right but I can't agree. The Aussies still have some class in their batting, so they'll not all fail and a few could prove themselves. Don't forget they've still got Smith too!

Our batting has been suspect to say the least in recent times, so we could easily have a few collapses.

Bowling wise I'd make us pretty even tbh, so it's anyone's series for me.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 23, 2019, 03:29:08 PM
I reckon it could be a rerun of the last series over here, and indeed the recent South Africa series, with five results and no real close games. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on July 23, 2019, 04:33:35 PM
I reckon it could be a rerun of the last series over here, and indeed the recent South Africa series, with five results and no real close games.

This.. both sides are inconsistent and average. Itíll just be 5 one sided games and almost just dumb luck which way it goes.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on July 23, 2019, 04:46:37 PM
I don't know what's going to happen. I shall watch and listen keenly.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on July 23, 2019, 04:57:56 PM
Either the Aussies can't bat, or they have insanely good bowlers... or both?

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/1195367/game/1169648/brad-haddin-xii-vs-graeme-hick-xii-tour-match- (https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/1195367/game/1169648/brad-haddin-xii-vs-graeme-hick-xii-tour-match-)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 23, 2019, 08:11:55 PM
What pitches are expected for the ashes?

Iíd imagine the groundsmen across the country are being told to flood the squares to avoid any chance of reverse swing
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: cricketbadger on July 23, 2019, 09:08:48 PM
Imagine performing like Gregory has all year for Somerset, only to be overlooked by a guy who's barely played all season or taken any wickets. Only England could justify that selection
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 23, 2019, 09:26:43 PM
Imagine performing like Gregory has all year for Somerset, only to be overlooked by a guy who's barely played all season or taken any wickets. Only England could justify that selection

By that standard, Gregory has much less grounds for complaint than Jamie Porter, Ben Coad, Bunny Onions and Chris Rushworth over the last few years...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: cricketbadger on July 23, 2019, 09:33:43 PM
Correct yes, the list could go on of names who deserve a crack ahead of Stone in my opinion
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 23, 2019, 10:56:47 PM
Correct yes, the list could go on of names who deserve a crack ahead of Stone in my opinion

though the counter argument would be that Stone has a great average and crucially strike rate in first class cricket, and gets it down at 90mph...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 07:42:05 AM
After seeing some of the highlights of the Aussie vs Aussie match itís quite clear theyíve got plenty of high class bowlers. Obviously Starc, Cummins, Hazlewood and Pattinson are top tier. But the likes of Neser, Bird and Siddle can clearly cause mayhem with a duke ball.

Their batting looks woeful. Steven Smith will find away to score runs as heís the best test batsman of his generation. The rest are more hitters and will be easy meat.

Even in Anderson isnít around for Birmingham, I still canít see Australia getting close.

England 3-0, two tests could be affected by rain with this incredible heat likely to cause thunderstorms.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 07:44:50 AM
I still fail to see how England are going to fare any better? They have just as many question marks. Who's to say 200 won't be enough?

Both teams have good bowling lineups, I would say Australia probably have more depth in the reserves and the huge advantage of a world class spinner. Whereas England have the advantage of Ben Stokes as an all-round option.

Batting wise it's anyone's guess, but Australia on paper have a more experienced top order whereas englands middle order is stronger, but from what I've seen Australias tail is seemingly more competent than englands. Honestly I could go back and forth all day, but the reality is that it's unlikely to be as simple as one team "hammering" another.
Englandís wheelhouse is 4-9 - Root, Buttler, Stokes, Bairstow, Ali and Woakes/Curran. The top three might be rubbish but if they can blunt the Aussie quick, the rest can express themselves
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 24, 2019, 10:06:52 AM
To anyone watching it - are England playing with names & numbers on their shirts, or is that being saved for the Ashes?

Edit - the BBC live text has just answered for me

Quote
Stephan Shemilt
BBC Sport at Lord's

If you're wondering where the names and numbers on the backs of shirts are, they won't be introduced until the Ashes, which is the first series in the ICC Test Championship.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 24, 2019, 10:13:33 AM
The problem when you select a white ball slogger for tests.

Could've been out the over before too
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 10:14:15 AM
Roy made to look like a fool by dibbly dobbers
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 10:15:29 AM
ok i know how fickle we are and before i start following the score im gnna say this...

lets back the lads, there are debutantes who are gonna be nervous and those playing for places..

if Roy fails that doesn't mean he isn't good enough..

if stone goes wicket-less same thing

and lets face it Murtagh at lords is no easy task even for country batsmen!

COME ON ENGLAND
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 10:16:39 AM
oh for crying out loud.. sorry Jason you can blame me for that....
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 24, 2019, 10:27:36 AM
ok i know how fickle we are and before i start following the score im gnna say this...

lets back the lads, there are debutantes who are gonna be nervous and those playing for places..

if Roy fails that doesn't mean he isn't good enough..

When Roy fails it will go to prove a bloke who hardly plays first class cricket (and when he does it's as a middle order batsman) isn't the answer in a search for a Test opener...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 10:45:45 AM
although i think your correct.. I'd have picked Sibley personally, that still doesn't mean Roy isn't good enough.

I think he should be at 5 if anywhere but we're that clogged there.

We still need to back him rather than just criticise all the time..

he certainly didn't throw his wicket away to day, Murtagh got him out at least
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 10:46:17 AM
36-2 Denly plays all around a straight one. Maiden test wicket for the rather impressive Adair
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 10:52:45 AM
This is all very English!

good bowling from Ireland though!

Mo at 6 looks even more risky at 3 down early
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 24, 2019, 10:53:06 AM
England are 36-3, the summer has officially arrived!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Tom_90 on July 24, 2019, 10:56:55 AM
I have no idea how Rory Burns has been successful with that technique. Watching him makes my eyes bleed
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:02:15 AM
42-4 Root gone for 2
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 24, 2019, 11:05:50 AM
Englandís wheelhouse is 4-9 - Root, Buttler, Stokes, Bairstow, Ali and Woakes/Curran. The top three might be rubbish but if they can blunt the Aussie quick, the rest can express themselves

It's not just the quicks to worry about though, Nathan Lyon is as important to that lineup as any of the quicks, arguably more-so.

Looks like a few members of that wheelhouse will get a good look today..

Go Ireland  ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:05:56 AM
The standard of umpiring is really pathetic these days. Root was as plumb as youíll ever see and the umpire didnít give it. The ball was hitting half way up middle. Maybe umpires should be axed and all decisions are done by DRS
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:06:26 AM
It's not just the quicks to worry about though, Nathan Lyon is as important to that lineup as any of the quicks, arguably more-so.

Looks like a few members of that wheelhouse will get a good look today..

Go Ireland  ;)
Quick game on the cards here...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on July 24, 2019, 11:07:24 AM
I'm really not surprised by this. Serious questions need to be asked before the ashes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 24, 2019, 11:07:29 AM
This is pathetic
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 24, 2019, 11:07:53 AM
At 42-4 I can't think of a less reassuring sight than Moeen coming in to bat...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:07:55 AM
42-5 Bairstow stupid as ever
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 24, 2019, 11:09:28 AM
Murtagh causing havoc. We got loads of bowlers thou!!  ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on July 24, 2019, 11:10:52 AM
This is embarrassing and pathetic, No7 in within 75mins on the 1st day.

Australia preparation is by far better than ours.

As I type this woakes given out
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:11:27 AM
42-6 Sir Woakes duck
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on July 24, 2019, 11:11:58 AM
Woakes now gone
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on July 24, 2019, 11:12:46 AM
Balls barley moving.. at 75-80 mph.


This is utterly pathetic. Please can people stop bigging these payers up.. theyíre awful when it comes to test cricket
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 24, 2019, 11:13:05 AM
The standard of umpiring is really pathetic these days. Root was as plumb as youíll ever see and the umpire didnít give it. The ball was hitting half way up middle. Maybe umpires should be axed and all decisions are done by DRS

I actually thought there were two noises when watching it live. Can only think the umpire thought this too.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 24, 2019, 11:15:33 AM
Hahahaha.

Aussies will white wash is. If we play like this!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:16:53 AM
I actually thought there were two noises when watching it live. Can only think the umpire thought this too.
But a good umpire should be able to spot this. The modern day umpire is essentially overly reliant on DRS making the correct call. Thatís not good enough
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 24, 2019, 11:16:58 AM
Guess we know why itís only a 4 day test now!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 24, 2019, 11:19:33 AM
Guess we know why itís only a 4 day test now!

Yeah but those with tickets for day 2 might be worried

Can we please have some batsmen in the squad.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on July 24, 2019, 11:19:42 AM
The hapless and pathetic Ali now gone for 0 as well.

If I had paid for this I would be livid and actually going to stop watching as finding it so embarrassing
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:19:56 AM
43-7 Moeen duck. 5-11 Murtagh well bowl old chap
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 24, 2019, 11:22:21 AM
Australia currently playing against themselves and likely Test starters Warner, Harris, Head and Patterson all got out to English type seamers like Bird and Neser.

If thereís a fraction of movement Australia will struggle to score 200 in an innings. Despite Englandís mishmash top 3, weíll still hammer Australia

Are you rethinking this now mate?  :D

Our top order hasn't looked settled for sometime, so this although much worse than expected isn't something which was out of the realms of possibly prior to the test. You've also got top give Murtagh some credit, he's bowled good areas.

What odds on none of the 5 Ashes test going into a 5th day?!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 11:22:52 AM
This is getting really hard to support and keep supporting!

Same mistakes from experienced players is a joke!!!

Moeen should be no where near international cricket with his current form!!

Let's hope this is typical England and we are (No Swearing Please) first game then very good after that!!

2 day test???
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 24, 2019, 11:25:24 AM
Stokes and Buttler obviously not playing but I'm sure most people's expectations have been adjusted slightly
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 24, 2019, 11:25:57 AM
England's best batsman is in. Curran to get some here
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:26:12 AM
Are you rethinking this now mate?  :D

Our top order hasn't looked settled for sometime, so this although much worse than expected isn't something which was out of the realms of possibly prior to the test. You've also got top give Murtagh some credit, he's bowled good areas.

What odds on none of the 5 Ashes test going into a 5th day?!
Slightly concerned by this horror show tbh.  :o
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on July 24, 2019, 11:26:36 AM
Serves us right for only giving Ireland a 4 day test this.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:33:51 AM
Serves us right for only giving Ireland a 4 day test this.
They might only need 2 days to polish us off at this rate  :(
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on July 24, 2019, 11:35:18 AM
GOod to see even the pros struggle with the bane of every club cricketerís existence - slow (by their standards), accurate, swing bowling.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 24, 2019, 11:46:41 AM
Broad gone
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:47:04 AM
58-8 Broad gone to Big Boyd Rankin. Curran gonna have go good some for us to reach 100
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 24, 2019, 11:47:13 AM
I have been listening to TMS and seen the majority of the dismissals on the BBC website.

Firstly i will say that Tim Murtagh is one of the finest exponents of bowling at Lords.

However, there are some absolutely atrocious and embarrassing shots there.

Roy - that's a good ball to get early doors on debut that he has to play at, my worry is that he is really pushing at the ball with his hands which isn't the way to go opening up. But he is going to be opening in the Ashes so we have to back him all the way.
Burns - why is he playing at that!! is it that technique? as a LH he has to be better than that at knowing where his stumps are!
Bairstow - it's getting a bit ridiculous how many times he's getting done through the gate with a red ball!
Denly - looked like he was done for pace, which doesn't bode well at all!
Root - Caught on the crease, his footwork is usually far far better than that.
Ali - A bit tentative but it's a good ball going up the hill
Woakes - at least he was trying to get forwards and do the right thing

I know we should never be in this position be should Root have actually been bowling anyway? when you consider the side we have picked and who we are playing against?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 24, 2019, 11:48:43 AM
Boyd Rankin now has the same number of Test wickets playing against England as he took for England.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:49:58 AM
I have been listening to TMS and seen the majority of the dismissals on the BBC website.

Firstly i will say that Tim Murtagh is one of the finest exponents of bowling at Lords.

However, there are some absolutely atrocious and embarrassing shots there.

Roy - that's a good ball to get early doors on debut that he has to play at, my worry is that he is really pushing at the ball with his hands which isn't the way to go opening up. But he is going to be opening in the Ashes so we have to back him all the way.
Burns - why is he playing at that!! is it that technique? as a LH he has to be better than that at knowing where his stumps are!
Bairstow - it's getting a bit ridiculous how many times he's getting done through the gate with a red ball!
Denly - looked like he was done for pace, which doesn't bode well at all!
Root - Caught on the crease, his footwork is usually far far better than that.
Ali - A bit tentative but it's a good ball going up the hill
Woakes - at least he was trying to get forwards and do the right thing

I know we should never be in this position be should Root have actually been bowling anyway? when you consider the side we have picked and who we are playing against?
You canít pick two spinners then field first.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 11:59:27 AM
67-9 Curran out for 18
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 12:03:37 PM
Get Stone up the order! Free flowing from the big lad
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 12:10:49 PM
85 all out

Whats the odds were facing a 250 run deficit and lost by an innings and 50?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 24, 2019, 12:13:52 PM
I am tired of us being undone by old dibbly dobbler crap. Will we ever learn?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 12:14:12 PM
85 all out
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 12:16:21 PM
85 all out

Whats the odds were facing a 250 run deficit and lost by an innings and 50?
Irelandís best chance is if Stirling hammers a rapid fire 50
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 24, 2019, 12:17:49 PM
You canít pick two spinners then field first.

But that then raises another question doesn't it.

Naming the side the  early on the day before and then playing 2 spinners on a pitch like this.

Should Gregory have played instead of Leach?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 12:24:30 PM

Should Gregory have played instead of Leach?

no

Should Gregory have played instead of Moeen.... Definitely
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on July 24, 2019, 12:31:01 PM
I am tired of us being undone by old dibbly dobbler crap. Will we ever learn?

It is very hard to learn such lessons. Don't forget the excitement factor: no body likes to prepare for boring and slow "dibbly dobbler".

All this tells me that international cricketers are not special and a good club cricketer could undo their arrogance. :D Fitness could be a problem though.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 24, 2019, 12:37:39 PM
no

Should Gregory have played instead of Moeen.... Definitely

ah yes..... fair point!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 12:46:04 PM
Whenís the notion that Moeenís Ďan all rounderí stop? Moeenís averaging 22 with the bat since 2017. Heís no more than a tailender.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 12:52:21 PM
Whenís the notion that Moeenís Ďan all rounderí stop? Moeenís averaging 22 with the bat since 2017. Heís no more than a tailender.

about 12 months ago
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Chompy9760 on July 24, 2019, 12:54:34 PM
Well, if it's any consolation, the Aus batsmen aren't fairing much better with their internal match.  17 wickets for 201 runs at the end of the first day! 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: A-Swing-And-A-Miss on July 24, 2019, 01:11:05 PM
So the England bowlers watched Ireland dismantle us by bowling good to full length on 4th stump line and have responded by bowling back of a length or a 7th stump line... Just doesn't make sense.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 01:23:19 PM
We need to make someone else Test captain as itís clearly hurting Rootís batting. Unlike Kohli, Smith(not anymore) and Williamson all three average more as captain - whereas Rootís average is 20% lower than as a non captain
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 24, 2019, 02:14:09 PM
We need to make someone else Test captain as itís clearly hurting Rootís batting. Unlike Kohli, Smith(not anymore) and Williamson all three average more as captain - whereas Rootís average is 20% lower than as a non captain

Glad someone has said this, thanks Iíve been like a broken record
We need roots runs far far more
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 02:16:03 PM
So the England bowlers watched Ireland dismantle us by bowling good to full length on 4th stump line and have responded by bowling back of a length or a 7th stump line... Just doesn't make sense.

That's England for the past decade!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 02:16:24 PM
46-2 Sam Curran with both. Curran should've taken the new ball tbh. Woakes and Broad wasted it bowling far too short.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on July 24, 2019, 02:20:58 PM
We have successfully prepared a wicket here to play to the strength of the opposition bowling attack.  Pick an attack with oave bounce and spin then prepare a deck for 75mph dobblers
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on July 24, 2019, 02:30:01 PM
That catch right there is why Johnny bairstow should not be our keeper and if he refuses to bat 3 he shouldn't be in the side. Tit.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 02:33:00 PM
That catch right there is why Johnny bairstow should not be our keeper and if he refuses to bat 3 he shouldn't be in the side. Tit.
You'll get Jonny all upset and sulky with that kinda criticism  :o
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 02:37:44 PM
You'll get Jonny all upset and sulky with that kinda criticism  :o

Problem? that may sort his issue of being bowled driving recklessly!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 24, 2019, 02:37:53 PM
Another drop
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 24, 2019, 02:37:57 PM
And root letís one through his legs.....
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on July 24, 2019, 02:39:44 PM
This truly is pathetic
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 02:39:57 PM
Shocking drop by Root, it's like it was a forgone conclusion that we'd just batter the Irish
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: A-Swing-And-A-Miss on July 24, 2019, 02:40:18 PM
You'll get Jonny all upset and sulky with that kinda criticism  :o

I think he needs someone to go after him to make him a bit more determined to actually perform.

Another drop off Broad, this time Root. You wouldn't guess that Ireland were the new team to Test cricket if you judged the slip catching...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 24, 2019, 02:42:19 PM
you know one of the worse things about these drops is the fact that everyone will start saying the Broad..... 'bowled really well, and had 2 drops, and didn't get what he deserved' etc.... etc....

Not talking about the absolute tripe he threw down wasting the new ball!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 02:53:04 PM
Ireland making it look far too easy 100-2. Leach leaking runs offering no control
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 03:11:38 PM
127-2 at Tea. Balbarnie 51*. If the Irish keep up this run rate their lead could be nearly 200 by stumps - lead already up to 42
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 03:54:45 PM
138-5 Broad got Stirling and Stone got Balbarnie and Wilson. Stone pace like fire
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 04:18:37 PM
141-6 and we could be batting again soon
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 04:31:11 PM
149-7 third for Curran. All on KoB of the Irish are to get a three figure lead
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 24, 2019, 04:49:26 PM
Ireland going nowhere right now - shouldíve started playing some shots earlier
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 24, 2019, 05:01:00 PM
If I were the Iíd be keen to keep england in the field as long as possible tomorrow. Forecast is pushing 40.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 05:02:17 PM
Ireland probably happy to survive until stumps and potentially use whatever life's in the pitch tomorrow morning.

Lead is now 86
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 05:20:34 PM
174-8 Broad 3fer
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 24, 2019, 05:26:45 PM
Lead has cross 100 getting slightly nervous
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 24, 2019, 05:28:18 PM
Murtagh doing the right thing. Canít do no wrong today
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 05:31:01 PM
Murtagh doing the right thing. Canít do no wrong today

Bad bowling
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 24, 2019, 05:47:13 PM
England heading for a big defeat here the pitch wonít change much overnight

When we have to bat time on a tricky pitch(with good bowling) we just cannot do it

Into the ashes with the worst result possible

I think we need Malan in and I donít know the next temperamentally equipped batsman in the Country, but whoever he is we need him.

And quick
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 05:50:41 PM
Sibley can bat long........

One over tonight! Dreading this over already
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 24, 2019, 05:58:38 PM
Roy asking for a nightwatchman is as weak as it gets
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 24, 2019, 05:59:45 PM
Donít blame roy for hiding - heís not an opener anyway
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 24, 2019, 06:03:12 PM
Donít blame roy for hiding - heís not an opener anyway

You forgot the word ďtestĒ.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 24, 2019, 06:03:39 PM
Roy asking for a nightwatchman is as weak as it gets

Jennings did the same in columbo

Why is it any different from your 3/4/5 asking for one??
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on July 24, 2019, 06:03:44 PM
Leach might have just saved Jason Royís Test career?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 24, 2019, 06:04:06 PM
Tricky one the night watchman....1 over wonder what we would do ?

Itís an openers worst nightmare.

I think i would go out with 2 overs left, 1.....hmm  :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 24, 2019, 06:07:58 PM
Jennings did the same in columbo

Why is it any different from your 3/4/5 asking for one??

Because edgy internet comment. Why else?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 24, 2019, 06:13:39 PM
I wonder how the conversation went between Roy and Burns.... what if they both wanted a night watchman? You can't send 2 out can you?? Burns could have got stitched right up there, with Roy hiding in the changing room.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 24, 2019, 06:18:35 PM
Jennings did the same in columbo

Why is it any different from your 3/4/5 asking for one??

Jennings was a bottle job in Columbo.

A number 3/4/5 asking for one is a bottle job too...

Leach has done it more than once now, maybe he saw this as an opportunity to nail down his spot as opener in the Ashes!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on July 24, 2019, 06:20:37 PM
I wonder how the conversation went between Roy and Burns.... what if they both wanted a night watchman? You can't send 2 out can you?? Burns could have got stitched right up there, with Roy hiding in the changing room.

The guy at the non-striker's end will never face a delivery when you only have one over to face and have a night watchman on strike as they aren't going to run a single. 

They must have both wanted the night watchman otherwise the one who was happy to bat would have played out the only over with the other one watching from the other end
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 24, 2019, 06:21:09 PM
I wonder how the conversation went between Roy and Burns.... what if they both wanted a night watchman? You can't send 2 out can you?? Burns could have got stitched right up there, with Roy hiding in the changing room.

A guess the new player in the side gets asked if he wants one...

So Burns with more caps..not by much..would give up the right to a night watchman

But thatís a guess
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on July 24, 2019, 06:22:02 PM
jeez...everyone comes out of the woodwork to hound a bloke for wanting a night watchman. he would have been stupid to not take one. as is the way with night watchmen one batter has to join them at the crease and as it happens, burns didn't even have to do anything anyway. also, had leach fallen, roy would have come out and then you're back to where you started, so the issue with burns wanting a nightwatchman as well as roy and him being stitched up is an irrelevant point.

also, who cares if he wanted a night watchman, I wouldn't fancy batting after fielding for 60 overs in the heat for one over with nothing to gain.

blokes just been part of a World Cup winning squad, and has just been given his test debut, lets wait and see how it pans out first.

hey, I've got a better idea, lets just tear roy to shreds cause he's a total coward and I look cool and edgy on the internet.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 24, 2019, 06:32:09 PM
Let's get this straight I have absolutely no problem with anyone having a night watchman, that is their choice, as part of our brilliant game.

However, what I do find interesting is who got the night watchman. Obviously they probably both wanted one but it was Burns who walked out. Yes he was most likely to stand at the non-strickers end but it doesn't always work out that way.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on July 24, 2019, 06:35:50 PM
Let's get this straight I have absolutely no problem with anyone having a night watchman, that is their choice, as part of our brilliant game.

However, what I do find interesting is who got the night watchman. Obviously they probably both wanted one but it was Burns who walked out. Yes he was most likely to stand at the non-strickers end but it doesn't always work out that way.

With Leach taking the 6 balls that would be bowled this evening, the only question was who would bat first tomorrow and who would wait for a wicket to fall.  Given Roy has batted at 3 for Surrey in the CC I am sure it was a fairly straightforward decision
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 24, 2019, 06:56:36 PM
If a wicket had fallen would anyone have had to come out anyway, or would time have been called?

I remember Bairstow not taking a night watchman, then getting out and getting hammered for it. You can't win!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 24, 2019, 07:04:16 PM
If a wicket had fallen would anyone have had to come out anyway, or would time have been called?

I remember Bairstow not taking a night watchman, then getting out and getting hammered for it. You can't win!!

Yes very true, I donít recall nightwatchmen being used so much back in the 80ís or even 90ís

With 1 over to go your on a hiding to nothing so donít blame any batsmen taking it
If a wicket had fallen it would of been time Iím pretty sure
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on July 24, 2019, 07:40:35 PM
Test cricket is a great leveler! Good for Ireland and Tim Murtagh!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 09:01:58 AM
Looks like one of Starc or Hazlewood will miss out in place of Pattinson, Pattinson has been rapid in the warm up event the Aussies are playing
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 25, 2019, 09:05:03 AM
Test cricket is a great leveler! Good for Ireland and Tim Murtagh!
Is it? Iíd say it was the format where the best team won most often.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 25, 2019, 09:12:10 AM
Looks like one of Starc or Hazlewood will miss out in place of Pattinson, Pattinson has been rapid in the warm up event the Aussies are playing

Was there any speed gun on it, watched the highlights he did look rapid. Is there a max number of players they can name in an ashes squad if not why not just slide him in there. If youre playing at Lords and its the same as the Ireland game they should be looking to get John Hastings over too. Nothing like a bit of right arm dibbly dobbly
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 09:34:42 AM
Was there any speed gun on it, watched the highlights he did look rapid. Is there a max number of players they can name in an ashes squad if not why not just slide him in there. If youre playing at Lords and its the same as the Ireland game they should be looking to get John Hastings over too. Nothing like a bit of right arm dibbly dobbly
No official speed gun but the reporters at Southampton said he was clearly quicker than Cummins, which is no mean feat.

I was under the impression that a touring party is usually 16 men but nothing stopping Australia having 17 or 18 if they really wanted to.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 25, 2019, 10:16:59 AM
I love THE NUT
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 25, 2019, 10:31:20 AM
Was there any speed gun on it, watched the highlights he did look rapid. Is there a max number of players they can name in an ashes squad if not why not just slide him in there. If youre playing at Lords and its the same as the Ireland game they should be looking to get John Hastings over too. Nothing like a bit of right arm dibbly dobbly

Hastings has retired from all forms due to health reasons, mainly the fact that he would cough up blood after bowling, and I don't think anyone ever figured out why.

I can't see Starc being left out in any case and truth be told Hazelwoods form wasn't fantastic before his injury and subsequent layoff, it sounds like the time off hasn't improved much. Pattinson is a far better Allround cricketer who's back issues have presented Hazelwood a career, now that he is fit, Hazelwood should rightly return back down the pecking order.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 25, 2019, 10:44:58 AM
Leach not a bad opener  ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 10:48:49 AM
Burns is actually worst than Jennings
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 25, 2019, 10:50:47 AM
Burns is actually worst than Jennings

He's not having a great season...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 10:57:55 AM
Leach playing like Banger MKII
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 25, 2019, 10:59:56 AM
I seem to remember another spinner who became a gun batsman. KP 2.0. Leach set himself for a lovely ashes season as #1 bat
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on July 25, 2019, 11:06:17 AM
Burns is actually worst than Jennings

What worries me with Burns is that his technique is exposed to both the ball coming into him and the ball leaving him.  When it comes back in, his feet are planted on off stump and his head is falling away to point.  When it is moving away from his feet stay planted and he can't get his head over the ball.

He scored a lot of runs in the CC at a time when England were struggling for openers without being given  a call up and those questions over his poor technique look to be justified so far. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 25, 2019, 11:07:30 AM
Leach coached by trescothick? Keep going !!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 25, 2019, 11:13:58 AM
Neither of the England openers look fit to be Leaches nightwatchman at this stage. Burns looks like a bad parody of a batsman and Jason Roy doesn't look to have the mental faculties nor the technical proficiency required for test cricket.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: beaver5 on July 25, 2019, 11:23:56 AM
Leach coached by trescothick? Keep going !!

If that's the case then he should be brought in to coach the rest of the batting order. Leach is batting exactly as an opener should, few risks and put away the bad ball.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 25, 2019, 11:47:50 AM
NUT
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on July 25, 2019, 11:48:17 AM
Hope all the moaners about Roy taking the nightwatchman last night are suitably embarrassed with themselves now - looking like a tactical masterstroke
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on July 25, 2019, 11:53:34 AM
Looks like England have found a new opener. A Leach hundred would be fantastic.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 25, 2019, 12:12:39 PM
to everyone saying Burns technique is an issue,

think back 3 years, most of you were saying he must be picked, he's scoring runs for fun and his technique wont be an issue...

and no he is not worse than Jennings far from it, just in bad form, he'll be given the start of the ashes at least
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 25, 2019, 12:17:30 PM
50 for roy
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 25, 2019, 12:24:09 PM
Itís not Burns technique, he is not in nick because he has hardly played enough four day cricket ...same as lots of others.
The one day stuff has taken over most of our summer.

Same with hameed, these guys need to playing a lot but the schedule has not allowed it
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 25, 2019, 12:25:43 PM
Love Roy to pieces.


But yeah........ itís a no from em in tests. Especially as an opener.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 25, 2019, 12:27:22 PM
Itís not Burns technique, he is not in nick because he has hardly played enough four day cricket ...same as lots of others.
The one day stuff has taken over most of our summer.

Same with hameed, these guys need to playing a lot but the schedule has not allowed it

Itís his technique.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: golders on July 25, 2019, 12:37:26 PM
time to perhaps just pick purely on form?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 25, 2019, 12:49:14 PM
Itís his technique.

Any batsman out of nick who donít score the technique gets blamed
Any batsman scoring runs with the same technique no one mentions it

Burns knows how to score runs, he has proved it.

Test match history shows up players with faults scoring runs
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 25, 2019, 01:00:46 PM
England are in the lead!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on July 25, 2019, 01:02:58 PM
Burns had to score mountains to get in because the selectors were concerned about his technique - you never want to be the guy moaning about England players but you have to say they're being proved right. That said, it didn't look awesome at the start of his England career but it looks worse now! As for hasn't played any this year - he's played 8 FC games and is top scorer for his county.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 25, 2019, 01:12:41 PM
Youíre dead right he had to wait his turn because there are a lot of moving parts to his batting.

Now heís in letís back him he had to put in 5 years solid scoring before a chance

The forum is far too quick to judge what is needed to score at test level.

Letís see after a fair crack of the opening spot.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 25, 2019, 01:19:47 PM
Youíre dead right he had to wait his turn because there are a lot of moving parts to his batting.

Now heís in letís back him he had to put in 5 years solid scoring before a chance

The forum is far too quick to judge what is needed to score at test level.

Letís see after a fair crack of the opening spot.

This! so correct!

roy looking in trouble to the ball that is swinging back in, didnt look this out of sorts in the world cup even though there was a slight issue

really hope he goes big this summer!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 25, 2019, 01:25:21 PM
https://m.facebook.com/680570183/posts/10162041970875184/ (https://m.facebook.com/680570183/posts/10162041970875184/)

Summed it up better than I could.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: A-Swing-And-A-Miss on July 25, 2019, 01:37:20 PM
I feel like England have missed a trick by not picking Sibley or Hain for this match. With so many quick scoring middle order players England need guys at the top of the order capable of grinding out slow runs to see off the new ball.

I'd love to see a team of: Burns, Sibley, Hain, Root, Roy, Stokes, Buttler(WK), Woakes, Ali, Archer/Stone/Wood, Anderson/Broad for the first Ashes test

Roy's clearly a ludicrously talented player but he looks so much better when the ball is a bit worn and not moving anywhere near as much, same as Root really. Burns and Sibley are both good for absorbing early bursts and Hain is now ready to become Trott 2.0
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 25, 2019, 01:44:16 PM
Is again a number 3, spent most of his short career at 5 hasnít he?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 25, 2019, 01:46:19 PM
Don't think I've ever seen a no ball called for 3 men behind square, a bit village
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 25, 2019, 01:53:34 PM
I'm actually going to jump outta my chair if jack leach gets this
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 25, 2019, 02:00:19 PM
I feel like England have missed a trick by not picking Sibley or Hain for this match. With so many quick scoring middle order players England need guys at the top of the order capable of grinding out slow runs to see off the new ball.

I'd love to see a team of: Burns, Sibley, Hain, Root, Roy, Stokes, Buttler(WK), Woakes, Ali, Archer/Stone/Wood, Anderson/Broad for the first Ashes test

Roy's clearly a ludicrously talented player but he looks so much better when the ball is a bit worn and not moving anywhere near as much, same as Root really. Burns and Sibley are both good for absorbing early bursts and Hain is now ready to become Trott 2.0

So Burns, Hain, Sibley and Roy all get an Ashes gig before Bairstow??!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on July 25, 2019, 02:02:37 PM
Surely Alistair Cook is still the best opening batsman in England?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 02:07:14 PM
So Burns, Hain, Sibley and Roy all get an Ashes gig before Bairstow??!
Aside from 2016, Bairstow averages 29 in the rest of his career. Which is pretty pathetic.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 25, 2019, 02:07:31 PM
Surely Alistair Cook is still the best opening batsman in England?

Get him out of retirement to open with Leach next week!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on July 25, 2019, 02:07:35 PM
So Burns, Hain, Sibley and Roy all get an Ashes gig before Bairstow??!
They're all top order batsmen, Bairstow only had a little go at that before he bottled it and threw his toys everywhere.

Can't believe this from Leach, what a hero. Clearly opening in tests isn't as hard as Alastair Cook would have you think!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 02:09:50 PM
to everyone saying Burns technique is an issue,

think back 3 years, most of you were saying he must be picked, he's scoring runs for fun and his technique wont be an issue...

and no he is not worse than Jennings far from it, just in bad form, he'll be given the start of the ashes at least
Jennings with his shortcomings at least as shown he can scores 100s

Burns mightíve scored loads of runs at first class level but what top class bowlers has he been feasting on? Hardly any. Burns is pretty similar to Ballance. Awful technical ability and champion at first class level. But inept against world class bowlers.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 25, 2019, 02:17:00 PM
 No, Jack! :(
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 25, 2019, 02:17:47 PM
NOOOOO
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on July 25, 2019, 02:21:06 PM
Gutted for Leech batted so well and showed the proper batters how to play test cricket. Great great effort from the lad
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 25, 2019, 02:25:42 PM
nnnnnnnnnnooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on July 25, 2019, 02:36:52 PM
to everyone saying Burns technique is an issue,

think back 3 years, most of you were saying he must be picked, he's scoring runs for fun and his technique wont be an issue...


3 years? More like 6 months!

I did predict how this forum would go with Burns.

The underlying problem is the dominance of short-form cricket. But no-one will admit it, because money is king.



Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 02:48:38 PM
Root sells Denly down the river. Bairstow needs to show something here
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 02:55:16 PM
A pair for Bairstow.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: A-Swing-And-A-Miss on July 25, 2019, 02:55:48 PM
So Burns, Hain, Sibley and Roy all get an Ashes gig before Bairstow??!

Watching Bairstow over the past few years is a very similar experience to watching Vince and Jennings over the same period. You watch someone repeatedly get out the same way and not adapting. How many times has he got to keep getting bowled through the gate before he works on how he drives the ball in Test matches?

Bairstow's bottom hand heavy technique works in ODI's but it blatantly isn't working in Tests. He's averaging just 30 in Test's since moving up to open in ODI's and doesn't seem settled anywhere. He's batted 3,4,5,6,7 and 8, he's had the gloves, not had them, then been keeper again. Unless the ECB hire someone to stand outside Bairstow's door giving him abuse, I just don't see how he can be allowed to continue failing with such confidence and ego?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on July 25, 2019, 02:58:39 PM
Bairstow really is just (No Swearing Please) in tests.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on July 25, 2019, 02:59:28 PM
He reviewed it so quickly I was sure he must have got bat on it, someone stop him from calling for reviews please!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 25, 2019, 03:00:11 PM
It has to be time for Bairstow to hand the gloves over to Foakes now, surely?

If this was James Vince you'd all be calling for his head, yet somehow YJB seems to be immune from criticism!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 25, 2019, 03:00:23 PM
A reminder that Foakes was dropped cause Bairstow kicked his toys out of the pram
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: A-Swing-And-A-Miss on July 25, 2019, 03:00:28 PM
Watching Bairstow over the past few years is a very similar experience to watching Vince and Jennings over the same period. You watch someone repeatedly get out the same way and not adapting. How many times has he got to keep getting bowled through the gate before he works on how he drives the ball in Test matches?

Bairstow's bottom hand heavy technique works in ODI's but it blatantly isn't working in Tests. He's averaging just 30 in Test's since moving up to open in ODI's and doesn't seem settled anywhere. He's batted 3,4,5,6,7 and 8, he's had the gloves, not had them, then been keeper again. Unless the ECB hire someone to stand outside Bairstow's door giving him abuse, I just don't see how he can be allowed to continue failing with such confidence and ego?

Bairstow in driving hard with hands away from the body and getting bowled/lbw shocker. But he'll carry on getting picked because he's Yorkshire and Root isn't a strong enough character to tell him to go away to sort out his attitude and test technique.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 25, 2019, 03:02:49 PM
Watching Bairstow over the past few years is a very similar experience to watching Vince and Jennings over the same period. You watch someone repeatedly get out the same way and not adapting. How many times has he got to keep getting bowled through the gate before he works on how he drives the ball in Test matches?

Bairstow's bottom hand heavy technique works in ODI's but it blatantly isn't working in Tests. He's averaging just 30 in Test's since moving up to open in ODI's and doesn't seem settled anywhere. He's batted 3,4,5,6,7 and 8, he's had the gloves, not had them, then been keeper again. Unless the ECB hire someone to stand outside Bairstow's door giving him abuse, I just don't see how he can be allowed to continue failing with such confidence and ego?

Appreciate what you're saying and I agree there's s technical flaw there to work on. However I think he's got enough credit in the bank to play before we throw 2 debutants and 2 almost debutants into our top 6 for the 1st Ashes test.

Also, the fact he has batted in every position, had the gloves, not had the gloves etc can't have helped him imo

The pair in this test isn't ideal though granted!  :(
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 03:02:59 PM
Bairstow is a proven flop in test cricket. 2016 was a total fluke by Bairstow. His true ability is what he showed in the rest of his career
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 25, 2019, 03:08:47 PM
It has to be time for Bairstow to hand the gloves over to Foakes now, surely?

If this was James Vince you'd all be calling for his head, yet somehow YJB seems to be immune from criticism!

Foakes is mighty unfortunate not to be permanent after the Sri Lanka tour

Mighty unfortunate!! Said it twice!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 25, 2019, 03:09:24 PM
Bairstow is a proven flop in test cricket. 2016 was a total fluke by Bairstow. His true ability is what he showed in the rest of his career

How do you fluke your way to 1470 runs in a year at an avg of 58??! You may not rate him but come on....

https://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/11066/10703931/jonny-bairstows-all-round-record-breaking-2016-for-england (https://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/11066/10703931/jonny-bairstows-all-round-record-breaking-2016-for-england)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 25, 2019, 03:15:48 PM
Who's worse at Reviewing Johnny or Shane Watson?

Also WHERE IS FOAKES!! i still don't get how he isn't the second (behind the skipper) name on the team sheet, and I've said this for a while.

Johnny will get a barracking in the media, score a hundred yell in "celebration" and then fail again....



Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 03:26:48 PM
How do you fluke your way to 1470 runs in a year at an avg of 58??! You may not rate him but come on....

https://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/11066/10703931/jonny-bairstows-all-round-record-breaking-2016-for-england (https://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/11066/10703931/jonny-bairstows-all-round-record-breaking-2016-for-england)
Feel free to look at his stats for every other year of his career. Averaging 20s and 30s
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 25, 2019, 03:49:50 PM
Another poor innings from Moeen, terrible from the middle order all round really
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 25, 2019, 03:50:15 PM
Moeen fails once again. Root, Woakes and Curran need to somehow manufacture another 80-100 runs
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 25, 2019, 03:52:30 PM
So how are England going to justify picking mo over leach this time?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 25, 2019, 04:10:13 PM
Braindead shot from Root; thought he would know better
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 25, 2019, 04:11:11 PM
Vice marks saying regardless of what happens in this test leach wonít play the next game

Shades of Foakes v Sri Lanka and then dropped

You can start to see why selection is wrong

I think marks is correct, leach will give way to Mo-one spinner
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 25, 2019, 04:22:02 PM
Stop driving, for the love effing God
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on July 25, 2019, 04:24:50 PM
This is maybe the worst most brain dead performance I've seen for a long time
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 25, 2019, 04:37:45 PM
England's Best batsman is now in. Curran should be batting higher
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on July 25, 2019, 05:02:02 PM
Not sure why people are so tense.. itís Advantage England now, no?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 25, 2019, 06:05:52 PM
No canít see that...Ireland will go for 180/200 like a one day match,if sterling gets in it could be over quickly

They have got a lot of spirit Ireland  and a small total will suit their style

And Iíd question whether England deserve to win, Ireland have played better cricket.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 25, 2019, 07:25:06 PM
Feel free to look at his stats for every other year of his career. Averaging 20s and 30s

Still doesn't answer how you fluke 1470 runs in a year. I've fluked 4's and 6's before, never tons tho. If you've scored that amount of runs, you've earned em in my book.

Still say going into the 1set test with 4 newbies from 6 top test cricket is crazy talk. Although I agree Bairstow has questions over him, he's still a top 6 pick at present for me.

I'd have like to have seen Sibley given a go in this game though.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 25, 2019, 08:00:11 PM
Still doesn't answer how you fluke 1470 runs in a year. I've fluked 4's and 6's before, never tons tho. If you've scored that amount of runs, you've earned em in my book.

Still say going into the 1set test with 4 newbies from 6 top test cricket is crazy talk. Although I agree Bairstow has questions over him, he's still a top 6 pick at present for me.

I'd have like to have seen Sibley given a go in this game though.

I'd have rested Bairstow and Woakes. Root needed to play as skipper, Roy for experience. Foakes and Gregory could've done with the game.

But seemingly there are kid gloves around Bairstow, even when he's on a hiding to nothing. He's a great player. But he doesn't help himself!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 25, 2019, 08:03:41 PM
Still doesn't answer how you fluke 1470 runs in a year. I've fluked 4's and 6's before, never tons tho. If you've scored that amount of runs, you've earned em in my book.

Still say going into the 1set test with 4 newbies from 6 top test cricket is crazy talk. Although I agree Bairstow has questions over him, he's still a top 6 pick at present for me.

I'd have like to have seen Sibley given a go in this game though.

Bairstow is a different player in one day cricket than tests. Yes he had a hot streak and played brilliantly for 12-18 months.

He won't give up the gloves because he thinks if he keeps them he has 2 jobs and is harder to replace. England just caved in after Sri Lanka when Foakes did so well

Your spot on we should of had a look at a new batsman, Sibey was worth a try I would have Malan....either way we need to look at someone and hope they come thru.

The problem is our batting and has been for ages. Foakes should be our keeper it's farcical - miles ahead of anyone else and a decent bat.

After Sri Lanka they should of said to bairstow you're a specialist bat now just like Butler. Live or die by runs like everyone else.

England fudged the problem and kicked the can down the road. All they did is make it harder to pick the team.


 :)

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: beaver5 on July 25, 2019, 10:43:37 PM
Atherton
Butcher
Hussain
Thorpe
Hick
Ramprakash
Stewart
Lewis
Croft
Gough
Carrick
Don't tell me England in the 90's were a terrible team. This team would smash our current test side out of sight. Some very over rated players in out current team!



Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: skip1973 on July 26, 2019, 12:11:22 AM
Atherton
Butcher
Hussain
Thorpe
Hick
Ramprakash
Stewart
Lewis
Croft
Gough
Carrick
Don't tell me England in the 90's were a terrible team. This team would smash our current test side out of sight. Some very over rated players in out current team!
Did you watch them play at all? Atherton a solid test opener and Thorpe a tough middle order player but the rest were average test players at best.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on July 26, 2019, 12:51:12 AM
Did you watch them play at all? Atherton a solid test opener and Thorpe a tough middle order player but the rest were average test players at best.

Gough would walk into this team tbh.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 26, 2019, 06:14:53 AM
So anyway.....


To our Aussie friends? After Bancroft made a superb 93not out in whatís seems the only test style inning win a while.

Do we reckon heís gonna be re u tied with his best buddy Warner to open in the ashes??
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 06:24:48 AM
Did you watch them play at all? Atherton a solid test opener and Thorpe a tough middle order player but the rest were average test players at best.
That's a interesting debate. I would take Atherton and Butcher over Burns and Roy any day of the week. Thorpe was one of England's most underrated players ever and Stewart strolls into this team ahead of Bairstow. Out of the bowlers I think only Gough plays.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 06:37:16 AM
So anyway.....


To our Aussie friends? After Bancroft made a superb 93not out in whatís seems the only test style inning win a while.

Do we reckon heís gonna be re u tied with his best buddy Warner to open in the ashes??

I don't think that game the Aussies played has told them anything they didn't already know if they were truthful about it.

Pattinson is class and rapid was always going to make the squad if fit.

The batsmen struggle to play a moving ball, nothing new there really. The disappointment would have come from none of the current guys holding the spots getting runs eg. Head, Patterson, Burns and Harris.
With good old Mitch Marsh having a good game also may through the cat amongst the pigeons as well.
The Khawaja injury makes selection more interesting. Does anyone know if he is going to be fit?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: skip1973 on July 26, 2019, 07:00:47 AM
So anyway.....


To our Aussie friends? After Bancroft made a superb 93not out in whatís seems the only test style inning win a while.

Do we reckon heís gonna be re u tied with his best buddy Warner to open in the ashes??
Can't see it, I think they will stick with Harris. Wade I am hearing might get another crack.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 26, 2019, 07:05:39 AM
So anyway.....


To our Aussie friends? After Bancroft made a superb 93not out in whatís seems the only test style inning win a while.

Do we reckon heís gonna be re u tied with his best buddy Warner to open in the ashes??

I think he is the best option, Burns is a flat track hero and Harris just hasn't made that spot his.

It will be interesting to see which way the selectors go, I've not heard anything on the Khawaja front but in my opinion Labuschagne has got the runs on the board for that #3 spot, you can't really argue with his work in County Championship thus far and he can bowl handy leggies. I'm not sure Marsh will get a go after one good showing, maybe if there looks to be a really flat wicket, otherwise I think they will go with Wade, who can also throw down some part time overs. And Pattinson ahead of Hazelwood who has been thoroughly unimpressive in the A tour.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: beaver5 on July 26, 2019, 07:46:12 AM
Did you watch them play at all? Atherton a solid test opener and Thorpe a tough middle order player but the rest were average test players at best.

Yes I certainly did. Thorpe is one of my batting heroes. I can't believe I didn't include Gooch and Robin Smith either. I'd swap most of that side for the current one though.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 26, 2019, 07:53:28 AM
Averages of English openers since Strauss retired:
Buttler 4.00
Roy 5.00
Denly 11.50
Trott 12.00
Ali 14.00
Lyth 20.38
Burns 22.28
Duckett 23.00
Jennings 25.16
Hales 27.28
Stoneman 27.68
Carberry 28.10
Robson 30.54
Compton 31.12
Hameed 32.00
Root 41.70
Cook 42.52
Leach 46.50
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 26, 2019, 08:46:49 AM
Averages of English openers since Strauss retired:
Buttler 4.00
Roy 5.00
Denly 11.50
Trott 12.00
Ali 14.00
Lyth 20.38
Burns 22.28
Duckett 23.00
Jennings 25.16
Hales 27.28
Stoneman 27.68
Carberry 28.10
Robson 30.54
Compton 31.12
Hameed 32.00
Root 41.70
Cook 42.52
Leach 46.50
So Leach and Root should open in Birmingham  ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 26, 2019, 09:34:52 AM
#RecallKP

Remember when our top 6 all averaged like 40 and the main concern was an out of form Ian Bell? I miss those days...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 26, 2019, 09:47:58 AM
Bell batted behind a solid top 4 so had freedom to play his way

He was class, twenty tons donít come without being quality

Iíd argue we actually miss Trott the most thou. Against most attacks he protected those after him

Yes found out by exceptional pace in the end

But a damn good number 3
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 26, 2019, 09:54:06 AM
Think a peak Cook is for sure thenone weíd have back.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 26, 2019, 10:15:27 AM
Ireland need 182 to win
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 10:37:04 AM
If Woakes and Broad wanted conditions to bowl in then they have them - once this rain goes it's set to be overcast and humid all day.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 26, 2019, 11:00:57 AM
Carey not picked for the ashes - remarkable that!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 26, 2019, 11:04:23 AM
Carey not picked for the ashes - remarkable that!
Paine's keeping is considerably better than Carey's
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 11:04:46 AM
Carey not picked for the ashes - remarkable that!

Yep agreed can't believe that....

Full squad below -

Tim Paine (c), Cameron Bancroft, Pat Cummins, Marcus Harris, Josh Hazlewood, Travis Head, Usman Khawaja, Marnus Labuschagne, Nathan Lyon, Mitchell Marsh, Michael Neser, James Pattinson, Peter Siddle, Steven Smith, Mitchell Starc, Matthew Wade, David Warner.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on July 26, 2019, 11:06:58 AM
Could play Carey is a front line batsman.

M.Marsh gets another go - how many more goes is this bloke going to get
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 26, 2019, 11:07:58 AM
Lots of fast bowlers and not many extra batsmen.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 26, 2019, 11:14:09 AM
Averages of English openers since Strauss retired:
Buttler 4.00
Roy 5.00
Denly 11.50
Trott 12.00
Ali 14.00
Lyth 20.38
Burns 22.28
Duckett 23.00
Jennings 25.16
Hales 27.28
Stoneman 27.68
Carberry 28.10
Robson 30.54
Compton 31.12
Hameed 32.00
Root 41.70
Cook 42.52
Leach 46.50

Does Roy not average 38?? Presume this list was made after innings one.



Always said we should have let robson have a much longer shot.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 26, 2019, 11:16:03 AM
Does Roy not average 38?? Presume this list was made after innings one.



Always said we should have let robson have a much longer shot.
Roy was at 3 in the second innings
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 11:19:09 AM
Lots of fast bowlers and not many extra batsmen.

Yep that was my 1st thought - when you add Marsh into that as well and the fact that Australia only ever play 3 seamers, plus they picked a squad of 17.

By not picking Carey, Wade is also effectively the back up keeper and he really isn't great with the gloves.

The bowling will be interesting as Cummins, Pattinson and Lyon will definitely play so that leaves 1 spot - will it be Starc or Siddle or Nesser or Hazelwood etc....
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 26, 2019, 11:23:11 AM
Yep that was my 1st thought - when you add Marsh into that as well and the fact that Australia only ever play 3 seamers, plus they picked a squad of 17.

By not picking Carey, Wade is also effectively the back up keeper and he really isn't great with the gloves.

The bowling will be interesting as Cummins, Pattinson and Lyon will definitely play so that leaves 1 spot - will it be Starc or Siddle or Nesser or Hazelwood etc....
The Australian media says Head can also keep but I'm not sure if that accurate

For Birmingham I'd expect them to pick Pattinson, Cummins and Siddle. Starc and Hazlewood where dreadful in that warm up march
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 26, 2019, 11:23:52 AM
Could play Carey is a front line batsman.

M.Marsh gets another go - how many more goes is this bloke going to get
Mitch Marsh will be captain by the end of the year...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 11:29:54 AM
The Australian media says Head can also keep but I'm not sure if that accurate

For Birmingham I'd expect them to pick Pattinson, Cummins and Siddle. Starc and Hazlewood where dreadful in that warm up march

Agreed i think Siddle will play at Edgbaston.

It's interesting that all the Aussies that are playing County Cricket have been picked in the squad - i do think that Langer thinks a lot differently and knows English conditions etc...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on July 26, 2019, 11:47:10 AM
Bairstow finally does something in this match, great catch
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 26, 2019, 11:47:34 AM
Bairstow with a good take
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 26, 2019, 11:53:40 AM
Roy was at 3 in the second innings

Good point.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 26, 2019, 12:02:03 PM
Great line from Broady
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 26, 2019, 12:06:47 PM
And a beauty from Woakesy
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 26, 2019, 12:10:01 PM
Yep that was my 1st thought - when you add Marsh into that as well and the fact that Australia only ever play 3 seamers, plus they picked a squad of 17.

By not picking Carey, Wade is also effectively the back up keeper and he really isn't great with the gloves.

The bowling will be interesting as Cummins, Pattinson and Lyon will definitely play so that leaves 1 spot - will it be Starc or Siddle or Nesser or Hazelwood etc....

Bancroft is also quite an accomplished gloveman, has kept regularly in shield and BBL before.

Carey had an amazing World cup, but his first class record sits under 30 and really hasn't shown much outside of one day cricket that would demand selection.

And Aus won't drop Starc, Hazelwood will only play in the event of injuries from everything he has shown since returning from injury.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 26, 2019, 12:19:19 PM
Another one on the money from Christopher Roger Woakes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 26, 2019, 12:19:39 PM
Cracks being papered over here
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 26, 2019, 12:20:20 PM
Woakes bowling beautiful in this spell!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 26, 2019, 12:22:37 PM
Cracks being papered over here


Way I see it is, we have not got our best 11 out, some playing should have been tested after the wc, lots not in form, lots made some attentions decisions, lots played badly.

Yet it looks like we still gonna win.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 26, 2019, 12:23:38 PM
Can't believe that needed to be reviewed, was plumb
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 26, 2019, 12:23:52 PM
24-5
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 26, 2019, 12:24:32 PM

Way I see it is, we have not got our best 11 out, some playing should have been tested after the wc, lots not in form, lots made some attentions decisions, lots played badly.

Yet it looks like we still gonna win.

It's the established players who are playing getting out in the same manners again and again that bothers me most
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 12:27:16 PM
Jack Leach MOM for getting 92!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 26, 2019, 12:27:54 PM
It's the established players who are playing getting out in the same manners again and again that bothers me most

Yep lots to be addressed before the ashes. As if we play like this. We will get steamrolled
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 26, 2019, 12:28:51 PM
 Never thought Iíd see 85 all out being a good first innings score
 :)

If the Ashes are on wickets and conditions like this it could be a total lottery

Jack leach man of the match here by miles...for his batting
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on July 26, 2019, 12:39:45 PM
lmao what a shot after getting cracked on the head
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 26, 2019, 12:42:36 PM
Total road and 40 degrees yesterday, flood lights and rain today. Can't help but feel the cricketing gods are on team England of late!

England should win here, but with a top 3 who have been embarrassed and completely outclassed by a number 11 who averages 4 this year, Root looking out of touch, Bairstow on the wrong end of his purple patch and Moeen Ali looking to take up a new sport, there are plenty of problems that won't be fixed by adding Stokes, Buttler and Archer
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 26, 2019, 12:47:02 PM
Total road and 40 degrees yesterday, flood lights and rain today. Can't help but feel the cricketing gods are on team England of late!

England should win here, but with a top 3 who have been embarrassed and completely outclassed by a number 11 who averages 4 this year, Root looking out of touch, Bairstow on the wrong end of his purple patch and Moeen Ali looking to take up a new sport, there are plenty of problems that won't be fixed by adding Stokes, Buttler and Archer

Could an argument be made for Stokes batting at 3?

He looked the part in the world cup and is good technically

Moeen simply cannot play ahead of leach but he will
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 12:48:10 PM
If Woakes and Broad wanted conditions to bowl in then they have them - once this rain goes it's set to be overcast and humid all day.

 ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 26, 2019, 12:50:58 PM
Could an argument be made for Stokes batting at 3?

He looked the part in the world cup and is good technically

Moeen simply cannot play ahead of leach but he will

I think at this point Stokes can do whatever he likes haha, he would probably do well at 3 but might that be asking a bit much from him? I'd also want to keep him as far away from the new ball as possible just to make his job as easy as possible.

Moeen must be a seriously good guy, because he's a pretty average cricketer these days
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on July 26, 2019, 12:52:37 PM
How many times will Root say ďcharacterĒ in the post-match?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 26, 2019, 12:53:10 PM
Has Broad just bowled himself into the side for the first Ashes test?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on July 26, 2019, 01:01:37 PM
England bowled superbly but we know we have a fantastic bowling line up and very good bowlers in reserve as well. Batting however looked shocking in this match. I guess there could be an argument that these batters donít face 75mph old style swing bowling a lot or have not played red ball for a while but the lack of aptitude was shocking.

What did we learn from this 2 days and a session? Well nothing really
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 26, 2019, 01:05:31 PM
What did we learn from this 2 days and a session? Well nothing really

For 2 days and 1 ball of that Ireland were favourites!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 01:07:21 PM
I actually think it's a shame that conditions were like that today because too be honest Ireland didn't stand much of a chance, we would have (and have before) bowled out much much better sides when conditions are like that.

I would have liked us to be tested in the field, Ireland get close to the 182 etc... and then the batters get really shown up for what they have been like this match.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 01:15:38 PM
Root on TMS has just called the pitch 'sub-standard'!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on July 26, 2019, 01:26:25 PM
They did what they needed to do this morning, conditions obviously favouring but we used them well. However we all knew where our frailties were prior to this test and these have only been confirmed in the last few days. We need to find two openers asap, which makes me wonder why we didn't bat Roy lower down and give Sibley or a n other a try up top in this test.

In fairness both sides in the Ashes are bowler heavy, with batting line ups which both have cracks. Could be an interesting series with whoever's big players stand up to be counted coming out on top.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 26, 2019, 01:42:30 PM
I just imagine it's going to be low scores all over the shop, a summer for both bowling sides
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 26, 2019, 01:49:20 PM
root talking nonsense, nowt wrong with that pitch, wasn't up and down, didn't turn too much.

We batted awfully and i hope he gets a lot of flack for that comment!!

positives to take:

we know who our best spinner is - leach (although he wont play)
Roy got a score and i think he'll turn out to be a good pick
stokes, buttler and anderson to come back in
Olly Stone bowled well
We exploited conditions perfectly this morning
Root remembered how to catch
Curran looks a seriously good batsmen

Negatives:

burns is horribly out of form
denly may be dropped but root is at fault
ballance/vince may get a recall
root cant bat and captain
moeen is atrocious
bairstow seems to want to blast everything - hes much better when he times it
Foakes should be playing buy cry baby bairstow will be picked
Curran looks a seriously good batsmen - wont get into our batting line up needs to get up the order at Surrey
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 26, 2019, 02:00:14 PM
Root says he doesnt have concerns about the batting and it was the pitch... is he blind, blinkered or just daft
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 26, 2019, 02:09:37 PM
Could an argument be made for Stokes batting at 3?

He looked the part in the world cup and is good technically

Moeen simply cannot play ahead of leach but he will

Is that the same Moeen that has 45 wickets at 23 in his last 9 tests?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 26, 2019, 02:10:42 PM
I would say all 3 right now; pitch was absolutely fine, if a nightwatchman with a FC average of 4 can score 92 then your best players should be more than capable of batting properly...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on July 26, 2019, 02:26:39 PM
Thoroughly entertaining game to watch.   Not a great surface by test match standards but it makes for a great game to watch when the ball is moving about

Not sure many of the selection decisions ahead of next week have been resolved as a result of that though.  Fitness permitting and without having seen the pitch, I would go in with:

1. Roy
2. Denly
3. Stokes
4. Root
5. Baistow
6. Butler
7. Ali
8. Woakes
9. Archer
10. Broad
11. Anderson

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 26, 2019, 02:55:27 PM
root talking nonsense, nowt wrong with that pitch, wasn't up and down, didn't turn too much.

We batted awfully and i hope he gets a lot of flack for that comment!!

positives to take:

we know who our best spinner is - leach (although he wont play)
Roy got a score and i think he'll turn out to be a good pick
stokes, buttler and anderson to come back in
Olly Stone bowled well
We exploited conditions perfectly this morning
Root remembered how to catch
Curran looks a seriously good batsmen

Negatives:

burns is horribly out of form
denly may be dropped but root is at fault
ballance/vince may get a recall
root cant bat and captain
moeen is atrocious
bairstow seems to want to blast everything - hes much better when he times it
Foakes should be playing buy cry baby bairstow will be picked
Curran looks a seriously good batsmen - wont get into our batting line up needs to get up the order at Surrey

His 3-0-26-0 vs Moís 4.2-1-14-1 convinced you of that?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on July 26, 2019, 03:06:38 PM
Leach has proved he is the best spinner by bowling 3 overs for 26 without taking a wicket?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 26, 2019, 03:08:51 PM
Hey everyone else talks out of their ass and so can I...

I genuinely do think leach is the better spinner and needs a run in the side
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on July 26, 2019, 03:12:22 PM
Hey everyone else talks out of their ass and so can I...

I genuinely do think leach is the better spinner and needs a run in the side

A forum is about different opinions. There is no right or wrong one.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 26, 2019, 03:17:20 PM
Australia could have 5 left handers in the top 6 - Warner, Harris, Khawaja, Head and Wade if he plays ahead of Labuschagne.

Mo will definitely play.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 26, 2019, 03:34:42 PM
A forum is about different opinions. There is no right or wrong one.

Agreed however based on pure stats it looks like I'm talking out of my ass on this one!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 26, 2019, 03:39:43 PM
I think Leach deserves a chance soon, but Mo should keep his place based on his recent bowling. So JL will need to sit tight until such times as they play 2 spinners or Mo stops performing with the ball.

I think weíre all guilty of forgetting that as talented a batter as he is, his batting is really just a bonus.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 26, 2019, 03:42:44 PM
The forum would die without different opinions

I make vic marks right...Leach is getting dropped for the next match

1. If true is this how to pick a side?

2. Do you pick your spinner based on what handed the oppo are?

 :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on July 26, 2019, 04:33:11 PM
Agreed however based on pure stats it looks like I'm talking out of my ass on this one!!

Tresco
Vaughan

Just two who based on stats proved it wrong.. stats arenít everything, especially when there is little history..

Sure, after a few years they mean a lot more though 🙈👍
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on July 26, 2019, 04:42:22 PM
I would be very surprised to see Leach play in the first test next week.  He is 3rd in line for me after Ali and Rashid at a ground where only one spinner is likely to be required at best.  Ali's recent form with the bat has been dreadful but he is still the best equipped of the 3 to bat at 7/8 in a match where the seamers are likely to do most of the damage.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 26, 2019, 04:53:28 PM
Changing the subject slightly but the same theme

Where does stone fit in? Bowled well first innings didn't get a chance second has pace and swings it late

I think he'll miss out for Archer but would be unlucky to
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on July 26, 2019, 05:21:55 PM
A lot of interesting discussions to have. For me, let's start by asking, does Ed Smith have a clue? Picked the wrong side here, and has created more questions than he has answered. The pitch wasn't bad - but green early doors, but today was down to overhead conditions - I reckon Beefy could have come out of retirement and been unplayable today.

So, let's start with the positive. We have a much stronger and more varied bowling attack than we had 18 months back - in addition to the four right arm steamers Anderson, Broad, Woakes and Stokes, we now have a decent left armer in Curran, genuine quicks in Archer, Wood, Stone (who was quietly impressive) and Jamie O and young up and comers in Coad, Brookes, Mahmood, Fisher and Porter.

Shame we don't need 8 or 9 bowlers really because the negative is the batting. Burns is woefully out of touch, Roy might be a test 5 but isn't an opener, Denly is not test class, Root is world class (in the ranks) and Bairstow, Buttler and Stokes all need to bat six.

Don't get me started on Foakes.

If I were in charge... Assuming Root doesn't suddenly realise that he doesn't even like skippering, he stays and stays at four. Foakes plays and, sod it, with his technique, bat's three.  The rest of the top seven are Roy, Bairstow, Malan, Stokes and Buttler (if we say sod it and let the bromance open) or... actually I'm not sure from there...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on July 26, 2019, 05:31:09 PM
Ireland seemed to be trying to cart the ball which was moving down the ground way too much.. no adjustmemt for move,ent or swing etc.. really poor batting.. pitch was fine, a good test wicket where if you batted sensibly and with discipline and a brain (no little technique) you could score runs (may not be tons but 50ís) .

Both sides lacked the ability to bat time and all just wanted to tonk it (leech apart)

Ashes wise

Burns should be allowed to play as heís on his run of games to nail a spot down
Roy is another 6 but being sent out to hit out. Might score some runs but will probably fail most times (runs to come mainly on roads)
Denly isnít test quality yet again, most likely like thr two above

Root at 4 is fine, he is no top 3 batter (doesnít play the moving ball well and his game is suited to 4/5)

Then we had a load of 6/7ís but no 5ís


Iíd pay foakes as keeper as heís not only by a long way the best keeper but heís shown decent technique compared to Bairstow et all. Give him a run of games and see if he avgís more than 29.. sorry 35 that is Bairstow

Stokes.. wack him at 6/7 as the all rounder

Buttler.. if he is to play he must bat 2/3/5 and avg 40+ or we might as well start giving a go to someone else.

I still say the ashes will simply come down to how many roads are prepared and luck. Both sides canít bat so itíll jut come down to which sides batters come off the most
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on July 27, 2019, 12:27:58 AM
I would be very surprised to see Leach play in the first test next week.  He is 3rd in line for me after Ali and Rashid at a ground where only one spinner is likely to be required at best.  Ali's recent form with the bat has been dreadful but he is still the best equipped of the 3 to bat at 7/8 in a match where the seamers are likely to do most of the damage.

Rashid would be 3rd of that trio if it were up to me but I agree Moeen is clearly the first choice.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 27, 2019, 10:02:26 AM
Squads out

Jofra In. Stokes back as vice skipper.

No rashid, leach, Sibley............ any test style top 3 batsman.....etc



Top 3 looks to be burns Roy and Denly For the ashes


Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 27, 2019, 10:10:13 AM
Don't know how Moeen is in at all to be honest. Same probably applies to Bairstow
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 27, 2019, 10:13:58 AM
As expected, as much as we think certain players shouldn't be there on form and opinion

Biggest surprise arguable is Stokes back as v/c although he's stepped up since Bristol and again arguably earned it!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 27, 2019, 10:23:14 AM
Don't know how Moeen is in at all to be honest. Same probably applies to Bairstow
Because he keeps taking lots of wickets?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 27, 2019, 10:27:35 AM
Because he keeps taking lots of wickets?

I still largely consider him as a batting all-rounder and he has averaged 16 in the last year. It's hardly worthy numbers.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 27, 2019, 10:29:04 AM
As before, canít help thinking Ali is in as opposed to leach because our batting is so fragile

So they want the potential of runs lower down...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on July 27, 2019, 10:32:00 AM
Don't know how Moeen is in at all to be honest. Same probably applies to Bairstow

I'm gonna guess it's because he's the best spinner
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 27, 2019, 10:35:41 AM
I still largely consider him as a batting all-rounder and he has averaged 16 in the last year. It's hardly worthy numbers.

No argument from me thatís heís in terrible form with that bat, but his bowling form means heís worth selecting on that alone. With the added bonus that he might suddenly fire with the bat again. Your number 8 averaging 16 isnít exactly the end of the world.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 27, 2019, 10:36:28 AM
I'm gonna guess it's because he's the best spinner

He is not the best spinner available and is in the side because he can bat; except he can't do that either
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 27, 2019, 10:50:29 AM
He is not the best spinner available and is in the side because he can bat; except he can't do that either
Is that the same Moeen that has 45 wickets at 23 in his last 9 tests? If we have a spinner better theyíve yet to show it.

Like Woakes, the batting is just a bonus that helps paper over the cracks in our top order. Itís hardly Moeens fault we canít find anyone to bat 1-3.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 27, 2019, 10:51:13 AM
Yup. Still take Leach as a front liner
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 27, 2019, 10:52:50 AM
As I said earlier, I like Leach, but heíll have to be content with the number two spot until he proves heís better than Mo.

Didnít get much of a go here but going at 10 an over vs Ireland is not helping to convince me.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 27, 2019, 11:06:58 AM
Got to love this forum


No sign of finding anyone thatís decent for the top 3 batting spots. But letís instead argue about dropping the spinner with world class stats from his last 9 stats!! (23 average is ridicolous in tests, remember below 30 is classed as top drawer!!).
And a keeper batsman with 20 50s and 6 test tons and instead chuck in two relatively Unknownís int he test arena.
Thatíll sort all our issues.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 27, 2019, 11:21:49 AM
Only so often you can peddle a 20 50s and 6 tons narrative; he's averaged 25 in the past year with 3 50s and 1 ton (which in SL was impressive) and 5 ducks in 18 innings, largely at #5 which is where he wanted to be, finding this new way of just getting bowled through the gate time and time again. His glovework has also been average and the the selectors catered to his needs by dropping Foakes and having him keep again

And yeah, top 3 looks patchy; I still don't think Roy should be there and I'm disappointed that Burns hasn't been able to show what he's capable of at test level, and I say that as a Surrey supporter
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on July 27, 2019, 11:23:39 AM
Must be a while since an England opener top scored in a match and was then dropped?

Wasn't Boycott once dropped after scoring a double hundred?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on July 27, 2019, 11:25:38 AM
I think this will be a defining series for Moeen - I suspect the Aussies will look to attack him - His stats against them in tests are pretty average but he had a very good series with the ball against India. If he holds his nerve he'll have a good series but as a confidence player is he gets hammered about in the first two games he'll struggle with the final three.

I suspect Denly will do averagely. Will he be any better than Malan, Jennings, Compton, Ballance etc etc - I suspect not. I'd rather have seen some form of continuity to be honest.

Don't understand the argument for Foakes at this stage. I'm a fan of his generally but his performance for the lions was poor and he clearly isn't in the form of his life with the bat. I understand you can't rely on Bairstow's stats forever but to unseat an established player you should at least be in good nic.


http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/8917.html?class=1;template=results;type=bowling;view=innings (http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/8917.html?class=1;template=results;type=bowling;view=innings)

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 27, 2019, 11:43:11 AM
Obviously the issue isnt Moeens inclusion then, it's the capacity that he has been included in. Nobody would be up in arms if he was playing as a bowler and batting at 9 the issue is the batting looks very thin with him at 7, especially given the issues with England's top 3. Stevie Wonder could see that his batting isn't what is was, and if Curran doesn't play it means England's tail is too long.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 27, 2019, 11:49:18 AM
Obviously the issue isnt Moeens inclusion then, it's the capacity that he has been included in. Nobody would be up in arms if he was playing as a bowler and batting at 9 the issue is the batting looks very thin with him at 7, especially given the issues with England's top 3. Stevie Wonder could see that his batting isn't what is was, and if Curran doesn't play it means England's tail is too long.

Surely he wonít bat higher than 8?

Roy
Burns
Denly
Root
Bairstow
Stokes
Buttler
Ali
Woakes/Archer
Broad
Anderson

I wouldnít say that was a long tail, even with Mo in terrible form.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on July 27, 2019, 11:49:25 AM
Stokes
Bairstow
buttler

Will be 5, 6 and 7 in some Kind of order.

So moeen will be as high as 8 at best. So to me he is in as a bowler. When he turns up with the bat it will be a bonus.
He really really ainít there as a batsman.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on July 27, 2019, 12:00:06 PM
Moeen will not bat higher than 8 - If Denly doesn't play Curran will be 7, I'd say that's a strong tail.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 27, 2019, 12:04:00 PM
Forgot about Buttler so touche.


Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 27, 2019, 12:06:36 PM
As I have said previously Mo was always going to be picked over Leach. His stats are excellent over the last 9 tests, it was a choice of who is the spinner in the team, batting doesn't come into it. Also Australia will have a number of left handers in their top 6 and Mo bowls very well against LH.

The only real decision to make is Woakes vs Archer. And that will depend on pitch, conditions and Archers fitness.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 27, 2019, 12:16:25 PM
Personally from an Australian perspective I'd play

Bancroft (rh)
Warner (lh)
Khawaja (lh)
Smith (rh)
Head/Wade (lh)
Labuschagne (rh)
Paine (rh)
Pattinson (lh)
Cummins (rh)
Starc (lh)
Lyon (rh)

That I feel is a good balance to disrupt lines and not give Moeen a chance to really settle in to left handers.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: liscon12 on July 29, 2019, 07:58:20 PM
Aussie Cricket Bat Badger, I wonder if Marnus is lurking in here

https://www.cricket.com.au/news/marnus-labuschagne-hot-spot-gabba-peter-siddle-ashes-selection-first-test-interview/2019-07-29 (https://www.cricket.com.au/news/marnus-labuschagne-hot-spot-gabba-peter-siddle-ashes-selection-first-test-interview/2019-07-29)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 29, 2019, 08:26:02 PM
https://www.wisden.com/stories/opinion/unfathomable-undroppable-moeen-ali (https://www.wisden.com/stories/opinion/unfathomable-undroppable-moeen-ali)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 29, 2019, 08:52:50 PM
Interesting article on Mo, maybe more a confidence player than some others in the team. The middle and lower order has got us out of a hole regularly in recent past that continues to be the reason we have so many all rounders(you would presume), and a specialist spinner cannot be picked, same as we can't pick a specialist keeper....except the specialist keeper is also a very good batsman...but that's another thread  :)

I guess the selectors are thinking we will be 70-4 most games and at number 8 we need someone who can ...potentially....score more runs than anyone else...

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 29, 2019, 09:37:20 PM
Sounds like Root is going to bat 3. I would probably say I like him there again, but this still feels like he's being put there when he as the captain couldn't be more clearer about where he wants to be...

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27282021/joe-root-set-return-no-3-first-ashes-test (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27282021/joe-root-set-return-no-3-first-ashes-test)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 29, 2019, 09:51:50 PM
Totally right call, bayliff wants him to bat there and has done for ages. Very much doubt Root has Ďbeen toldí to bat there thou

There is so little experience (tests) in Roy/denly/Burns he needs to bat 3 and take some pressure off the team.

As the article says thou, could well be they have an eye out for another opener and Roy at 4...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 30, 2019, 09:12:34 AM
Totally right call, bayliff wants him to bat there and has done for ages. Very much doubt Root has Ďbeen toldí to bat there thou

There is so little experience (tests) in Roy/denly/Burns he needs to bat 3 and take some pressure off the team.

As the article says thou, could well be they have an eye out for another opener and Roy at 4...

Hahaha we're struggling to find one opener let alone another one, think we need a permanent night watchman at 1/2 just to solve the issue
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 30, 2019, 09:28:58 AM
Hahaha we're struggling to find one opener let alone another one, think we need a permanent night watchman at 1/2 just to solve the issue

I read some where that theyre interested in Crawley and Sibley, i wouldnt bet against sibley making his debut in the ashes at some point and crawley could go to south Africa/new zealand this winter.

we could have two new openers by the end of 2019/20 away season
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 30, 2019, 09:32:14 AM
Denly at 4 is a joke of decision. If they see Roy as best suited to 4, then bat him 4. Dom Sibley shouldíve been given a chance with the amount of runs heís scored.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 30, 2019, 09:39:49 AM
Pattinson and Khawaja have just been confirmed to play.
Love the feeling just before and ashes series!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 30, 2019, 09:43:26 AM
I read some where that theyre interested in Crawley and Sibley, i wouldnt bet against sibley making his debut in the ashes at some point and crawley could go to south Africa/new zealand this winter.

we could have two new openers by the end of 2019/20 away season

Yes read that too. Roy long term may be better at 4 but thatís more changes to the openers.

But if you look at what we have including Denly itís not exactly solid.

Myself I think Denly is a short term option

It does beg the question why did we not at least try someone new against Ireland??

Thatís what I donít get
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 30, 2019, 10:36:32 AM

It does beg the question why did we not at least try someone new against Ireland??

Thatís what I donít get

Same!!!

i think Ed Smith has got most things right since he took over as head selector but this test summer he hasnt.

Olly Stone was a good decision but i think one made because jimmy was never playing.

roy to open was always going to happen but picking him over sibley i dont agree with and i hope we dont have another burns where hes picked 2/3 years too late and at the end of a purple patch!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 30, 2019, 09:34:31 PM
Sorry not sure how to post the link but for those Moeen fans on the forum...of which I am one but not sure he should be a shoe in as number 1 spinner(who can potentially get runs from number 8)  :)... There is a refreshingly honest interview in today's guardian where as usual he strips out coached media speak and talks frankly about bring out of form, his confidence levels and how that affects his game

And batting in different  positions in the test side..which he says makes it hard to get settled and to do well.

in the current side with stokes,butler and bairstow the only position he can bat I think is 8-which is where he will be.

He said before he is a batsman who bowls, but in fact he is the exact reverse in recent years, a bit like Ashley Giles, only a better batsman!!

As @six and out says, his bowling has been pretty good the last year, and the Aussies do have a few lefthanders.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on July 30, 2019, 10:09:26 PM
His interview with the Guardian was a very good read and I agree with him that his role in this team now is as a bowler.

The selection as a whole seems to have been a conservative one - either guys with plenty of international experience or guys like Burns and Denly with a lot of county cricket behind them.

I suspect that the rather oddly timed October trip to NZ will be the opportunity for some of the younger batsmen to stake a claim
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ScottParko on July 30, 2019, 10:16:39 PM
His interview with the Guardian was a very good read and I agree with him that his role in this team now is as a bowler.

The selection as a whole seems to have been a conservative one - either guys with plenty of international experience or guys like Burns and Denly with a lot of county cricket behind them.

I suspect that the rather oddly timed October trip to NZ will be the opportunity for some of the younger batsmen to stake a claim

Read the other day that some including Root will sit NZ out with it not counting towards the Test Championship being a reason for it. Shame itís not before the Ashes really, good opportunity to get some good cricket out of some of the reserves/possible first teamers.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 31, 2019, 08:05:59 AM
All the journos (including the Aussie ones) reporting that Starc is missing out and it is between Siddle and Hazelwood for the last spot.

So they reckon they will line up -

Warner
Bancroft
Khawaja
Smith
Head
Wade
Paine
Cummins
Pattinson
Lyon
Hazelwood or Siddle
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 31, 2019, 09:27:27 AM
I'm half expecting them to go with Siddle, been here all summer so far with Essex and bowling well, used to conditions and more of an English style bowler, whoever they go for will be a test for our batsmen

Hazlewood and Starc to come in at lords
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 31, 2019, 10:09:52 AM
Warner
Bancroft
Khawaja
Smith
Head
Wade/ Labuschagne
Paine
Cummins
Pattinson
Lyon
Starc

You have to look at this and think Paine's the one that should be dropped. Oh the perks of being skipper
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on July 31, 2019, 12:09:06 PM

You have to look at this and think Paine's the one that should be dropped. Oh the perks of being skipper

Why?  Is Wade a better keeper than Paine?  The Aussie selector did not think so when they picked Paine over Wade, even though Wade was the first choice for Tasmania.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 31, 2019, 12:26:33 PM
Warner
Bancroft
Khawaja
Smith
Head
Wade/ Labuschagne
Paine
Cummins
Pattinson
Lyon
Starc

You have to look at this and think Paine's the one that should be dropped. Oh the perks of being skipper

I completely get the argument of dropping Paine - give the gloves to Wade and it opens up a slot for another batsmen (like Labuschagne) or Mitch Marsh to balance the side and have another bowling option etc...

However the last time Wade kept he was very ropey and we have all seen how difficult it can be keeping in England where the Dukes ball swings after the stumps, plus the slope at Lords etc....

I don't think it can be underestimated how important catches behind the stumps and in the slip cordon are going to be, because i think the 2 attacks are going to find plenty of edges.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on July 31, 2019, 12:39:20 PM
Why?  Is Wade a better keeper than Paine?  The Aussie selector did not think so when they picked Paine over Wade, even though Wade was the first choice for Tasmania.

Paine is definitely a better keeper, would like to see Carey against the red ball. Paine is far from a test match standard batsman.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 31, 2019, 12:54:13 PM
Team announced, Archer out, Woakes in....

Rory Burns, Jason Roy, Joe Root (c), Joe Denly, Jos Buttler, Ben Stokes, Jonny Bairstow, Moeen Ali, Chris Woakes, Stuart Broad, James Anderson

https://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/12123/11774114/chris-woakes-in-jofra-archer-out-for-englands-first-ashes-test-against-australia (https://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/12123/11774114/chris-woakes-in-jofra-archer-out-for-englands-first-ashes-test-against-australia)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kieron_BT on July 31, 2019, 12:55:17 PM
Big mistake in my opinion

Woakes and Archer should have been in, Broad out for me
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 31, 2019, 01:00:51 PM
as expected again, broad and woakes bowled themselves into the side second time round vs Ireland.

Archer was never going to be risked for this one

I hate how we announce the team the day before, no one else does it, so why do we! wait until the toss!!!!

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 31, 2019, 01:05:46 PM
Archer is carrying an injury I think from the WC so not fully fit.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on July 31, 2019, 01:14:25 PM
I hate how we announce the team the day before, no one else does it, so why do we! wait until the toss!!!!
Why could you possibly hate that?!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mo_town on July 31, 2019, 01:15:21 PM
Is that the best pair of test match openers in England today?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 31, 2019, 01:23:27 PM
Why could you possibly hate that?!

It just really annoys me!! i don't know why, i think it may have something to do with us then being incredibly rigid in how were going to play.

If we turn up to say Cardiff one day and we've named the same side as for tomorrow and its already very dry and we need two spinners, they've announced the side, are they then gonna change it?

just one of those things that annoys me that's all, also Australia all ready know who they up against and can plan in more detail now and it'll be fresh, we have no idea which bowling attack they're gonna pick
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 31, 2019, 01:23:32 PM
Is that the best pair of test match openers in England today?

Been discussed plenty on the forum that.

Hard to see what else the selectors could do at the present time
Roy I think will be in for a while maybe end up lower down

Could we blood a brand new player this series?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 31, 2019, 01:29:42 PM
It just really annoys me!! i don't know why, i think it may have something to do with us then being incredibly rigid in how were going to play.

If we turn up to say Cardiff one day and we've named the same side as for tomorrow and its already very dry and we need two spinners, they've announced the side, are they then gonna change it?

just one of those things that annoys me that's all, also Australia all ready know who they up against and can plan in more detail now and it'll be fresh, we have no idea which bowling attack they're gonna pick

Don't get me started on this! Why to we panda to the media needing to know the team.

I absolute hate the way we name the side the day before - tell the players, of course yes.......... but why tell the opposition and also let yourself be locked into a team if the conditions change.

The Aussies now know they are not facing Archer at 90mph+ bowling rockets, they will be facing Woakes, a completely different bowler. And therefore if necessary can pick accordingly.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Sam on July 31, 2019, 01:30:58 PM
It just really annoys me!! i don't know why, i think it may have something to do with us then being incredibly rigid in how were going to play.

If we turn up to say Cardiff one day and we've named the same side as for tomorrow and its already very dry and we need two spinners, they've announced the side, are they then gonna change it?

just one of those things that annoys me that's all, also Australia all ready know who they up against and can plan in more detail now and it'll be fresh, we have no idea which bowling attack they're gonna pick

The pitch isn't suddenly going to drastically change overnight. The opposition (as most journalists will) will get a pretty good idea of who's playing from who trains and how much the day before.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 31, 2019, 01:36:29 PM
The pitch isn't suddenly going to drastically change overnight. The opposition (as most journalists will) will get a pretty good idea of who's playing from who trains and how much the day before.

That's true however we saw in the world cup how incredibly bgreen some pitches we're the day before the suddenly they were cut very short, they did change
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on July 31, 2019, 01:52:54 PM
Don't get me started on this! Why to we panda to the media needing to know the team.

I absolute hate the way we name the side the day before - tell the players, of course yes.......... but why tell the opposition and also let yourself be locked into a team if the conditions change.

The Aussies now know they are not facing Archer at 90mph+ bowling rockets, they will be facing Woakes, a completely different bowler. And therefore if necessary can pick accordingly.

Glad it's not just me
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on July 31, 2019, 01:53:08 PM
Paine is definitely a better keeper, would like to see Carey against the red ball. Paine is far from a test match standard batsman.

For what it's worth Paine Averages 35 (Buttler also 35 and Bairstow 36) and is by far the best keeper in either squad, I'm not sure how much of the criticism is warranted.

I don't mind seeing old-school selection like this, in that I would call him a keeper batsman as opposed to Bairstow and Buttler who are batsman who can keep, and as a leader of men, I would say the last 12 months have proven that he is as good as anyone in world cricket.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on July 31, 2019, 02:12:30 PM
In years gone by It was said that the Australian way was to pick their best 11 then pick the captain whereas England would pick a captain then selected the other 10.  No doubt Paine doesn't make it into that 11 as a cricketer
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on July 31, 2019, 02:32:48 PM
Is that the best pair of test match openers in England today?

Nope, Cooks and Trescothick
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on July 31, 2019, 02:48:54 PM
Glad it's not just me
Can't believe you two think the Australians might change selection based on which seamers England pick... Put the boot on the other foot - how would you change the England side based on whether they play Labuschange or Marsh at 6, or Siddle vs Starc? Also can't believe that what the groundsman will do on the morning of the game might be a surprise to England in a home Ashes series!! Not that there's anything to stop them changing the team anyway.

Clive Woodward used to announce teams early as a point of principle, show some confidence, Brendan McCullum did the same. Don't totally buy into that but it's a better point of view than trying to keep your side secret because you're scared the opposition might out-select you...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on July 31, 2019, 03:02:39 PM
Can't believe you two think the Australians might change selection based on which seamers England pick... Put the boot on the other foot - how would you change the England side based on whether they play Labuschange or Marsh at 6, or Siddle vs Starc? Also can't believe that what the groundsman will do on the morning of the game might be a surprise to England in a home Ashes series!! Not that there's anything to stop them changing the team anyway.

Clive Woodward used to announce teams early as a point of principle, show some confidence, Brendan McCullum did the same. Don't totally buy into that but it's a better point of view than trying to keep your side secret because you're scared the opposition might out-select you...

I didn't say the Australians would change there side at all..... in fact i am sure they have had a side sorted before the press conference...... but that's the point.

It is all about the mental 1%, heck less than 1% that will make a difference and if that disturbs the opposition batters not knowing who's coming at them the next morning as they sleep that night, then great. If it makes no difference, then what have you lost..... nothing.

As for the pitch changing, well we have seen plenty of pitches change overnight after being under covers or whatever or more importantly weather conditions changing.

This is a general principle i am talking about though not just specific this match. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on July 31, 2019, 03:21:45 PM
For what it's worth Paine Averages 35 (Buttler also 35 and Bairstow 36) and is by far the best keeper in either squad, I'm not sure how much of the criticism is warranted.

I don't mind seeing old-school selection like this, in that I would call him a keeper batsman as opposed to Bairstow and Buttler who are batsman who can keep, and as a leader of men, I would say the last 12 months have proven that he is as good as anyone in world cricket.

Sadly the media and ECB here love buttler, Stokes, Bairstow and claim they are all world class test bats... Paine is tripe.. sadly the stats say they are all about the same.. so to slate Paine as Ďnot good enoughí is also admitting Englandís fabled stars are also a bit dire.. naturally many will come with reasons why the English ones are somehow better
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on July 31, 2019, 03:36:57 PM
I didn't say the Australians would change there side at all..... in fact i am sure they have had a side sorted before the press conference...... but that's the point.
The Aussies now know they are not facing Archer at 90mph+ bowling rockets, they will be facing Woakes, a completely different bowler. And therefore if necessary can pick accordingly.
(https://media2.giphy.com/media/K6VhXtbgCXqQU/source.gif)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on July 31, 2019, 03:50:26 PM
The Aussies now know they are not facing Archer at 90mph+ bowling rockets, they will be facing Woakes, a completely different bowler. And therefore if necessary can pick accordingly.

Do they have specialist batsman in the squad to deal with "fast medium swingers" who they'll pick now they know Woakes is playing, and different batsman who specialise in facing "90mph+ rockets" who they'll bring to negate Archer? ???
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on July 31, 2019, 05:18:21 PM
Anyone seen much of Marnus Labuschagne? I saw him bowl a bouncer at Lord's earlier in the season. Quite an interesting thing to do for someone bowling leg-breaks!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on July 31, 2019, 06:01:00 PM
I saw the pressers, I think Paine is raring to go and start the Test match. Root looks relaxed. Paine wants to make a mark and that could translate to a fiery game.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on July 31, 2019, 06:15:42 PM
Anyone else looking at this as a very big series for bairstow? Yes a great years or so but nothing significant for a couple of series
Great in one dayers but big holes in technique when the ball moves around

Or have I got the wrong player here? I like bairstow..but not at the expense of Foakes in the keeping position...

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on July 31, 2019, 06:21:17 PM
Of the 11 selected, I think only Root, Stokes and Anderson would make it into everyone's final 11, the other 8 are all open to debate. There have been far worse England teams but I can't recall many where so few were nailed on for their places.

As such I think naming the side early is a show of support in those who have been selected.  Moen spoke earlier in the week about his own lack of confidence.  Anything that might give the lads an extra boost seems sensible to me
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on July 31, 2019, 06:43:15 PM
Anyone else looking at this as a very big series for bairstow? Yes a great years or so but nothing significant for a couple of series
Great in one dayers but big holes in technique when the ball moves around

Or have I got the wrong player here? I like bairstow..but not at the expense of Foakes in the keeping position...
Bairstow is massively overrated and is fortunate to be in the Test squad let alone the playing XI. Bairstow is an average keeper yet his one day slogging gets him selected over Foakes

Guess it helps when the captain is a childhood pal...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on July 31, 2019, 08:33:42 PM
Some serious chat from Paine earlier about Edgbaston. Can't wait to see how long the nice guy stuff transpires for anyway.

Alarm set, 6am train to Brum, happy days
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 01, 2019, 04:09:11 AM
Looks like Paine's brutally honest answer has caused a significant spike in the sodium levels amongst the British tabloids haha, let the games begin!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 01, 2019, 05:27:40 AM
Paineís only ever played there against Pakistan. 🤣
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on August 01, 2019, 09:17:55 AM
Pitch looks less green than I thought we would prepare...

https://twitter.com/cricketcomau/status/1156847289392140290?s=19
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 01, 2019, 09:32:55 AM
Nerves are going this morning!

Looks like Siddle plays..
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on August 01, 2019, 09:41:24 AM
Australia win the toss and bat........ Root says he is happy and was going to bowl.

Siddle plays, no Starc.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 01, 2019, 09:42:41 AM
Australia win the toss and bat first.

Jimmy with the new pill will be wound up, as according to TMS someone reversed into his car in the hotel carpark this morning.

5 Tests of drama awaits. Come on England, bring on the Ashes to go with the World Cup! :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 01, 2019, 09:59:25 AM
I have far more confidence when we are bowling

Jimmy back with a dukes ball in hand-lovely  :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 10:03:09 AM
Call me old but Iím not a fan of the football style name and numbers on the shirts
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 01, 2019, 10:07:50 AM
That was out. Sigh
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 10:08:37 AM
Of all people that loves a review Broad didnít fancy it
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 01, 2019, 10:11:45 AM
So Warner is "out" first ball on his return to the test side and doesn't walk.
Once a cheat, always a cheat...  ;)

There's a beautiful irony that a non-walking incident was off Broad's bowling.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 10:17:47 AM
The more important thing should be the declining standard of umpiring
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 10:20:33 AM
2-1 Warner LBW
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 01, 2019, 10:25:12 AM
That was out. Sigh

Smashed one and didnít walk?

Guess we knew he was a (No Swearing Please) bloke already  :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 01, 2019, 10:25:52 AM
Karma that... would have been saved on review!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on August 01, 2019, 10:30:46 AM
I wouldn't have walked either!  :D In fairness to the umpire it could easily have been bat on floor, so if he's unsure give the benefit to the batsman and allow England to review. I thought it was out tho live. Didn't think the LB was, but then why didn't Bancroft tell him to review?

Get the feeling we'll need some more early ones here. Reckon it'll get a lot easier later.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 01, 2019, 11:50:12 AM
Good thing Khawaja had time to prepare for Woakes overnight ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 01, 2019, 12:11:07 PM
Jimmy injured? hes bowled 4 overs 3 maidens for 1 run?? why not more?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on August 01, 2019, 12:16:40 PM
Jimmy injured? hes bowled 4 overs 3 maidens for 1 run?? why not more?

They just said on TMS that Jimmy reported tightness in his calf at the end of his 4th over
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 01, 2019, 12:19:40 PM
They just said on TMS that Jimmy reported tightness in his calf at the end of his 4th over

Just seen on the live feed he's going for a scan!!

fingers of the nation are crossed!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on August 01, 2019, 12:33:09 PM
Just seen on the live feed he's going for a scan!!

fingers of the nation are crossed!

Makes you wonder what it was like to start with, if it is feeling tight after just 4 overs.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 01, 2019, 12:47:38 PM
Yeah everything crossed

At 37 he is only one bad injury away from...well Iím not saying it

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on August 01, 2019, 12:48:43 PM
Just turned on... didn't think it would bother me but the names and numbers look dreadful.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 01, 2019, 12:59:40 PM
Just turned on... didn't think it would bother me but the names and numbers look dreadful.

Decidedly ugly
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 01, 2019, 01:03:52 PM
Just turned on... didn't think it would bother me but the names and numbers look dreadful.

Ours are better than the aussies!

Much prefer the smaller font we've gone for, more annoying is the lack of name/number on jumpers!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 01, 2019, 01:05:02 PM
Just turned on... didn't think it would bother me but the names and numbers look dreadful.

Agreed awful

And the random numbers make it more pointless
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 01, 2019, 01:10:19 PM
Woakes gets Head!  :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 01:13:37 PM
250 might be a good score on this pitch considering Anderson's availability is uncertain
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 01:18:10 PM
Smith survives an LBW by the thinnest margin
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 01, 2019, 01:20:58 PM
When are we gonna finally #DropWoakes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 01:23:20 PM
Umpiring is so bad. 5th wrong decision inside 35 overs
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on August 01, 2019, 01:23:33 PM
How Matthew Wade got in a test team is beyond me... Also, Joel Wilson has has a terrible couple of overs there.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 01, 2019, 01:25:24 PM
Chris Woakes is a good player  :o
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 01, 2019, 01:25:34 PM
Imagine how many poles Woakes would have taken if the Aussies didn't have that extra 24 hours to prepare for him... ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on August 01, 2019, 01:27:27 PM
Imagine how many poles Woakes would have taken if the Aussies didn't have that extra 24 hours to prepare for him... ;)
😂🤣
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on August 01, 2019, 01:33:07 PM
What are the numbers? Are they squad numbers or numbers attributed to the central contracts? The look doesn't bother me but the whole thing does seem a bit pointless, especially since 3/4 of the players on the pitch are facing front on anyway!

Woakes bowling beautifully as expected and Broad was bowling at real pace this morning - been a while since we've seen that. Fingers crossed for Jimmy though!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 01:35:38 PM
ODI/T20 shirt numbers
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 01, 2019, 01:42:29 PM
That was peak village from Paine
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 01, 2019, 01:47:11 PM
Remember last week when nobody wanted Broad or Woakes in the side?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 01, 2019, 01:49:40 PM
Aleem Dar giving Aussies a reason to whinge never stops being funny
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 01, 2019, 01:49:50 PM
Oh my days, the umpiring this Test has been atrocious!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: KettonJake on August 01, 2019, 01:50:07 PM
I'm there for day 1 against Ireland.

I won't be as quick as others to write Broad off.

However if Ballance plays test cricket again I may take up baseball.

Hi.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 01:50:49 PM
ICC should get rid of the umpires and just have every decision checked by DRS. 6 wrong decisions in 40 overs
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 01, 2019, 02:01:42 PM
Great leave from Cummins
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 01, 2019, 02:03:56 PM
warne describing the umpiring as horrific


I think we get some rough ones, normally it gets worse if it starts like this!!

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 01, 2019, 02:07:04 PM
While the umpiring has been awful, so has Australia's (lack of) use of DRS...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 01, 2019, 02:13:27 PM
I don't want to say any good things about Smith...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on August 01, 2019, 02:13:30 PM
I always surprised about the lack of love for Stuart Broad give  that he is England's second highest wicket taker and the 7th highest wicket taker in test history.  He has produced so many game changing spells over the years
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 01, 2019, 02:13:48 PM
CBF poster's curse is a real thing. :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 01, 2019, 02:14:27 PM
Good review Peter! As for the umpiring... :o
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on August 01, 2019, 02:15:31 PM
Umpire appointments for the Ashes -

On field Umpires x2, TV Umpire, Match Referee
1st Test   Joel Wilson, Aleem Dar, Chris Gaffaney, Ranjan Madugalle,
2nd Test   Aleem Dar, Chris Gaffaney, Joel Wilson, Ranjan Madugalle   
3rd Test   Chris Gaffaney, Joel Wilson, Kumar Dharmasena, Javagal Srinath   
4th Test   Ruchira Palliyaguruge, Marais Erasmus,Kumar Dharmasena, Javagal Srinath   
5th Test   Kumar Dharmasena, Marais Erasmus, Ruchira Palliyaguruge, Javagal Srinath   
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 01, 2019, 02:16:37 PM
Umpire appointments for the Ashes -

On field Umpires x2, TV Umpire, Match Referee
1st Test   Joel Wilson, Aleem Dar, Chris Gaffaney, Ranjan Madugalle,
2nd Test   Aleem Dar, Chris Gaffaney, Joel Wilson, Ranjan Madugalle   
3rd Test   Chris Gaffaney, Joel Wilson, Kumar Dharmasena, Javagal Srinath   
4th Test   Ruchira Palliyaguruge, Marais Erasmus,Kumar Dharmasena, Javagal Srinath   
5th Test   Kumar Dharmasena, Marais Erasmus, Ruchira Palliyaguruge, Javagal Srinath

4th and 5th will be ok. Erasmus is a good umpire even if Dharmasena had a shocking world cup
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 02:18:38 PM
Smith is in a class of one in Test cricket. Kohli and Williamson are great yet no way near Smith
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: six and out on August 01, 2019, 02:26:30 PM
4th and 5th will be ok. Erasmus is a good umpire even if Dharmasena had a shocking world cup

I wonder whether it is time to have 1 English and 1 Aussie umpire in the Ashes - they are so much better than the other umpires.

Only 5 out of the 12 Elite Panel Umpires aren't from either England or Australia - so it doesn't leave much options
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 01, 2019, 02:28:11 PM
Smith is in a class of one in Test cricket. Kohli and Williamson are great yet no way near Smith

Yes. Truly remarkable. Absolute legend.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 01, 2019, 02:36:29 PM
Smith is in a class of one in Test cricket. Kohli and Williamson are great yet no way near Smith

Canít argue with this.. guy is levels above kohli and Williamson
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 01, 2019, 02:37:38 PM
These umpires are like league umpires.. so so so bad they ruin games
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 01, 2019, 02:43:16 PM
Canít argue with this.. guy is levels above kohli and Williamson

Its like he has Kholi's hunger for runs and carrying the side in ODIs but converted into the test format
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 01, 2019, 02:44:55 PM
Its like he has Kholi's hunger for runs and carrying the side in ODIs but converted into the test format

Other players have their days out and look great but you know itís just a flash in the pan (stokes vs sa, rohit in India etc) .. smith just keeps playing test cricket and being boringly consistent
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 01, 2019, 02:47:36 PM
Itís a shame he got boos after reaching 50. Also pretty stupid - you donít want to give extra motivation to a player like Smith
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 01, 2019, 03:23:24 PM
Itís a shame he got boos after reaching 50. Also pretty stupid - you donít want to give extra motivation to a player like Smith

and you dont want cheats in the game, they should never have taken sandpaper onto the field, that "extra motivation" worked for Mr Warner didnt it today!

give 'em hell! they would to us!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mo_town on August 01, 2019, 03:25:39 PM
I wonder whether it is time to have 1 English and 1 Aussie umpire in the Ashes - they are so much better than the other umpires.

Only 5 out of the 12 Elite Panel Umpires aren't from either England or Australia - so it doesn't leave much options

Racist much?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 01, 2019, 03:27:08 PM
and you dont want cheats in the game, they should never have taken sandpaper onto the field, that "extra motivation" worked for Mr Warner didnt it today!

give 'em hell! they would to us!!

Tbf the players couldnít care less what the drunk footy fans do. Cheer or boo..

Warne and Sanga said as much and Iíd trust an ex player to be honest over a current one
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 01, 2019, 03:27:41 PM
Racist much?

How is that racist ?

Wow
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 03:36:24 PM
S Ravi the Indian umpire was pretty rubbish but unfortunately most of the others are pretty rubbish as well eg Wilson is clearly incompetent
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 01, 2019, 03:39:58 PM
Tbf the players couldnít care less what the drunk footy fans do. Cheer or boo..

Warne and Sanga said as much and Iíd trust an ex player to be honest over a current one

Exactly, I saw an interview with Roy where he said he doesnt hear anything when in the middle unless its seriously loud!

They're professional sportsmen they should be able to switch off from it
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 01, 2019, 04:02:48 PM
Racist much?

Little quick of the mark there with the predictable 'racist' remark.

It's got nothing to do with race, it's to do with ability. The commentators were said thatthey felt the Aussie and English umpires were currently the best on the list.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 01, 2019, 04:09:53 PM
Siddle is no mug with the bat. Looks well organised and tidy
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 01, 2019, 04:30:11 PM
Moeen \o/
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 01, 2019, 04:30:15 PM
Thank God for that
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 01, 2019, 04:53:33 PM
That's predictable, Aussies crap Smith class
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 01, 2019, 04:53:57 PM
Thatís some knock from smith!

Answering with the bat
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 01, 2019, 04:55:38 PM
Different gravy is Steven Smith. Well played. 24 centuries in 118 innings. Crazy
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 01, 2019, 05:15:43 PM
This is now a very good score
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 01, 2019, 05:19:01 PM
This is some abject bowling to try and force something
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 01, 2019, 05:20:38 PM
Steve chuffing Smith!!




Very defective captaincy at mo. Not sure we have the batsman for 250plus........
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 01, 2019, 05:36:33 PM
Dammit! We have to bat now......... Iím nervous.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 01, 2019, 05:37:14 PM
That was a carbon copy of Kohli last year
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 01, 2019, 05:37:46 PM
No leach tonight to open up - who do they send in
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 01, 2019, 05:39:52 PM
No leach tonight to open up - who do they send in

Andersonís injured
Broads #####
Ali canít bat currently


So sir Christoper roger woakes?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 01, 2019, 05:41:59 PM
The biggest victory of the day seems to be from the Australian selectors in picking Siddle Vs England opting to go with Anderson. You don't need to be a medical professional to know that being in your late 30's + Calf injuries = bad news
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 01, 2019, 05:45:20 PM
We are about to bat and thatís where it can go pear shaped very quickly

2 nightwatchmen and a 3rd padded up at 3?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 01, 2019, 05:46:07 PM
Burns and Roy approach.

We reckon burns will want off the mark as soon as?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 01, 2019, 06:17:42 PM
Well batted Roy and burns
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 01, 2019, 06:19:29 PM
Smith!!! Awesome!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 01, 2019, 06:28:48 PM
Suffice to say even when the job is to see two overs out that Roy will take them on.

I guess we have a game on
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Jordansh on August 01, 2019, 06:53:28 PM
Dissapointing to see Aus get to nearly 300 from when they were 130odd-8 but I think most people would have taken it at the start of the day and England none down is a bonus.

Crowd was incredibly hostile today but Smith is just different gravy
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 01, 2019, 07:52:24 PM
I cant stand Steve Smith even before the whole sandpaper business but even more now, along with those other two cheating idiots. However Smith is a class act with bat in hand, I havenít seen any of todays game yet but after a great start and getting Australia in a lot of bother they have mustered an ok 1st innings score held together by a class bat.

Now our batters need to give our bowlers and Jimmy a couple of days rest and muster a 500+ score
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 01, 2019, 07:53:48 PM
I bet Anderson told England management he was fit to play. P*ss poor decisions all round.

Have faith though, I fancy our batting if we get through the first 10 tomorrow- Roy might be a wrecking ball!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Sam on August 01, 2019, 10:27:06 PM
I bet Anderson told England management he was fit to play. P*ss poor decisions all round.

Have faith though, I fancy our batting if we get through the first 10 tomorrow- Roy might be a wrecking ball!!

Anderson was regularly bowling prior to and during the Ireland test over a week ago now.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 02, 2019, 12:57:33 AM
So the worlds best (Bradman) and second best (smith) Test batsmen in history both used very unorthodox technique- time to burn the official coaching manual for good?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 02, 2019, 05:30:18 AM

Now our batters need to give our bowlers and Jimmy a couple of days rest and muster a 500+ score

Unfortunately for Jimmy, I don't think a couple of days, let alone a couple of weeks would make a difference if he has strained another calf. I wouldn't be surprised if he called it a day at the end of this test match.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 02, 2019, 06:11:06 AM
Unfortunately for Jimmy, I don't think a couple of days, let alone a couple of weeks would make a difference if he has strained another calf. I wouldn't be surprised if he called it a day at the end of this test match.

I really hope not. He doesnít do much media interviews but always thought he had a lot of hunger to continue but I guess injuries at his age now (same age as me) is a big ask for the body. Letís just say if he canít no longer take any part in this series than itís just got even closer. Got to see how this Australian attack goes today. No starc or Hazelwood could be a great result for us although Cummins is a class bowler as well as Lyon
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 02, 2019, 06:58:25 AM
I really hope not. He doesnít do much media interviews but always thought he had a lot of hunger to continue but I guess injuries at his age now (same age as me) is a big ask for the body. Letís just say if he canít no longer take any part in this series than itís just got even closer. Got to see how this Australian attack goes today. No starc or Hazelwood could be a great result for us although Cummins is a class bowler as well as Lyon

It's certainly not the way you want to see a modern great leave the game but the body is only capable of so much for so long and hunger aside I'm not sure he would be in the best side going past this series with the emergence of Archer and improvement of woakes.

Siddle is much of a muchness for Hazelwood, only vastly more experienced in these conditions and Pattinson can be every bit as dangerous as Starc so it's going to be a really interesting day. I feel like Siddle, much like broad and woakes, will be the bowler who just does enough with the ball either way today.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 02, 2019, 07:31:24 AM
Anderson was regularly bowling prior to and during the Ireland test over a week ago now.

No he wasn't. It was decided not to select him for the Ireland test because he couldn't run in and bowl full tilt, only jogging.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 02, 2019, 07:32:06 AM
However disappointing the second part of that day was, I think I'd still have taken 284 all out at the toss.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 02, 2019, 08:03:59 AM
However disappointing the second part of that day was, I think I'd still have taken 284 all out at the toss.

It will be nervous watching us bat thou I think
Both sides have good bowlers and the wicket is doing just enough...

I think Jason Roy is going to have to play naturally, if he tried to defend he will nick behind
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 02, 2019, 08:50:56 AM
Yes it counts!  :).
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 02, 2019, 09:14:39 AM
So the worlds best (Bradman) and second best (smith) Test batsmen in history both used very unorthodox technique- time to burn the official coaching manual for good?

You could, but no such thing exists.

Smith is a great batsman, but no way the second best in history!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 02, 2019, 09:17:55 AM
* Bradman thought Sachin the most similar batsman he had seen to him in technique.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 02, 2019, 09:33:09 AM
You could, but no such thing exists.

Smith is a great batsman, but no way the second best in history!

Who's better though?

I know it's hard to compare between eras, and stats don't tell a full story, but Smith's numbers simply don't lie. He's a great batsman! Still a s**t bloke though...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 02, 2019, 10:13:12 AM
Who's better though?

I know it's hard to compare between eras, and stats don't tell a full story, but Smith's numbers simply don't lie. He's a great batsman! Still a s**t bloke though...

Stats donít lie over a lengthy period Smith is up there with the best of the modern players, so a modern great

The tricky thing deceiding who is second best is comparing eraís, only a small group averaged in the 60ís

South African players like pollock and Barry Richards could not play because SA had a banned period when they were in their prime
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 02, 2019, 10:17:36 AM
Just looked at Barry Richards stats

4 test matches av 72
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 10:25:57 AM
Oh look, Roy gone I am so, so shocked.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 02, 2019, 10:41:19 AM
Roy gone but to a good ball, he was got out not got himself out

yes playing with hard hands but he looks to be trying to let the ball come to him which is encouraging, lets back the lad i think he'll turn out alright!

big day for root now though
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 02, 2019, 10:53:00 AM
Roy gone but to a good ball, he was got out not got himself out

yes playing with hard hands but he looks to be trying to let the ball come to him which is encouraging, lets back the lad i think he'll turn out alright!

big day for root now though

Yep I think Roy May end up in the middle order but both him and Burns really have to be given a good run

I quite like Burns, he is unorthodox but once again plenty of players have been over the years

The lad has been consistent for Surrey over 5 seasons
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 11:09:10 AM
Another umpiring howler
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 02, 2019, 11:18:59 AM
Another umpiring howler

another DRS miss from AUS
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: e4sby on August 02, 2019, 11:19:34 AM
Another umpiring howler

Another DRS referral howler too
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on August 02, 2019, 11:33:51 AM
Joe Root has just managed to get a bowled overturned on review, hero.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 11:34:04 AM
Very lucky boy
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 02, 2019, 11:40:41 AM
Who's better though?

I know it's hard to compare between eras, and stats don't tell a full story, but Smith's numbers simply don't lie. He's a great batsman! Still a s**t bloke though...

Viv, Sachin, Lara...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 12:07:27 PM
Decent session that, hope they can keep it up
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on August 02, 2019, 12:34:33 PM
Who's better though?

I know it's hard to compare between eras, and stats don't tell a full story, but Smith's numbers simply don't lie. He's a great batsman! Still a s**t bloke though...

I don't think stats give a complete picture even within an era.  If you play your home games in batting friendly conditions like Smith does, you are going to have a massive advantage statistically than a guy like Kane Williamson who plays his home games in bowler friendly conditions.

Smith averages 77 in tests in Australia on straight up and down pitches against the Kookaburra ball which is significantly above his career record.  Compare it to someone like Viv Richards who averaged less at home on lively pitches than he did when playing away
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 01:00:40 PM
Another umpiring error. I've lost count now...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 02, 2019, 01:02:58 PM
Itís bit like a club match when your umps ainít turned up so you take two from the oppo

Ď donít worry our lads are fairí
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 02, 2019, 01:09:58 PM
Well done Burns keep going  :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 02, 2019, 01:16:53 PM
Burns a lucky boy with the lack of review but.. heís making it count and appears to be actually playing nice long format cricket. Keep going lad.. 8th test for him and avg 22 so after the ashes he really needs to have his stats up to 35+ at least really.

Roy.. sigh.. shock horror.. just shouldnít be there sadly. Iím sure he will Ďcome goodí, sorry come off at some point but he just wants to go at the ball ans we donít need another 5/6
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 02, 2019, 01:32:57 PM
Another umpiring error. I've lost count now...

I watched the highlights yesterday, and of the 7 ďerrorsĒ only two (siddle lbw that he edged and wade lbw that was plumb) seemed like obvious errors. All the others seemed too close to call and on first viewing seemed like reasonable decisions.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 02, 2019, 01:34:47 PM

Roy.. sigh.. shock horror.. just shouldnít be there sadly. Iím sure he will Ďcome goodí, sorry come off at some point but he just wants to go at the ball ans we donít need another 5/6

I think we see something different here, his dismissal today wasn't just a hard handed push.

he was trying to wait and get the ball down it bounced and carried.

yes OK i admit is wasn't butter soft hands but ti wasn't a flat foot hard hand push either.

He is clearly trying to adapt admittedly that should be for surrey not in the test game but come on lets back the lad and not just criticise and say hes a white ball slogger when he gets out.

Our openers (read Roy) are allowed to get good balls, they're allowed to nick them occasionally and get out, that's cricket. its not because hes made his case playing one day stuff
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 02:18:49 PM
And now here is where I worry about a collapse...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 02, 2019, 02:30:25 PM
Thought Paine got his bowling combinations wrong in the middle session. Siddle, naturally, is a very economical bowler and he should've be paired with Lyon much earlier. I know the aussies are obsessed with pace but aside from the new ball I don't see why Paine always bowls Cummins and Pattinson together. You can quite easily rotate the two fast men in bursts whilst Lyon and Siddle dry up the runs.

Anyway Root looked solid today. Unfortunately missed a century.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 02, 2019, 02:59:50 PM
Should sides just let root get to 50 and wait for him to get himself out just after that?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 02, 2019, 03:04:15 PM
Delighted for Burns...the coaching manual has many good guidelines for us ameteurs but itís not the be all and end all of batting

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 03:30:37 PM
New ball to the Aussie rescue. Ah.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 02, 2019, 03:35:18 PM
These 2018 duke score look much more interesting
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 03:37:12 PM
How on Earth is this replacement 'nearly' 60 overs old
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 02, 2019, 03:38:39 PM
How on Earth is this replacement 'nearly' 60 overs old

Unconfirmed reports that Cameron Bancroft was seen going into the umpires room with a Toolstation bag after the close of play yesterday!  ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on August 02, 2019, 03:40:29 PM
Australia haven't had much luck today - neither Root nor Burns looked at all solid - but this change of ball has certainly made things happen.  Small margins at this level
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 03:48:59 PM
Independent inquiry into the ball please
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 02, 2019, 03:49:06 PM
this "new" ball is doing all sorts, buttler squared up and gone
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 02, 2019, 04:11:00 PM
Well batted Rory burns. What a time to turn up.

Ashes ton in the bag.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 04:13:48 PM
STRONG SURREY STRONG ENGLAND
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 02, 2019, 04:16:28 PM
RORY!!! keep going boy!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 02, 2019, 04:51:45 PM
Are there any highlights on terrestrial TV?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 02, 2019, 04:54:25 PM
Are there any highlights on terrestrial TV?

7pm on Channel 5, I believe, Mr Cattus
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 02, 2019, 04:56:11 PM
Hurrah!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 05:01:05 PM
Awful review
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Buzz on August 02, 2019, 05:29:55 PM
Not going to lie, I would have dropped Rory...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 02, 2019, 05:40:54 PM
Not going to lie, I would have dropped Rory...

10 out of 10 for honesty Mr Buzz... a lot less for judgement  :)

Burns has deserved a good run, we have to stick with these guys, Roy is the same although I think Denly is short term and JR could well end up at 4 if Root continues with no 3
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 02, 2019, 05:43:08 PM
Brilliant day of cricket
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 02, 2019, 05:51:17 PM
Boom! England only Laing for wickets in a day shocker!

Have we batted well?
Have Australia bowled poor?
Is it a road?
Or has root moving to 3 and not leaving 3 new ones with the new ball and putting us in trouble before we start done the trick?



Also loved the Hollis stand giving pattinson some! This morning to Roy and root he literally was running up and shouting at them everytime he beat the bat.
Couldnít happen to a nicer bloke and that......
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 02, 2019, 08:09:56 PM


Now our batters need to give our bowlers and Jimmy a couple of days rest and muster a 500+ score
[/quote]

Yes England great days batting and half way towards a 500+ score Black unit that 2nd new ball tomorrow and start all over again, keep Australia in the field for at least 2 whole days
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 02, 2019, 09:14:24 PM
Burns has a jumpy batting trigger like Smtih and very fast hands.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 02, 2019, 09:33:56 PM
STRONG SURREY STRONG ENGLAND

Arent you losing to more or less everyone and desperately grateful its only one down in the Championship this year? 😉
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 03, 2019, 10:56:11 AM
Strong Surrey? Hmmm.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: liscon12 on August 03, 2019, 11:17:09 AM
Bloody hell Mo......🤔
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 03, 2019, 11:17:34 AM
That was brain-dead batting at its finest
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 03, 2019, 11:20:11 AM
Why's Moeen batting ahead of Woakes?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 03, 2019, 11:22:08 AM
This is abject
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 03, 2019, 11:22:28 AM
The good old England collapse is back.
L

Yesterday must have been a one off.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 03, 2019, 11:22:55 AM
Bairstow over Foakes more ridiculous by every passing innings
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 03, 2019, 11:27:15 AM
Bairstow really doesn't deserve to be in the team
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 03, 2019, 11:28:32 AM
Bairstow really doesn't deserve to be in the team
Old Jonny is tight with young Joe...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 03, 2019, 11:32:46 AM
I think we have seen over the last year why the toys came out once Foakes showed how good he is with the gloves, he is a brilliant one day batsman but not good enough over 12 months as a batsman alone in tests

Firmly of the belief we play the best keeper, who also happens to be a good batsman. Foakes FC stats don't lie over 5 years.

Keeping wise Foakes is up there with Foster and Read.difference is he is a far better batsman.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Buzz on August 03, 2019, 12:41:44 PM
There is literally zero point in having this debate because the selectors won't entertain it.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 03, 2019, 12:52:12 PM
Broad has swept Lyon wonderfully
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 03, 2019, 12:54:33 PM
This match still has life in it. It is unreasonable to expect that a side will bat more than 2 days.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 03, 2019, 02:26:03 PM
Good lead that
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 03, 2019, 02:51:50 PM
Absolutely shocking umpiring AGAIN
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 03, 2019, 02:52:06 PM
Howís he not given that?

How warner not walked....... oh wait.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 03, 2019, 03:03:55 PM
Howís he not given that?

How warner not walked....... oh wait.

This!! At least England had reviews!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 03, 2019, 03:09:01 PM
Absolutely shocking umpiring AGAIN

This is how itís described online:

ďĒBroad to Warner, OUT, huge appeal from Bairstow and the slips! Broad isn't so sure, but the cordon is adamant there was a noise as Warner flirted outside off! It's gone to a review and the crowd like what they've seen already! Almost off the back of the bat as Warner tried to leave that uncomfortable kicking back-of-a-length, and that's 450 wickets for Broad, and a massive one at thatĒĒ

So if the bowler didnít seem sure about reviewing it, is it really a shocker that the umpire had doubts about whether this was an edge?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 03, 2019, 03:21:27 PM
Happy for Mo, village from Bancroft
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 03, 2019, 04:07:34 PM
How bloody good is Ben Stokes?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 03, 2019, 06:25:04 PM
124-3 at stumps. Smith 46* and proving to be a royal pain in the rear. Get Smith early tomorrow and we win easily.

On a tangent Joe Burns must be spitting feathers that heís sat at home whilst Bancroft took his place.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 03, 2019, 06:49:41 PM
Smith is key but not so confident as he can bat with the lower order very well
Stokes and Ali leak a few runs as well and we are a bowler down.

If they can get a overall lead of 160-180 not sure we are favourites

Mo needs to show he is capable of making an impact tommorow

It is turning.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 04, 2019, 08:27:58 AM
Iíd say itís a big career day for Mo today. His batting has gone off a cliff and he should be batting beneath Broad. The wicket is great for him and he should be a real handful, not going at over 5 an over.

Thereís a real chance he could bowl himself out of the side today and not into hero-status. I hope not, because I like him as a cricketer, however confidence is a b*stard and we need guys in top form to win these Ashes

And donít get me started on Anderson!!!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 04, 2019, 09:13:35 AM
Smith is key but not so confident as he can bat with the lower order very well

He helped put on 150 odd with the final two wickets...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 04, 2019, 09:28:04 AM
He helped put on 150 odd with the final two wickets...

Yeah that's a skill in itself being about to protect the lower players.

Smith whatever the crowd chant and the fans think, is top class...probably the best in the world right now.

Agree with Cat this is a big day for Mo, love the bloke but there are no runs coming and he has bowled really well when there is another spinner in the team...

We ain't got that now so we need him not to go at 5 an over and get some wickets.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 04, 2019, 11:00:54 AM
Pretty dire first hour
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Byo on August 04, 2019, 11:03:49 AM
Mo has had a shocker this morning, not looking like taking a wicket.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 04, 2019, 11:22:13 AM
Best keeper in the country is Bairstow
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on August 04, 2019, 11:25:12 AM
Unbelievable from bairstow and the selectors.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 04, 2019, 11:33:45 AM
BBC stats man:
Smith has scored a century and fifty in the same match 9 times.
Kohli has done this 8 times, Williamson 6 times and Root twice.

Smith has also batted fewer innings than the other 3. Staggering domination
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 04, 2019, 11:48:00 AM
Even the 3rd umpire canít get no balls right. Stokes has cut the line
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 04, 2019, 11:52:08 AM
Side on, no he hasn't.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Buzz on August 04, 2019, 12:07:26 PM
Side on, no he hasn't.
He did, back foot.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 04, 2019, 12:20:43 PM
Is Woakes injured?  Cricinfo scorecard shows him bowling one 6 overs so far.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 04, 2019, 12:24:02 PM
Injured playing football in the warm up I heard.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 04, 2019, 12:37:56 PM
Injured playing football in the warm up I heard.

Whatís the fascination with football during warmups?  Seems lots of players are getting injured doing that.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 04, 2019, 12:46:45 PM
Can't be that injured he is bowling now, Root don't seem to have confidence in Ali and that's a worry. He just leaks too many runs.

Another 50 runs and we are def second in this game I reckon
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 04, 2019, 12:50:17 PM
The remarkable Steven Smith becomes the first man to score twin Ashes hundreds since Matthew Hayden in Brisbane 2002. This is the first time itís happened in England since Stephen Waugh Manchester 1997. Incredible

Second fastest to 25 test centuries in 119 innings - 8 fewer than Kohli
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 04, 2019, 12:57:54 PM
Well batted steve Smith.

How do you get this guy out?? Seriously. His leave is annoying though.



England definitely not favourites now.....
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 04, 2019, 01:18:47 PM
What's a good lead for last 1.25 days of batting in Edgbaston? AUS leading by 160+ at the moment. Is there a plan here to up the run rate and get ENG to bat?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on August 04, 2019, 01:28:09 PM
Does anybody else think England do not use their variations sparingly enough? For example Woakes just bowled two slower balls in one over - it's a bit of a ODI attitude to me. In Anderson's book he talks about variation needing to be a complete surprise to be effective. You need to bowl so many balls in the same place that the batsman get's into a rhythm of playing it, and then the variation forces the false shot, bowling variation constantly and consistently changing length and line isn't helping anybody.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 04, 2019, 01:31:10 PM
How poor has moeen been - better off picking leach
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 04, 2019, 01:42:03 PM
Moeen is a mediocre bowler the majority of his wickets are when batsmen attack him looking for cheap ribs as itís difficult to score against Anderson, Broad etc.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 04, 2019, 02:37:09 PM
Moeen should of had a big part of the day but Root does not have the runs to give him an extended run.

We really need someone who can keep it tight when the game gets tight. Swann did that so did Panesar at his peak.

Leach would be my pick along with the best keeper. I don't care how many left handers they have you need the best bowler.

Woakes and broad now in danger of doing too much bowling because we can't stop the flow
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: manno on August 04, 2019, 02:44:10 PM
Who cuts Stokes hair?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 04, 2019, 03:12:56 PM
Will Paine declare after reaching 400 or will he target number of overs left in the day?  Maybe 8 to 10 overs and hope to get 1 wicket.  If England lose one tonight who will come out as night watchman?  Moeen or Woakes?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 04, 2019, 03:24:17 PM
Wade brings up his hundred, first in over 6 years
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 04, 2019, 03:27:39 PM
Wade seems to be using shorter blade longer handle specs.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 04, 2019, 03:27:41 PM
Where are the 'Moeen took 46 at 23 last year' brigade
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 04, 2019, 03:42:53 PM
And we now have a review thrown away
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 04, 2019, 03:44:40 PM
Where are the 'Moeen took 46 at 23 last year' brigade


Still here, hasnít bowled well at all this test, still picked up two wickets and should have had a third.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 04, 2019, 03:48:16 PM
Where are the 'Moeen took 46 at 23 last year' brigade

Good bowlers are allowed to bowl poorly now and again.

Moeen is still England's best test spinner.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 04, 2019, 03:48:51 PM
Moeen isnít anyway near Englandís best spinner. Leach is twice the bowler
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 04, 2019, 03:59:00 PM
Remember people! One or two tests that donít go right, and your dropped never to be able to be picked again!!





Thereíd be a lot of players on the scrap heap not allowed to be picked again if this forum had any selection powers. Iím glad it doesnít for one l.





4 days in to the first test, and we are already moaning.  Good old English fans.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 04, 2019, 04:11:38 PM
Moeen isnít anyway near Englandís best spinner. Leach is twice the bowler

Twice the bowler? Hmmm, so he'd obviously outbowl Moeen by a clear distance if they played in the same match right?

(https://i.imgur.com/PMzdrIW.png)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 04, 2019, 04:16:22 PM
Another umpire error, this time because we lost our reviews we can't do anything
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 04, 2019, 04:25:29 PM
Moeen continues to embarrass himself with another head high full toss. Pathetic
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 04, 2019, 04:26:43 PM
Twice the bowler? Hmmm, so he'd obviously outbowl Moeen by a clear distance if they played in the same match right?

(https://i.imgur.com/PMzdrIW.png)
When Leach plays 60 Tests he won't be averaging 36 runs per wicket
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on August 04, 2019, 04:33:01 PM
What am I missing here? Number 9 is in - how about some gentle part time leg spin?!?!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 04, 2019, 04:35:34 PM
This is embarrassing
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 04, 2019, 04:40:31 PM
Australia should have declared a good 20 minutes ago
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Duck Duck Mongoose on August 04, 2019, 04:42:19 PM
Australia should have declared a good 20 minutes ago

Totally agree, could come back to bite them
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 04, 2019, 04:45:29 PM
Too late to declare now anyway, too dark
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 04, 2019, 04:45:44 PM
I think Woakes is carrying an injury after all, impossible to explain why he has bowled so few overs. With JA  out everyone is getting tired.

Mo is a fans favourite, certainly one of mine but he is short on confidence and we cannot carry anyone in this series.

He fully admits, to his absolute credit, how short on confidence he is in a recent interview in the Guardian.at least the guy is devoid of any coached media speak.

Pitches are pretty dry, I think myself Leach will be in for the next match. Wonder whether there will be a spot for Sam Curran too.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 04, 2019, 04:52:23 PM
Australia 487-7 declared. England need 398
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 04, 2019, 04:59:15 PM
100 overs at 4 rpo or bat out over a day!

Not looking good!

Absolute disgrace, this was lost when we had them sat 122-8 and let them get nearly 300! 150ao as it should have bene weds have had a 200 ish run lead and it's a totally different game!!

Eh well bat long lads! Come on England!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 04, 2019, 05:04:23 PM
Yep we are going to have to dig in now and hope some weather plays a part tommorow.

Lyon can land it in the danger area more often than not you would think he will be bowling a lot tommorow
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 04, 2019, 05:28:58 PM
90 to go!! 10 wickets in hand!!

Not the shot to play last up but Roy survives!

Come on lads big day tomorrow!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 04, 2019, 06:01:30 PM
Good bowlers are allowed to bowl poorly now and again.

Moeen is still England's best test spinner.

I donít feel heís a strike spin bowler. He was tolerated when his batting backed him up, but now thatís gone, and heís openly admitted in the press during an Ashes series that his confidence is gone.

Heís shot and should be replaced, we have an important series to win. No time for extended patience or sentiment
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 04, 2019, 08:56:27 PM
George Dobell hitting the nail on the head https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27322239/england-desperately-needed-their-spinner-stand-moeen-ali-failed-deliver (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27322239/england-desperately-needed-their-spinner-stand-moeen-ali-failed-deliver)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Buzz on August 04, 2019, 10:27:08 PM
Very defensive declaration.
Aussies should win this by tea time.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 05, 2019, 12:38:23 AM
How great is that Smith guy! He inspired me this weekend. :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: hammersjr on August 05, 2019, 01:41:26 AM
Doesnít look like Mitch Marsh will be getting in over Wade at lords like some were suggesting after the first innings
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 05, 2019, 01:45:29 AM
I donít feel heís a strike spin bowler. He was tolerated when his batting backed him up, but now thatís gone, and heís openly admitted in the press during an Ashes series that his confidence is gone.

Heís shot and should be replaced, we have an important series to win. No time for extended patience or sentiment

You say he's not a strike bowler but he's got the same test bowling strike rate as Graeme Swann.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 05, 2019, 08:03:12 AM
There's stats, and there is how a guy is performing. Right now he's a liability in the side for his batting and his bowling is way under par.

You can just about carry 1 seamer out of 4, but you can;t carry 1 spinner out of 1.

It's just my opinion, but i think deep inside he still believes he's a batting 2nd spinner, and that's not what we need right now.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 08:11:59 AM
There's stats, and there is how a guy is performing. Right now he's a liability in the side for his batting and his bowling is way under par.

You can just about carry 1 seamer out of 4, but you can;t carry 1 spinner out of 1.

It's just my opinion, but i think deep inside he still believes he's a batting 2nd spinner, and that's not what we need right now.

This sums it up perfectly!!

He might be the best spinner of the last 12 months but right now he is not winning England cricket matches with either bat or ball!

He is shot! Send him back to Worcester get his mojo back and I am sure he will win test matches for England but right now he isnt, Jack Leach just might!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 08:40:23 AM
Well, we're not batting out 90 overs...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 08:50:12 AM
We might if we get some help from the weather...

Have a feeling Lyon is going to do well thou
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 09:04:14 AM
Oddly I'm not nervous,

Is it because I expect us to be all out before tea or that I think we can actually bat the day?

I think we can but I expect us to be out maybe I'm finally realising that we can't save tests and can only be surprised!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 09:50:11 AM
Ramprakash has just said they'll be a few in the england dressing room who think they can knock these off.. this is why he was sacked, stupid and delusional.

although we have the team to score 400 in a day we dont have the pitch or situation
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 05, 2019, 09:54:56 AM
Iíd almost fancy us more to knock them off that bat out the day tbh.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 10:14:19 AM
Oh look, one down already
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 05, 2019, 10:15:04 AM
Ramprakash has just said they'll be a few in the england dressing room who think they can knock these off.. this is why he was sacked, stupid and delusional.

although we have the team to score 400 in a day we dont have the pitch or situation

Or mentality, Root is in block mode early on as he wants to let the middle order come in to a soft ball. Bairstow cant buy a run, and there goes Burns
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 10:32:18 AM
Umpiring error number what now?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 10:32:58 AM
Umpiring error number what now?

i make it about 12/13 with 9 over turned
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 10:34:08 AM
Someone get Joel Wilson a bloody eye test. Truly one of the worst display of umpiring Iíve ever seen
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on August 05, 2019, 10:43:02 AM
How do you get to umpire in an Ashes test match if your this bad.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 10:44:13 AM
Itís a bit village in this test ! :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 10:46:12 AM
and now the stumps are "buzzing"
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 10:57:05 AM
Another howler
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 10:57:45 AM
This geezer is a clown
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 05, 2019, 10:58:36 AM
According to his Wikipedia entry, he is blind...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 10:59:08 AM
wow
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 11:18:16 AM
Isnít it a quirk of the game when itís starts badly it always get worse

Like some sort of raging epidemic !
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 11:18:31 AM
Jason Roy is braindead
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 11:18:56 AM
Awful from Roy trying to save the test

However he's got to learn and maybe hitting Lyon out of the attack would have taken pressure off but there was better options than the hack
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 11:19:14 AM
That was literally as embarrassing as Moeenís moon balls
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 05, 2019, 11:19:36 AM
Omg Roy
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 05, 2019, 11:20:30 AM
Jason Roy is braindead

It's okay, Joel Wilson gave it not out...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Jordansh on August 05, 2019, 11:22:41 AM
Shocking from Jason.

What was he thinking?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 05, 2019, 11:26:43 AM
To anyone who has been saying Jason Roy would make a good Test match opener, please see today's dismissal.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 11:27:38 AM
It's okay, Joel Wilson gave it not out...

Very good  :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 05, 2019, 11:34:33 AM
A test opera Roy is not.

But Iím pretty sure heís been picked to be our warner/sehwag attacking player.
It doesnít excuse his shot, but Iím pretty sure he wasnít picked for his expertise in blocking out a final day.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 11:37:08 AM
This team is weak.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: DevAussie on August 05, 2019, 11:37:44 AM
Has anyone got a count going of the umpire errors this test....I k ow it's been alot but would love to know how terrible they have actually been!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 11:38:57 AM
A test opera Roy is not.

But Iím pretty sure heís been picked to be our warner/sehwag attacking player.
It doesnít excuse his shot, but Iím pretty sure he wasnít picked for his expertise in blocking out a final day.
Sehwag and Warner averaged over 50 in FC when they got selected for Test cricket. Roy isnít in that league.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on August 05, 2019, 11:39:03 AM
Horrible review
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 11:40:30 AM
Wheels are off England now what muppet said the mindset is to chase the score
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: beaver5 on August 05, 2019, 11:41:00 AM
This could go very quickly now! 😭
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 05, 2019, 11:49:58 AM
Sehwag and Warner averaged over 50 in FC when they got selected for Test cricket. Roy isnít in that league.

Where did I say he was?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 11:53:43 AM
Root isn't in the same class as the big 3
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 11:53:54 AM
And that is game over
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 11:54:58 AM
Where did I say he was?
Never said you did. I was pointing out that Sehwag and Warner are two of the greatest openers of the modern era. Roy won't ever get near that standard
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on August 05, 2019, 11:58:29 AM
another one bites the dust
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 05, 2019, 12:07:08 PM
Just pathetic really. Yet I still read post after post bigging most of these guys up. Flat deck, chance to save a game and they canít stop playing shots. Roy.. well.. never gonna be a test top order bat but the fact heís there just shows where this team is.

Buttler already trying to drive and pull... save the bloody game ..  2 off 200 is better than 65 off 80
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 12:09:11 PM
Wheels are off England now what muppet said the mindset is to chase the score

Their Ex batting coach!!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 12:16:51 PM
Their Ex batting coach!!!!

Marvellous  :)

Interesting how well Lyon has bowled it donít matter if you are right or left handed does it..
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 12:24:38 PM
its just highlighted how rubbish moeen was.

just seen someone text into the bbc live feed this side for lords:

Sibley, Burns, Root, Stokes, Roy, Buttler, Foakes, Woakes, Archer, Broad, Leach

too be fair to the lad he isnt that far off.

its what id pick with anderson out and moeen and bairstow not playing well

but itll be this roy burns root denly buttler stokes bairstow ali woakes archer broad

unless its very flat then could we go in with no spinner? and stone plays?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 05, 2019, 12:25:50 PM
Foakes should be in the team for sure.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 12:43:08 PM
The pitches are dry we wouldnít go in without a spinner even if there is some rain before a match.

Spin wise I think Leach is a better bowler so he should play.

Anderson is going to out next game not sure if Archer is fit but you would think he plays

Foakes is the most unfortunate bloke in recent memory not to get picked

Likely bairstow will get the whole series thou, selectors donít like too much change
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 12:47:43 PM
did that keep low or did jos play it badly? either way this will be over in the next hour unless woakes broad and jimmy with stokes have a miracle
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 05, 2019, 12:48:09 PM
Play and miss .. no feet.. clean bowled... world class buttler gone again

Are these really the best we have ... so over rated this team
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on August 05, 2019, 12:51:27 PM
It was a good ball but Butler looked bang average out there.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 05, 2019, 12:57:10 PM
Roy shouldnít be there but now he is, he deserves 10 tests

Root at three is a sure fire way to waste his ability

Bairstow needs kicking back to Yorkshire and only returned when he knows the difference between red ball and white ball.

Ali is mentally shot. Pull the plug for the winter and let him go back to beating on bang avg county players for confidence with bat and ball

Anderson is injured sadly


Denly to 3 as we kinda donít care about him, short term really

Foakes in for Bairstow at 7

Archer in for Anderson



Denly deserves a run just like burns and Roy.

Sad times still for this side. Very poor
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 01:02:22 PM
You've just got to look at the first class records for the England batting line up to see why we collapse all the time.

Roy, Denly, Buttler, Stokes and Ali all average in the 30s. Root and Burns average in the 40s. Bairstow supposedly averages 50.

Too many average players and in Bairstow's case lack of mental ability to show his true talent
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 01:05:28 PM
Bairstow flops again. Wilson gets one right
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 01:06:25 PM
bairstow fails again, ball isnt bouncing much why's he trying to sway that??

flicked the wristband and wrist at the same time, can understand reviewing that one though
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 01:07:36 PM
Stokes gone, not a lot he could have done, all over for half past?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 01:07:43 PM
Stokes gone absolute tatters
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 05, 2019, 01:07:56 PM
Batted Jonny, thatll be your top score for the summer lad
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 01:08:35 PM
Lyon 350 test wickets and Cummins 100 test wickets
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 01:10:54 PM
Can they drop Bairstow now please?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 01:11:12 PM
MO DOESN'T GET OUT TO LYON... yet
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Timbo287 on August 05, 2019, 01:12:21 PM
Bairstows place in the test team has to be in doubt as there are better keepers out there and his use of the reviews in the test arena and the World Cup is questionable. Buttler or Foakes should keep in the lords test
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on August 05, 2019, 01:15:38 PM
I think Woakes want to go home before tea the way he is batting.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 01:16:36 PM
Since Root became captain, Bairstow has averaged 28 over a period of 27 tests. Truly pathetic for the supposedly second best batsman in the side.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 01:16:58 PM
I think Woakes want to go home before tea the way he is batting.

only 287 needed :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 05, 2019, 01:27:06 PM
Good on Chris Woakes for trying to win it!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 05, 2019, 01:29:22 PM
People still defend this shower of an excuse for a team. The system is broken, we arenít producing test players and that is not the players fault.. itís the system.

Where are these types of players going to a)learn the game b) get recognised c) get paid to specialise .. itís all geared from top to bottom for white ball..

Woakes not exactly looking to save the game either here... quick 35 and out.. thatís what we need.. clown
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 05, 2019, 01:29:23 PM
I love Chris Woakes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 01:33:54 PM
Lots of us do

In all seriousness he is far better equipped to bat higher

Which ainít saying much with the batsmen around him but technically he is pretty sound and has experience
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 05, 2019, 01:38:23 PM
Silly Aussies, how could you doubt Joel Wilson
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 01:39:54 PM
People still defend this shower of an excuse for a team. The system is broken, we arenít producing test players and that is not the players fault.. itís the system.

Where are these types of players going to a)learn the game b) get recognised c) get paid to specialise .. itís all geared from top to bottom for white ball..

Woakes not exactly looking to save the game either here... quick 35 and out.. thatís what we need.. clown

I read an interview with Giles where he said there needs to be a change in focus, I agree in parts but we can't lose focus on white ball or the last 4 years were pointless

Whats wrong with woakes giving it a whack? Who's to say he won't be stranded on 70 odd

It's not his job to get us out of this position those higher up should still be in!!

Blaming woakes in this situation is very senior player!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 01:42:45 PM
If we were a session further along I'd agree with you though
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 01:45:55 PM
If we're gonna just play the blame game it still probably lies with Roy who did what he did for absolutely good reason whatsoever. From there they all tumbled...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 05, 2019, 01:47:34 PM
If we were a session further along I'd agree with you though

Yep, going at a run a ball with 45 minutes to go would be silly but right now it's OK to just treat each ball on it's merits. Shutting up shop for 4 hours is bloody taxing, easier to play normally but sensibly for the time being.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 05, 2019, 01:49:03 PM
And agree about Bairstow. If he was scoring runs it would be one thing but he's not scoring runs and he's missing chances like a couple of stumping yesterday.

Foakes would have taken at least one of them and he'd contribute as much with the bat.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 01:52:43 PM
And with that I think Moeen's test summer is over
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 01:53:41 PM
That should be the end of Moeen's international career. Everyone loves a good trier but this experiment has run its course.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 01:54:48 PM
If we're gonna just play the blame game it still probably lies with Roy who did what he did for absolutely good reason whatsoever. From there they all tumbled...

I kinda get what he was doing, to some degree.

Lyon was always the main threat, get him out of the attack, the easiest way was to make him unbowlable by going for runs and no threat.

The thing that gets me with it was the option he took, why come down the track, Roy had just  swept him for four, that was a good option.

Before anyone piles in i dont agree with what he did, it was reckless and unnecessary we were comfortable ish up to that point.

getting to lunch one down was key.

Ali and broad gone now, just jimmy and king woakes left
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 01:57:53 PM
Oh yeah, they should be ashamed of themselves.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 05, 2019, 02:05:00 PM
I kinda get what he was doing, to some degree.

Lyon was always the main threat, get him out of the attack, the easiest way was to make him unbowlable by going for runs and no threat.

The thing that gets me with it was the option he took, why come down the track, Roy had just  swept him for four, that was a good option.

Before anyone piles in i dont agree with what he did, it was reckless and unnecessary we were comfortable ish up to that point.

getting to lunch one down was key.

Ali and broad gone now, just jimmy and king woakes left

Sweep wasnít an option as the field been moved. Lyon gets bounce.. bounce and sweeping donít mix well.. top edge and a man was placed for it.

Hence he was forced if he wanted to attack to do something different.

Again though, using feet is reallyood but.. why attack ?? Why not just Pat it back ?

Using your feet doesnít mean aggression after all.

Shame, it wasnít a classic but was a decent test until today.. englsnd just again showing they ar eover rated and cant adapt with their batting. Same old story so itís interesting to see people defending them the same way again (not here, just generally)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 05, 2019, 02:07:38 PM
Smith just dropped the Ashes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 05, 2019, 02:08:11 PM
No wait, Steve Smith joined seniors #DropWoakes campaign
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 02:10:20 PM
Sweep wasnít an option as the field been moved. Lyon gets bounce.. bounce and sweeping donít mix well.. top edge and a man was placed for it.

Hence he was forced if he wanted to attack to do something different.

Again though, using feet is reallyood but.. why attack ?? Why not just Pat it back ?

Using your feet doesnít mean aggression after all.

Shame, it wasnít a classic but was a decent test until today.. England just again showing they are over rated and cant adapt with their batting. Same old story so itís interesting to see people defending them the same way again (not here, just generally)

thats what im saying when he swept it was a good option, he then took a bad one, which shows he can think. im not defending his dismissal, i am defending him as i think he will come good
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 05, 2019, 02:11:44 PM
Oh yeah, they should be ashamed of themselves.

Itís just a game. You win some , you lose some.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 05, 2019, 02:12:35 PM
No wait, Steve Smith joined seniors #DropWoakes campaign


Seniors not been on since that guy pointed out his plays cricket career avg.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on August 05, 2019, 02:13:02 PM
That should be the end of Moeen's international career. Everyone loves a good trier but this experiment has run its course.

Talk about knee jerk reactions!  :o

He's been very very poor this test and is drop him for sure, but the end of his international career at 32?

That is a tame ending to the test.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 02:15:35 PM
1-0 down and grounds we are crap at to come!!

Well played Australia

England letting them slip from 122-8 first dig was bad second innings was bad with both ball and bat
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 05, 2019, 02:18:48 PM
thats what im saying when he swept it was a good option, he then took a bad one, which shows he can think. im not defending his dismissal, i am defending him as i think he will come good

He took the Ba done as Paine/Lyon removed the sweep. Thatís what you do, you remove someoneís shot to see what they have and force them to do something daft. Roy obliges. Anywya, game over and a dire performance. Nit Royís fault so canít judt bash him.

Itíll just get notched down again as a Ďone offí as this side seems to get away with.

Well done Australia and well batted smith/burns/wade and siddle
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 05, 2019, 02:18:53 PM
Okay, so here's one to consider.
Was 4 years of building towards the World Cup and ODI dominance really worth this capitulation in the Test Match arena?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 02:19:01 PM
Talk about knee jerk reactions!  :o

He's been very very poor this test and is drop him for sure, but the end of his international career at 32?

That is a tame ending to the test.
Moeen relies on luck rather than talent. Thatís the unfortunate truth. Heís mentally weak. The nonsense about being the decongestant spinner. Lyon embarrassed Moeen.

Letís not even talk about Moeenís pathetic batting...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 05, 2019, 02:20:57 PM
Moeen relies on luck rather than talent. Thatís the unfortunate truth. Heís mentally weak. The nonsense about being the decongestant spinner. Lyon embarrassed Moeen.

Letís not even talk about Moeenís pathetic batting...

Heís low on confidence so should be dropped but.. heís not just lucky. Heís over rated.. yes.. has his batting been over egged... yes.. is that his fault.. no

Itís ours for not being realistic about payers


He needs some time away to beat on some county sides and he can come back just not innthr ashes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 02:21:07 PM
Good to see that test cricket is reaching a new phase of elite fast bowling - Cummins, Bumrah and Rabada setting the benchmark. For Englandís sake in this series we need Archer to join that group
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: manno on August 05, 2019, 02:21:21 PM
Okay, so here's one to consider.
Was 4 years of building towards the World Cup and ODI dominance really worth this capitulation in the Test Match arena?

Yes.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 02:21:57 PM
Please fire Roy, Denly, Bairstow and Moeen into a cannon somewhere: just not good enough.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 05, 2019, 02:22:26 PM
Heís low on confidence so should be dropped but.. heís not just lucky. Heís over rated.. yes.. has his batting been over egged... yes.. is that his fault.. no

Itís ours for not being realistic about payers


He needs some time away to beat on some county sides and he can come back just not innthr ashes
Away from home Moeenís bowling average is 46 which is pathetic. Heís just a novelty cricketer
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 05, 2019, 02:23:14 PM
He took the Ba done as Paine/Lyon removed the sweep. Thatís what you do, you remove someoneís shot to see what they have and force them to do something daft. Roy obliges. Anywya, game over and a dire performance. Nit Royís fault so canít judt bash him.

Itíll just get notched down again as a Ďone offí as this side seems to get away with.

Well done Australia and well batted smith/burns/wade and siddle

If the side gets away with it and wins the ashes does it matter?

Pro sport is about winning at the end of the say!

And no I don't think winning the world cup was worth it.. this is the premier format we should be able to win both, Smith Cummins and Lyon aside this aussie team isn't that good!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 05, 2019, 02:24:06 PM
Weíve been quite poor.

Yet. It still took the Aussies 5days to complete the win. Normally weíd have folded in 3............. silver linings and that.


Edit, we also played with ten men and a bowler down for literally 5 of the days.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 05, 2019, 02:28:56 PM
Okay, so here's one to consider.
Was 4 years of building towards the World Cup and ODI dominance really worth this capitulation in the Test Match arena?

Yes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on August 05, 2019, 02:48:54 PM
I'm not excusing all our faults here, but can we also remember we lost our main bowler after 4 overs and one of the Aussie batters (and the best in the world) scored over a third of their runs!

We were poor at times but Smith is a massive part of this win. Get him early in the second innings and it's a different game for the rest of their batters and Lyon bowling on day 5. As well as he bowled the situation and pitch helped.

Smith apart the two teams for me are fairly evenly matched. We should have fought harder today, but the Aussies won this game mainly through Smith being on a different planet to everyone else. Overall they deserved it, but we're not a million miles away from them and shouldn't be looking at a mauling over the series.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Number4 on August 05, 2019, 02:50:55 PM
If the side gets away with it and wins the ashes does it matter?

Pro sport is about winning at the end of the say!

And no I don't think winning the world cup was worth it.. this is the premier format we should be able to win both, Smith Cummins and Lyon aside this aussie team isn't that good!

We donít have to be good, we just have to be better than you guys 🤣😂🤣😂
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 05, 2019, 03:41:10 PM
Since, the first game is done letís talk about second starting with the England team.

Knowing mgmt, England will make two changes dropping Mooen for Leach and Curran or Stone or Archer coming in for Anderson.  I just hope they confirm that Archer is 100% match fit if he is selected.

Here is what I like to see for England in batting order:

Burns, Roy, Root, Denny,  Stokes, Buttler, Foakes, Woakes, Stone, Broad, Leach

For Aus I do not see them make any changes but we will most likely see Starc come in for Siddle.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 05, 2019, 03:45:52 PM
Nobody hearing Banton knocking on the door in all 3 formats? Maybe not tests for a year or so but he's getting seriously close.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 05, 2019, 03:46:39 PM
Another thing to remember is we are a very good nation at stealing talent from other countries, maybe we should stop looking internally and more externally for a few year plan?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 05, 2019, 04:17:10 PM
Nobody hearing Banton knocking on the door in all 3 formats? Maybe not tests for a year or so but he's getting seriously close.

Ah yes - another wicket keeper-batsman in the mix. Just what we need!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on August 05, 2019, 04:31:11 PM
Nobody hearing Banton knocking on the door in all 3 formats? Maybe not tests for a year or so but he's getting seriously close.
He's only broken into the Somerset team properly this season! Talent no doubt, but steady on just yet.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Duck Duck Mongoose on August 05, 2019, 05:27:55 PM
Okay, so here's one to consider.
Was 4 years of building towards the World Cup and ODI dominance really worth this capitulation in the Test Match arena?
Not for me.

With a game at Lords we are now effectively 2 down, still could shape into a great series though; we have players who can bounce back plus new blood to replace those who are looking jaded.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 05, 2019, 05:33:01 PM
Suffice to say we all want a green deck and a fit Archer at Lords; think he might cause a few issues for them but man we need to step it up at a ground they are historically very good at.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 05, 2019, 06:12:00 PM
Shout out some more names...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 05, 2019, 06:19:49 PM
Okay, so here's one to consider.
Was 4 years of building towards the World Cup and ODI dominance really worth this capitulation in the Test Match arena?

England didn't look that dominant in the World Cup to me.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 05, 2019, 06:43:51 PM
England didn't look that dominant in the World Cup to me.

Perhaps it was my wording, but I was referring to the 4 years leading up to the World Cup where England beat everyone they came up against (except Scotland).

But, of course, you knew that, what fun is there in actually answering the question asked though...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 05, 2019, 07:00:04 PM
Perhaps it was my wording, but I was referring to the 4 years leading up to the World Cup where England beat everyone they came up against (except Scotland).

But, of course, you knew that, what fun is there in actually answering the question asked though...

He wouldnít be the edgy internet dude if he answered questions and joined in the conversation though.

Heís just here to be an ### and moan at the selection parts of the forum.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 07:04:16 PM
Perhaps it was my wording, but I was referring to the 4 years leading up to the World Cup where England beat everyone they came up against (except Scotland).

But, of course, you knew that, what fun is there in actually answering the question asked though...

We got home by the skin of our teeth in the WC but yes everything was geared to that tournament perhaps at the expense of everything else. England management have said as much themselves.

Letís be honest we were dismal today, we should be able to compete with the best players picked for the longer form thou
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 07:09:26 PM
Ali out for me Leach in donít care how many left handlers they have, archer and Curran in the squad and Foakes...

Anderson will not play so thatís Archer in if fit, leach for Ali thatís two changes.

Very unlikely England will drop Bairstow as others have said.

What we actually need is someone to dig in when itís tough, I know itís not trendy to bat for a day but thatís how you stop losing games

Malan is the only one I can think of..


Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on August 05, 2019, 07:22:38 PM
England were poor today - that much is clear, but the test game turns on its axis. I do not believe the sides are as unequal as they were made to look today.

I also think England have learned a lot from this test:

Rory Burns: Now an auto select for the rest of the series at least - there were still question marks over him at the start and doubtless some remain. Although he wasn't faultless in his first innings knock, he showed real character and enough quality to deserve an even longer run. We know now he has what it takes.

Stuart Broad: Still capable of some excellent, unplayable spells and should play the rest of the series.

James Anderson: Not fit...obviously.

Roy/ Bairstow/ Buttler: IMO all quality players but all need to learn to reign it in. Now. Before it's too late. Personally I loathe the expression 'He has to play his own game'. Does he bugg*ry! Cricket is a team game, I don't care how capable you are of hitting 36 in an over, if the team requires you to bore the opposition to death that's what you do!

Moeen: IMO still the better spinner but only when he's in good nic. I would be considering Leach or even Bess as a replacement.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 05, 2019, 08:31:26 PM
Wicket was doing a lot today and AUS bowlers fully capitalized on their opportunities. Good for AUS!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 05, 2019, 08:47:53 PM
The problem with the England Test side, are in my opinion, the inevitable result of the domestic game being torn apart for the singular purpose of maximizing profit.

The endless shouting of new names (often who posters clearly know very little about), without  ever considering the bigger picture, seems more than a bit dumb to me.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 05, 2019, 08:59:29 PM
My mate who is not an England fan texted me to say England were dismal(yes I know and cheers!) but the problem we have is we have two keepers in the team for one role and that will have to change to move forward .....

Hmmm... That's a tough one

There's load of keeper batsmen around and some who could come in to the team as well.

I would have Foakes in myself at the expense of Bairstow

But would England ever make that choice ? And which one gets dropped? Or both and we play the best keeper...which has got to be Foakes by a street.

Trying to think of other teams who have more than one keeper , where the other player is good enough to get in as a pure batsman.

Wade is a keeper, I think , good player below average in figures as a batsman so far.Looked a serious bat on Sunday thou
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 05, 2019, 09:30:48 PM
So we are wrong and not playing very well. What can we do?

In my opinion no point shouting random county cricketers names. Weíve all said Jennings, stoneman, westley, vince a thousand times and itís qucikly transpired that county runs mean squat on the international circuit. So throwing Sibley Crawley and whoever else we can find in the mix is pointless.


Roy and Burns stay for now, burns as he got runs, and Roy as despite the fact Iím not sure heís the man for the job, 2 tests isnít really a fair crack. But he really needs a flat ish track to get us off to a flier. Or a very tired opponent second innings etc.
Digging us out on the 5th day ainít his game.



Keeper batsmen. Buttler bairstow foakes conundrum.
Buttler and bairstow havenít yet turned up this summer, and foakes hasnít had a great lions fc run recently. But is there anyone else?
I donít think all 3 can play unless one of the 2 bís goes up to number 3(and let root drop to 4 again).
But I doubt theyíd do that.
Buttler has the better run with the bat than bairstow last year, and foakes is the better keeper, so maybe play buttler and foakes for now, but have johnny chomping at the bit if they donít perform.


Got to pick fit bowlers. So Anderson is out.
Still donít rate broad but heís made himself unstoppable for rest of ashes.
He needs archer with him for pace.
Mo has no confidence, give the lad a rest. Bring leach in, especially as he batted well against Ireland.
Woakes if fit, as he had the niggle yesterday, if not itís curran.

Which just leaves denly.
Denly, Malan, Vince...... all seem to be a quick 20-30 and get out at test level.
Other than the movement of buttler or bairstow to 3, what else do we have? Not a lot it seems.

Root, stokes obvious picks. No questions there.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 05, 2019, 09:48:28 PM
Here's one for you: Jason Roy has never ever batted for more than three and half hours.

So the chances of him doing it today were pretty remote, to say the least.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 05, 2019, 11:06:51 PM
In the aftermath here, the one thing no-one has said for an England side who were poor in places is that it's tough losing your best bowler, hell, your best player, half an hour in to a five day test. Not saying that decided the game by any means, but...

Really, the issues now are the ones we identified six months ago. Two gaps in the top three (though go Burns. Seriously, making a hundred that ugly takes massive class), a preponderance of all rounders and a fondness for right arm medium quick. And behind that, the issue that the majority of the guys doing it in the Championship this year have been tried and found wanting (Malan, Lyth, Ballance).

What do you do now? Tough. For me the single biggest one is Leach for Ali. No brainer for me that you need your best spinner, and that spinner needs to be able to block an end, which Ali can't.

In the batting, you could legitimately drop Buttler or Bairstow. Four knocks, no double digit scores and four average shots. Roy played a worse shot but has to be given some chance. Denly, sadly, might be the scapegoat because his selection reeks of good egg syndrome.

Tricky.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 05, 2019, 11:34:52 PM
I am enjoying how salty the Smith boo-ers would be feeling at this point

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27328961/the-three-block-boos-steve-smith-bubble-proves-real-fortress (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27328961/the-three-block-boos-steve-smith-bubble-proves-real-fortress)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: skip1973 on August 06, 2019, 01:13:31 AM
World feels right when we beat the poms
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 06, 2019, 07:47:48 AM
Excellent from George Dobell, as ever...

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27328345/alarms-no-surprises-england-sleepwalk-familiar-defeat (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27328345/alarms-no-surprises-england-sleepwalk-familiar-defeat)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 06, 2019, 08:09:19 AM
looking back i think there is plenty to take away from edgbaston.. obviously the back half the game was dire but:

we did have them 122-8 being more clinical thats 150ao with jofra or olly stone to come in that extra pace should help there.

first innings we batted well, proper test match batting, the collapse on day 3 was mainly batters who are woefully out of form and those who were in were starting again and everyone (except smith it seems) is vulnerable then, if we can bat like that in every game and take each game deep we have a great chance of coming back.

looking at the aussie batting line up im still not convinced they will be that consistent, again smith aside,

Warner and bancroft are just coming back, i think how we attack both earlier is outstanding
Khawaja is either great or crap nothing
smith is smith
head -  a bit unknown looks a good player but put pressure on and see how he copes
wade - yes he tonned up but they were on top at the time, see how he gets on under pressure, like the first innings
paine - again scored a few but that was when aus were oon top, nothign first dig under pressure, has never proven himself with the bat, keeping was mainly tidy but not at all perfect
pattinson - will play all 5 and will take wickets
siddle - does what he does, probably not play all 5
cummins - best quick in the world
lyon - class

the have starc and hazlewood to come too but if the batting wobbles who is there? mitch marsh... as an england fan i wouldnt mind him coming in as a batsman!!!!

that being said if australia get ahead in games i dont think were mentally strong enough to come back late in games like they did
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 06, 2019, 08:25:51 AM
Just to add our batting is in the same position and needs shoring up!!

We're one test into a 5 match series so trying to stay positive!!! that may all change after lords though!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 06, 2019, 08:28:13 AM
England lose far too many matches at home.

They dropped curran who probably has had more match winning performances (yes - with the bat) than any one else
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 06, 2019, 08:34:51 AM
CONFIRMED - Jimmy out of second test.

Woakes must keep his place now as the "swinger" also his record at the home of cricket is outstanding!!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 06, 2019, 08:50:31 AM
It might be but our record at Lords is not great, itís pretty flat apart from that Ireland game which went all over the shop

Think that means Archer is in. Remaining positive for a min Smith if we can get him out early we are back on even with the Aussies
 Leach in I hope would make us a better side.

Not sure about Denly, top pro looks a bit short at test level but deserves a bit more of a run

Sam Curran might feature in our middle order before long, def has potential as a bat and forth seamer
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: beaver5 on August 06, 2019, 09:03:05 AM
Our batting is the biggest concern. We've continually worried about the top 3 yet the middle order has also failed to deliver repeatedly. The form of Bairstow and Ali has fallen of the edge of a cliff and Buttler rarely produces consistent scores. Something is wrong for what is clearly a talented bunch of batsman to all be so unable to dig in when things get tough. This has been happening far too frequently, including recently against the West Indies and Ireland. Something needs to change, whether its attitude or players selected. I also think Root is not a suitable captain and we need someone to come with strong leadership, much like Morgan has done in the ODI team. Someone to lead from the front and gets the team he wants - players with guts and who perform or their gone.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 06, 2019, 09:22:22 AM
It might be but our record at Lords is not great, itís pretty flat apart from that Ireland game which went all over the shop


Doesn't Lords have a new head groundsman? i think we could have a similar wicket to Ireland
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 06, 2019, 09:26:32 AM
Doesn't Lords have a new head groundsman? i think we could have a similar wicket to Ireland

 Hmm not sure mike hunt, careful how you say that, has been for years maybe heís retired

It could be a lottery if itís like the Ireland game but...maybe that would help us?

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on August 06, 2019, 09:31:49 AM
I must say that so far I have been perplexed by the state of the two test match pitches we have had this summer and the players we have selected to bowl on them.  Against Ireland we prepare a green seamer which was Ireland's best chance of getting a result then select two spinners and one of the quickest bowlers in county cricket.  Against Australia we prepare a dust bowl that turns from day one despite Australia having the best spinner of either side then put out an attack of fast-medium bowlers for a green seamer.

Hopefully the deck at Lord's will be similar to the one we played Ireland on
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on August 06, 2019, 09:45:31 AM
I'm still in the mindset that the series will be close and we'll comeback from this. It's odd tho how we used to pick the ODI side based on test cricket and now pick the test side based on ODI cricket!

I don't think Roy is the answer and Sibley should have been tried sooner, so can see him coming in soon and Roy dropping to 4, or keeping him there to drop Denly and bringing Foakes in with the gloves and moving Bairstow up. In fairness anyone of the top 7 apart from Burns, Root and Stokes could be dropped on current form. Butler, Denly, Roy and Bairstow all have huge question marks over them at present.

Burns
Sibley
Root
Bairstow/Roy/Denly
Stokes
Butler/Roy/Denly/Bairstow
Foakes
Woakes
Archer
Broad
Leach
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 06, 2019, 10:17:27 AM
Hmm not sure mike hunt, careful how you say that, has been for years maybe heís retired

It could be a lottery if itís like the Ireland game but...maybe that would help us?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.lords.org/lords/news-stories/amp/Karl-McDermott-Appointed-Head-Groundsman-at-Lords (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.lords.org/lords/news-stories/amp/Karl-McDermott-Appointed-Head-Groundsman-at-Lords)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 06, 2019, 10:32:21 AM

the have starc and hazlewood to come too but if the batting wobbles who is there? mitch marsh... as an england fan i wouldnt mind him coming in as a batsman!!!!

that being said if australia get ahead in games i dont think were mentally strong enough to come back late in games like they did

Harris showed good signs in his tests against india and Labuschagne is leading the run scoring in county cricket, they are handy enough players and will play before Marsh, I think the commentators are the only ones who think he will play, personally with this current lineup, I don't see the need to play the extra bowler and I don't understand the obsession with playing all-rounder unless you have someone like Stokes, which nobody does.

I'm not sold by the Aussie batting line up either, but equally, the English line up has proved to be as questionable and the depth issue is the same If not worse.

Looking forward to Lords! Starc in and siddle out for mine, but I wouldn't be surprised if they kept the same team.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 06, 2019, 10:35:01 AM
Jofra playing that seconds game for Sussex, already has one wicket https://live.nvplay.com/ecb/#m5f3d4e20-f306-4243-b504-1c6dddca6646
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 06, 2019, 10:36:46 AM
Played against the lad he got out a lot over the past 2/3 seasons. He's 18 I think, Id have played at a wide one too lad, best to get out before the bouncers start.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 06, 2019, 10:40:43 AM
First over in and he had already sent in a few to take his head off
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 06, 2019, 12:07:16 PM
First over in and he had already sent in a few to take his head off

There's a clip on twitter! It looks sharp!!

10-3-23-3

Glos 2 56-7
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 06, 2019, 12:23:53 PM
12.1-4-27-6

Yeah, he's good to go
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 06, 2019, 02:58:06 PM
He's 44* off 30 balls too!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 06, 2019, 03:10:39 PM
50 up!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 06, 2019, 03:12:09 PM
Right we are back on course to reclaim what is rightfully ours

The urn.

Come on England !!!!!  :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 06, 2019, 03:24:58 PM
55 off 42 7 fours 2 sixes

Before we all get carried away it is 2s cricket however he's proven his fitness and shown a bit of form!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on August 06, 2019, 03:26:57 PM
Good to see all that was needed for our spirits to be lifted and the Ashes to be coming home, was a 6 for and a 50 against a county 2nd eleven!  :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 06, 2019, 03:55:43 PM
Bit harsh on the poor sod's he has warmed up against!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 06, 2019, 04:39:10 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/ThjsoEA.jpg)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Buzz on August 06, 2019, 09:19:30 PM
55 off 42 7 fours 2 sixes

Before we all get carried away it is 2s cricket however he's proven his fitness and shown a bit of form!!
He ended up with 100 and something from 80odd balls.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 06, 2019, 09:21:37 PM
Of course it would help if there was Championship cricket for prospective England players to warm up in.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 06, 2019, 09:33:00 PM
He ended up with 100 and something from 80odd balls.

Against worgan, drissell and Russell that does not surprise me
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 06, 2019, 11:12:50 PM
He ended up with 100 and something from 80odd balls.

Itís great that he got the hundred but does England need another stroke maker?  IMHO playing this really was not an indication that he is ready for Lords from fitness perspective.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: potzy248 on August 06, 2019, 11:25:07 PM
Of course it would help if there was Championship cricket for prospective England players to warm up in.

They wouldve organised the T20's to use the Internationals that were already there no?

You are right though.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 07, 2019, 07:54:10 AM
Any new players coming into the Test series now will be ill-prepared because they'll have been playing nothing but T20.  Most of the existing players prepared by playing in a lengthy World Cup tournament.

We should not be surprised when we fail horribly to bat a day to save a Test match.  Zak Crawley really is not the answer.

Altogether now: Sweet Caroline, oh oh oh...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 07, 2019, 11:07:07 AM
Stone is now out of the next two tests https://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/12123/11779273/olly-stone-ruled-out-for-two-weeks-with-back-injury (https://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/12123/11779273/olly-stone-ruled-out-for-two-weeks-with-back-injury)

Guess that solves the 'does Archer play?' narrative
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 07, 2019, 11:38:29 AM
If archer does play which looks now like heís gonna have to...he will only be able to bowl him in short spells

Root has followed the same path as other captains, bowling our players into the ground...some sympathy as we leak far too many runs....but someone is going to have to do the donkey work.

Is that bowler Leach or is there anyone else?

Not convinced Woakes is totally fit myself
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 07, 2019, 03:19:39 PM
so just how do we get steve smith out?

we seem to have fairly good plans to everyone else.

@Buzz noticed jofra bowling round the wicket to the glos 2s righties, does this mean that we have a new theory?

i said on there the other day something like this may work as he seems to hit in the air behind square of bouncers a fair amount:

round the wicket bowling

leg slip, short fine leg, short leg and a man out at deep forward square leg.

anyone got any other ideas?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 07, 2019, 03:25:13 PM
so just how do we get steve smith out?

we seem to have fairly good plans to everyone else.

@Buzz noticed jofra bowling round the wicket to the glos 2s righties, does this mean that we have a new theory?

i said on there the other day something like this may work as he seems to hit in the air behind square of bouncers a fair amount:

round the wicket bowling

leg slip, short fine leg, short leg and a man out at deep forward square leg.

anyone got any other ideas?

Sounds like bodyline-lite. I guess Steve Smith really is Bradman reincarnated
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 07, 2019, 03:27:52 PM
That might have been my influence.. if its good enough for Don.....
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 07, 2019, 04:14:40 PM
Eh up going back a few decades here  ;)

In the ashes series before this one over here the movement did for the Aussies

It might do us too but I think seaming wickets are the only way to go

Root said lords v Ireland was Ďsubstandard wicketí

We might need the same again and tough luck our batsmen. Not exactly our strength batting anyway is it?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on August 08, 2019, 11:16:35 AM
Does anybody know when the next squad will be announced?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: JTtaylor145 on August 08, 2019, 11:31:35 AM
Does anybody know when the next squad will be announced?
Probably Sunday but most of us would predict (accurately) that it will be Leach in for Moen and Archer for Anderson. The rest of the squad will be exactly as it was for the first match.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Number4 on August 08, 2019, 12:22:00 PM
so just how do we get steve smith out?

we seem to have fairly good plans to everyone else.

@Buzz noticed jofra bowling round the wicket to the glos 2s righties, does this mean that we have a new theory?

i said on there the other day something like this may work as he seems to hit in the air behind square of bouncers a fair amount:

round the wicket bowling

leg slip, short fine leg, short leg and a man out at deep forward square leg.

anyone got any other ideas?

Last time Australia played against Jofra at Lords from memory he went for over 6 an over 😛
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 08, 2019, 12:37:47 PM
Last time Australia played against Jofra at Lords from memory he went for over 6 an over 😛

Last time Jofra played against Australia he bloodied your keeper... some would argue the semi result was more emphatic..

nice this selective memory.....

(i know we got d1ck3d at edgbaston last week before anyone points it out)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Number4 on August 08, 2019, 12:45:27 PM
Last time Jofra played against Australia he bloodied your keeper... some would argue the semi result was more emphatic..

nice this selective memory.....

(i know we got d1ck3d at edgbaston last week before anyone points it out)

He wonít be playing against a bunch of nobody 2nd ix players though. Donít get me wrong I predicted way back when bbl was being played he should be selected for the Ashes. When your all rounder is your fastest bowler you need to get someone who can bowl some heat.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 08, 2019, 12:51:20 PM
He wonít be playing against a bunch of nobody 2nd ix players though. Donít get me wrong I predicted way back when bbl was being played he should be selected for the Ashes. When your all rounder is your fastest bowler you need to get someone who can bowl some heat.

Alex Carey isn't a nobody second XI hes arguably your best keeper batsmen

i do think Jofra will give the hurry up and will probably create wickets at the other end too
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Number4 on August 08, 2019, 12:57:08 PM
Alex Carey isn't a nobody second XI hes arguably your best keeper batsmen

i do think Jofra will give the hurry up and will probably create wickets at the other end too

Yes I agree at the moment he is our best But Jofra never got Carey out. Just a love tap on the chin. I was referring to the nobody 2nd ix team that everyone seems to be getting excited about Jofra taking 6 wickets against.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 08, 2019, 01:00:44 PM
Got to remember getting wickets and Englandís bowling isnít the weak link. Jofra is a fantastic bowler albeit so far only in white ball cricket for England and doesnít have much red ball cricket recently to fall back on. He is the best option now Anderson is certainly out and I hope he adapts to test cricket as well as he did to international white ball cricket.

Still feel the selectors need to be brave and pick some inform championship batsmen such as Sibley to open as well as replace Bairstow with Foakes. As much as that most likely means Denly misses out and as a Kent fan I donít want that and also feel he has been unlucky in Test cricket so far. Run out by root against Ireland and due to the ball change got a swinging nut when looking good in the last test. Did ok in the WI as well without getting a big score.

Letís hope maybe Smith treads on a ball in the outfield or the Aussies start playing football as a warm up and rolls an ankle as looks like the only way to get rid of him from the last test
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Number4 on August 08, 2019, 01:06:23 PM
You are right about Bairstow. He is Australiaís bunny. Has been since Johnson scared the living crap out of him
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 08, 2019, 01:14:59 PM
Yes I agree at the moment he is our best But Jofra never got Carey out. Just a love tap on the chin. I was referring to the nobody 2nd ix team that everyone seems to be getting excited about Jofra taking 6 wickets against.

I made no reference to glos 2s

Yeah he took 6fer but your right it is 2nd xi cricket, their still good players who were made to look ordinary,

However I'm glad hes fit and firing,

He may not have got Carey out but he did smack the lid off him

Let's face it none of the Aussies will be thrilled to face Archer

His red ball domestic record is much better than his white ball! If it translates the same way he'll be a serious bowler!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 08, 2019, 06:05:54 PM
I made no reference to glos 2s

Yeah he took 6fer but your right it is 2nd xi cricket, their still good players who were made to look ordinary,

However I'm glad hes fit and firing,

He may not have got Carey out but he did smack the lid off him

Let's face it none of the Aussies will be thrilled to face Archer

His red ball domestic record is much better than his white ball! If it translates the same way he'll be a serious bowler!

Tbf, at least three of them are pretty crap.. one I think was top order.. at the level englsnd need nothing can be taken by playing a second xi.. especially glos!! Glos 1xi is dire let alone the 2xi
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 08, 2019, 08:00:30 PM
Archer looks good no doubt but he's gonna need bowlers around him that keep it tight and get wickets. He won't be bowling 35 overs a day quick, he's played a lot of limited overs cricket.

Besides as has been pointed out its our batting that's the problem, we need to post 350 minimum. I don't think we can do that consistently

The lords wicket against Ireland moved all over the shop, if we get similar  the game could be a lottery, add in some village umpiring and it's a shoot out who uses DRS the best  :)

Our best chance of winning is a sporting track, gamble on 1-1 or 0-2 down.

Australia are decent, two of their bowlers left out of the 1st test cleaned up in the County game yesterday and today. Hazlewood and Stac are quality and waiting in the wings.



Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Number4 on August 09, 2019, 10:03:13 AM
Archer looks good no doubt but he's gonna need bowlers around him that keep it tight and get wickets. He won't be bowling 35 overs a day quick, he's played a lot of limited overs cricket.

Besides as has been pointed out its our batting that's the problem, we need to post 350 minimum. I don't think we can do that consistently

The lords wicket against Ireland moved all over the shop, if we get similar  the game could be a lottery, add in some village umpiring and it's a shoot out who uses DRS the best  :)

Our best chance of winning is a sporting track, gamble on 1-1 or 0-2 down.

Australia are decent, two of their bowlers left out of the 1st test cleaned up in the County game yesterday and today. Hazlewood and Stac are quality and waiting in the wings.

If it comes down to who uses DRS best then Australia are stuffed
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mo_town on August 09, 2019, 12:11:01 PM
Archer looks good no doubt but he's gonna need bowlers around him that keep it tight and get wickets. He won't be bowling 35 overs a day quick, he's played a lot of limited overs cricket.

Besides as has been pointed out its our batting that's the problem, we need to post 350 minimum. I don't think we can do that consistently

The lords wicket against Ireland moved all over the shop, if we get similar  the game could be a lottery, add in some village umpiring and it's a shoot out who uses DRS the best  :)

Our best chance of winning is a sporting track, gamble on 1-1 or 0-2 down.

Australia are decent, two of their bowlers left out of the 1st test cleaned up in the County game yesterday and today. Hazlewood and Stac are quality and waiting in the wings.

Really hope the wicket is as spicy as the one for the Ireland test. But after the loss in the first test, it is possible that it will be as flat as possible.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: 19reading87 on August 09, 2019, 02:05:13 PM
Confirmed

Joe Root (c), Jofra Archer, Jonny Bairstow, Stuart Broad, Rory Burns, Jos Buttler, Sam Curran, Joe Denly, Jack Leach, Jason Roy, Ben Stokes, Chris Woakes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 09, 2019, 02:08:18 PM
100% the right call to put in Leach for Moeen
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 09, 2019, 02:11:35 PM
As predicted

Feel for stone! Hope he recovers quickly
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 09, 2019, 02:35:25 PM
How much pressure must Archer be under!, it seems England's hopes have been entirely pinned on the young lad. I hope he at least has realistic expectations of himself and doesn't take it too hard if things don't go according to plan.

I can't see what difference a green seamer will make though. Both batting lineups look shaky, although England would be more concerned with theirs, and both sides have the bowling to exploit those conditions but Australia have the better spinner.

If it's flat at least it won't be over in 3 days, and after Joe Roots criticism of the pitch that was prepared for the Ireland test Id say the groundsman will prepare something pretty batsman friendly.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: norman1979 on August 09, 2019, 02:54:36 PM
Bairstow should be out of the team too. He isnt test match standard
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Buzz on August 09, 2019, 03:34:29 PM
I don't think Jofra is under any pressure at all. He comes in, bowls a bit, bats a bit, fields a bit and has a fun time.
The batters, however, they need to feel the pressure.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 09, 2019, 04:00:43 PM
Best thing really is new two new things to try and throw towards Smith. Ah.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: hammersjr on August 09, 2019, 05:37:02 PM
If bairstow doesnít get some in this test I reckon he should be dropped for the series, we all know heíll be back at some point with a point to prove
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 09, 2019, 06:04:09 PM
I think bairstow is lucky to be in this squad even if the chances of him being replaced by Foakes are..or were..nil.

Roy and Burns, whether people think they are good enough or not must be given a chance, they need games under their belts and no one is banging down the door to be picked.

I just wonder if for England, if they wanted too, pick Curran in the side as well as a spinner, could continue to pick two keepers batting as low down as they do.

You wonder if they might have too choose one in the long term
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 09, 2019, 07:50:52 PM
Can someone give Vaughan a facetweet to ask to kindly rile up Bairstow ahead of the next Test. Ton in the bag. Ta ;) :)

Consider it done ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on August 12, 2019, 08:56:48 PM
Can someone give Vaughan a facetweet to ask to kindly rile up Bairstow ahead of the next Test. Ton in the bag. Ta ;) :)
At one point on TMS during the Ireland test a couple of commentators (I forget who) were actually discussing on air whether they should write an anti-Bairstow piece to make sure he got runs in the Ashes haha.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 13, 2019, 11:05:18 AM
Australia have Ďrestedí Pattinson for Lords. Hazlewood or Starc will replace him
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 13, 2019, 05:54:15 PM
Australia have Ďrestedí Pattinson for Lords. Hazlewood or Starc will replace him
Yep always on the cards this with two quality bowlers on the sidelines, if the wicket is similar to the Ireland game I actually think Hazlewood would be a better selection-he can just move it enough from a good length.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 13, 2019, 05:58:52 PM
Also on the cards was todayís news ĎMoeen takes a break from cricketí

One of the most likeable players but clearly out of form and low on confidence.

It may be a hard road back without his batting to fall back on. He may come again but Iím still of the view with so many allrounders in the side we play the best specialist spinner and keeper.

Sympathy for Ali thou, itís a tough game when confidence leaves you in club cricket let alone top level.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 13, 2019, 06:10:24 PM
Looked like he needed something from the last test, maybe it was a break. Hopefully he comes back refreshed and on form.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 14, 2019, 10:36:16 AM
Any word on if this weather is supposed to clear at any stage or if it's looking like a write off?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 14, 2019, 10:57:46 AM
Any word on if this weather is supposed to clear at any stage or if it's looking like a write off?

If the forecast is to believed. No play today.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 14, 2019, 11:49:12 AM
As someone with a Day 5 ticket at £20 that is non-refundable, I'm selfishly OK with it
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 14, 2019, 11:56:20 AM
As someone with a Day 5 ticket at £20 that is non-refundable, I'm selfishly OK with it
Guess it depends how much play is possible in the first 2-3 days.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: tim2000s on August 14, 2019, 01:15:38 PM
If the forecast is to believed. No play today.
Well, they seem to be trying to get the teams out on to the pitch now...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 14, 2019, 01:58:57 PM
Toss at 3pm be great to win and have a bowl and aim to get 3/4 wickets by the end of the day if indeed the rain holds off that long
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 14, 2019, 02:34:01 PM
Well, they seem to be trying to get the teams out on to the pitch now...


But not now.......
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 15, 2019, 09:58:36 AM
Australia win the toss and bowl first, tough morning I reckon for our top order but could be a great toss to lose if we see off the new ball.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 15, 2019, 10:01:18 AM
I know it's in aid of the Ruth Strauss foundation but can we keep the red numbers and names looks class!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 15, 2019, 10:07:45 AM
Nervous when we bat!! But yeah IF we can get thru the new ball and post a total ..... :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 15, 2019, 10:09:42 AM
Good job root is an opener...

Before people pile in.. he started his career as an opener selected for england opening for Yorkshire...

That was dire from Roy! Waft first up like 3rd ball
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 15, 2019, 10:09:56 AM
Again, Jason shouldn't be anywhere near the side.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 15, 2019, 10:10:40 AM
God sake Roy

Ball 1 - big waft
Ball 2 - beaten all ends up
Ball 3 - plays and nicks off

0 for 1
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 15, 2019, 10:12:42 AM
Oh gawd !!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 15, 2019, 10:45:40 AM
Sigh. Truly in the mire now.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 15, 2019, 11:22:49 AM
Does root ever get runs in testing conditions???
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 12:09:17 PM
Might turn out to be a good toss to lose, 76-2 at lunch
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 15, 2019, 12:32:42 PM
Does root ever get runs in testing conditions???


That is why there is clear daylight between smith and Williamson and then probably Kholi with root Forth of the so called big 4

The very best get hundreds and lots of them

Root is superb but he should just concentrate on being the best bat he can, not all players boost averages when made captain
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 12:49:59 PM
Williamson isnít as good as Kohli in a month of Sundayís...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 15, 2019, 01:34:35 PM
Eurgh
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 01:36:26 PM
Bancroft can't bat for toffee but he's an outstanding fielder. Ridiculous
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 01:53:39 PM
136-5 Buttler gone. Struggling
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 15, 2019, 01:56:37 PM
Can we just have Foakes in the side already?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 15, 2019, 02:08:02 PM
Another inept team performance with the bat...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 02:08:14 PM
138-6 Stokes LBW. Crumbling badly
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 15, 2019, 02:14:46 PM
Root yesterday Ďwe want to put on a real showí

What garbage !! We just want the team to fight
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 15, 2019, 02:21:15 PM
^ Sometimes teams just don't have the ability to fight even though they want to put up a "show" and fight.

I have been saying this for some time but guys like Root should focus on their batting and breaking records. Captaincy should be left to gruff individuals like Stokes - I think he will make a fine captain.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 15, 2019, 02:37:16 PM
Becoming more and more convinced that Butler is just not suited to Test cricket in the same way I donít think Roy will become a good test player.

Someone said the other day at my club that they would rather have Morgan in the side in the middle order as he is also a proper captain and would release Root of the pressure. Not a bad call Iím starting to think with this batting line up.

Positives so far is that Burns is looking more comfortable at the moment and Denly also looking very good but keeps coping a Jaffa.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jamesisapayne on August 15, 2019, 03:10:06 PM
Becoming more and more convinced that Butler is just not suited to Test cricket in the same way I donít think Roy will become a good test player.

Someone said the other day at my club that they would rather have Morgan in the side in the middle order as he is also a proper captain and would release Root of the pressure. Not a bad call Iím starting to think with this batting line up.

Positives so far is that Burns is looking more comfortable at the moment and Denly also looking very good but keeps coping a Jaffa.

Agree with all of this Chris, poor Joe Denly looks to have got a proper decent nut the last 3-4 times he's batted and with a bit more luck would have scored more heavily.

Jos and Jason Roy are top drawer ODI players but I'm not sure either are best suited to test cricket as they have such natural attacking styles. It's obvious Roy has been brought in to give the top order some David Warner type fireworks but I think Warner is able to reign his attacking instinct in a bit and knows where his off stump is.

I'd love both to be a great success at test cricket, but as a similar type of player, for all Adam Gilchrist's swashbuckling style he knew perfectly well how to dig in when needed and when to counterattack.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 15, 2019, 03:31:18 PM
We havenít even lost this yet(Aussies 80 all out would change peopleís tune) but why not play selection. Itís cbf


Burns is looking like heís getting to grips with this level. Confidence growing. He looks like heíll have to rely on pure grit over talent for runs, but can see him scoring big against some of the lesser attacks than Aussies have.


Roy is not a test opener. Feel sorry heís been thrown into this. Robson, Lyth, hales were and still would be doing a better job than the Roy, Jennings, stoneman attempts did.

Root. Heís stil our best player, but something shcanged, maybe itís thw wc hangover, or him being constantly present in all formats. But heíll click at some point...... hopefully....

Denly, he doesnít have a W.C. hangover, so stick with him. Like burns he looks a tad more comfratabel every innings. Weather he turns out to be good enough or not who knows.


Buttler stokes bairstow!!! Pick an order and stick to it. God sake.

Buttler, I know why heís there, he was better than a lot at tests before the W.C. build up, but not since. Maybe he needs a rest, maybe the W.C. hangover is strong.


Stokes is the boss.


Bairstow...... depends how he goes here. Him and buttler a toss up to drop. Could be both.


Bowlers be fine.......... Iíd still drop broad.




So if we get thumped here. And it looks likely. Iíd go.

Burns
???
Woakes
Root
Denly
Stokes
Foakes
Curran
Archer
Leach
Broad


Honestly no idea on who to open. The ones we dropped who could have been decent have dropped off, or retired from red ball.
Is there any point throwing in sibley  or Crawley? Nope, could kill them before they get going.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ijmorgan on August 15, 2019, 03:32:50 PM
Becoming more and more convinced that Butler is just not suited to Test cricket in the same way I donít think Roy will become a good test player.

Someone said the other day at my club that they would rather have Morgan in the side in the middle order as he is also a proper captain and would release Root of the pressure. Not a bad call Iím starting to think with this batting line up.

Positives so far is that Burns is looking more comfortable at the moment and Denly also looking very good but keeps coping a Jaffa.
Been thinking this for a while in regards to Morgan as he would probably average 35-40 as his batting is better now than when he made his debut, plus he is a far superior captain to Root and on the plus side Roots average would go back up again.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 03:59:39 PM
210-7 Cummins bulldozers he way through the King of Lords Woakes with a barrage of bumpers. Bairstow needs to go into slog mode to get us up to 300
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 15, 2019, 04:00:16 PM
We seem inept at just dealing with the short stuff when they know it's coming
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 04:00:52 PM
And stop this nonsense about Morgan playing Test cricket. Morgan averages 33 in FC and 30 in Tests eg very mediocre. Heís woeful against pace.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 15, 2019, 04:37:23 PM
Bairstow ties down hisnspot for the rest of the ashes.

Sorry foakes.........



Reckon heíll be at five next innings?(order roulette)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 04:41:10 PM
251-9 Broad out to a bail trimmer from Lyon. Jonny fire it up lad
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 15, 2019, 04:47:21 PM
And stop this nonsense about Morgan playing Test cricket. Morgan averages 33 in FC and 30 in Tests eg very mediocre. Heís woeful against pace.

I disagree itís nonsense, all the others avg 30 odd in red ball cricket, he is a natural captain and a better captain than Root and our best batsmen has been hampered by captaincy, Iím sure his stats show that.

Iím not saying itís the perfect answer or is even on the cards but thatís what forums are for, sharing opinions.

For me unless something changes 2nd innings Butler is dropped, Roy drops to 5 and a proper red ball opener comes into replace Butler, Iím not bothered if thatís Sibley, Crawley, whoever but you can not keep being 20 for 2 or 30 for 3 inside 8 overs every innings and always expect, YJB, Stokes, woakes and the rest of the middle lower order to bail you out. 250-3 is perfect at the end of a day when you bat first in a test match.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 04:50:05 PM
I disagree itís nonsense, all the others avg 30 odd in red ball cricket, he is a natural captain and a better captain than Root and our best batsmen has been hampered by captaincy, Iím sure his stats show that.

Iím not saying itís the perfect answer or is even on the cards but thatís what forums are for, sharing opinions.

For me unless something changes 2nd innings Butler is dropped, Roy drops to 5 and a proper red ball opener comes into replace Butler, Iím not bothered if thatís Sibley, Crawley, whoever but you can not keep being 20 for 2 or 30 for 3 inside 8 overs every innings and always expect, YJB, Stokes, woakes and the rest of the middle lower order to bail you out. 250-3 is perfect at the end of a day when you bat first in a test match.
Natural captain in which way? Morgan was hardly setting the world alight with his captaincy until we started playing on very batsmen friendly pitches. There's no evidence whatsoever to suggest he'd be a capable red ball captain.

Morgan is basically Dhoni MKII, good white ball captain, leave the red ball stuff to the proper players.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 15, 2019, 04:54:34 PM
Natural captain in which way? Morgan was hardly setting the world alight with his captaincy until we started playing on very batsmen friendly pitches. There's no evidence whatsoever to suggest he'd be a capable red ball captain.

Morgan is basically Dhoni MKII, good white ball captain, leave the red ball stuff to the proper players.

And thatís your opinion and your entitled to it mate. The only evidence is the change that has seen England become world champions from group stage knock outs and from interviews etc the players have serious respect and admiration for him as a leader of men.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 15, 2019, 04:56:14 PM
All our.

Now will all the jofra hype be lived up to? Or Aussies just gonna Pokemon 400......
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 04:57:58 PM
Disappointed with the batting but it's par for the course these days. Australia equally brittle with the bat so 258 might be a good score.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 05:00:58 PM
And thatís your opinion and your entitled to it mate. The only evidence is the change that has seen England become world champions from group stage knock outs and from interviews etc the players have serious respect and admiration for him as a leader of men.
Tbh I'd much rather we pick the correct players for the correct roles, then pick a captain from whom ever is in that playing XI.

If Root was to quit, I'd be hoping Stokes would be the new captain. He's got that Botham style aura. Seems to be able to carry other along with him when he's going well.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 15, 2019, 05:05:40 PM
Tbh I'd much rather we pick the correct players for the correct roles, then pick a captain from whom ever is in that playing XI.

If Root was to quit, I'd be hoping Stokes would be the new captain. He's got that Botham style aura. Seems to be able to carry other along with him when he's going well.

Yeah, can't believe the management haven't tried to repeat the roaring success of Ian Botham as England captain.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 05:26:41 PM
11-1 Warner bowled by Broad. Warner also survived a caught behind of Archer when no one appealed
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 05:27:08 PM
Yeah, can't believe the management haven't tried to repeat the roaring success of Ian Botham as England captain.
I said aura of Botham...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 06:01:53 PM
Australia 30/1 at stumps. Big session tomorrow morning
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 15, 2019, 06:02:24 PM
7hr day yet still 5 overs short. Joke
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 15, 2019, 07:49:18 PM
So how was Archer's first day bowling in the test?  Did he trouble the Aussie's or was it that he was quick but did not make the batsmen play?  Sorry, the only thing I have is CricInfo comms being based in US.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 16, 2019, 04:49:33 AM
So how was Archer's first day bowling in the test?  Did he trouble the Aussie's or was it that he was quick but did not make the batsmen play?  Sorry, the only thing I have is CricInfo comms being based in US.

I certainly wouldn't say he bowled poorly, but he probably could have made the batsman play more than he did, and he was a bit wasteful with the short ball. As for speeds, it didn't look like anyone was particularly troubled by it.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 16, 2019, 05:57:22 AM
He was between 88 and 91 at his quickest

Got abit of movement but bowled a tad too wide.


He did hurry Bancroft up abit early on........ but Bancroft just looks so rusty alround it probably just that.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mo_town on August 16, 2019, 08:53:28 AM
Too early to judge from just one spell yesterday. But no matter how quick one is, in Test Cricket its all about patience and discipline. This is what separates the men from the boys. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 16, 2019, 09:51:48 AM
Why are the pundits bringing up Bairstow at 5 again? He did that last summer and was largely not good at it...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: george_parv on August 16, 2019, 09:53:12 AM
Bowled a couple of unplayable balls but as others have said bowled slightly too wide and allowed a lot of be left. Looking forward to this morning especially if we can get 2hrs in against the aussies in these conditions before the rain.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 16, 2019, 09:55:55 AM
Thx for the comments on Archer.s first spell.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 16, 2019, 10:22:00 AM
Archer has wasted the new ball yesterday and nothing has changed this morning. Bowling far too short
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 16, 2019, 10:26:31 AM
Archer has wasted the new ball yesterday and nothing has changed this morning. Bowling far too short

So itís normal England bowling.  Pitch it short and close to 5th stump.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 16, 2019, 10:30:51 AM
This is garbage
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 16, 2019, 10:43:31 AM
Thank God
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 16, 2019, 11:03:22 AM
Bairstow taken a whack to the thumb

GET FOAKES IN
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 16, 2019, 11:10:39 AM
This is garbage

Australia are 61/3 from 20 odd overs so not exactly garbage
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 16, 2019, 11:24:49 AM
It was pretty garbage to that point, just bowling short with a new ball.

Not sure how Aleem didn't give that out, as plumb as you can get
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 16, 2019, 11:25:36 AM
Darr with another shocking decision as plumb as you can get.

Head gone so 71/4 not a bad morning so far from england but got to get Smith out now.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 16, 2019, 01:33:30 PM
What has happened to aleem dar? He used to be one of the very best and now has gone all Steve bucknor!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 16, 2019, 05:21:06 PM
We are a very negative bunch!


ďAnother batsman failed drop himĒ
ďEntire team are rubbish, why we do thisĒ
ďOh now enonly tookmone wicket in half an hr of a test match, itís crapĒ
ďThis umpiring is shockingĒ


Yet we are now on top, aid 70-4 and two wickets we through to tail. And itís all gone quiet on here.

All the moaners just waiting for us to be dune rpump again to start typing.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 16, 2019, 07:43:01 PM
We are a very negative bunch!


ďAnother batsman failed drop himĒ
ďEntire team are rubbish, why we do thisĒ
ďOh now enonly tookmone wicket in half an hr of a test match, itís crapĒ
ďThis umpiring is shockingĒ


Yet we are now on top, aid 70-4 and two wickets we through to tail. And itís all gone quiet on here.

All the moaners just waiting for us to be dune rpump again to start typing.

England have bowled well, but I donít think many think that bowling is this teams problem. Yes in the spin dept but itís the batting. Plus, this isnít a one off, itís happening time and time again and this bunch are now young or new so shouldnít still be given time to Ďdevelopí.

But yes, England have bowled well so far and are showing Aus has just as flaky a batting line up when itís not a flat track.. again, I donít think anyone thinks Aus bats are much better.. excluding smith
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 17, 2019, 10:34:46 AM
Who wrote Stuart Broad off again?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 17, 2019, 11:32:13 AM
Why is Root bowling Archer so much?  He has bowled 8 overs so far with one rest for change of ends.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 17, 2019, 11:51:47 AM
This guy Smith just doesnít get bored...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 17, 2019, 12:52:34 PM
It's been bowling conditions since smith came in and still another fifty you just have to admire the bloke sometimes

Payne gone and we may have to concentrate on one end
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 17, 2019, 12:55:18 PM
To smith.

Can we not just put everyone on boundary from ball one and just let him have the 1 and 5 balls at the other bloke. Regardless of if there tail Enders or batsman?


As I doubt we are ever gonna get him out the tour. Not unless heís biffing anyway.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 17, 2019, 01:16:41 PM
Never like to see a player hurt, but a great ball from Jofra. Looked nasty
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 17, 2019, 01:22:46 PM
Possibly the worst review I've ever seen
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 17, 2019, 01:29:16 PM
Strike bowler Archer 25 overs
King of Lords Woakes 13 overs

Strange
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 17, 2019, 01:33:28 PM
Strike bowler Archer 25 overs
King of Lords Woakes 13 overs

Strange

Yep, do not understand Roots captaincy here.  I would have Archer bowl 3/4 over full out every 12 to 15 overs
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 17, 2019, 01:41:54 PM
I hope Steve smith is ok here I really do don't like seeing players hit that hard

But... I did say he should be tested!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 17, 2019, 01:47:54 PM
Smith "retired hurt"?

What a s*** way to get rid of a fine batsman!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 17, 2019, 01:50:16 PM
Yes hopefully smith is ok there's been short stuff on both sides so we have to use it the Aussies used the short ball well.

Archer has got some heat !!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 17, 2019, 01:54:07 PM
Leach doing a decent job as well keeping it tight for the bowlers at the other end
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 17, 2019, 01:55:49 PM
Itís funny you pick a proper spinner whom is capable of giving the captain control, then the fast bowler can go through the gears. Moeen shouldnít ever be selected over Leach again
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 17, 2019, 01:57:51 PM
I would guess considering the nature of the hit the team doctors would want to run some more thorough checks than time constraints would allow them to on the field of play.

Not a fan of Archer turning around and walking back to his mark laughing. Decent cricketer, seems to have failed a character check in this instance though. Credit to Jos for his concern though.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 17, 2019, 02:00:33 PM
I would guess considering the nature of the hit the team doctors would want to run some more thorough checks than time constraints would allow them to on the field of play.

Not a fan of Archer turning around and walking back to his mark laughing. Decent cricketer, seems to have failed a character check in this instance though. Credit to Jos for his concern though.

Like the concern the Aussies dish out whenever someone is hit!

Pot kettle black there mate

Not that I agree with it
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 17, 2019, 02:05:31 PM
Itís funny you pick a proper spinner whom is capable of giving the captain control, then the fast bowler can go through the gears. Moeen shouldnít ever be selected over Leach again

If it's not turning that's what the spinner has to do. You have to be good enough to bowl it tight of course but that has to be the role of our spinner.

Panesar at his best did it well and of course Swann did it very well thru most of his career.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 17, 2019, 02:05:52 PM
Like the concern the Aussies dish out whenever someone is hit!

Pot kettle black there mate

Not that I agree with it



For the last few years, more specifically since Hughes, every time someone has been hit on the head, I would strongly argue that they make a point of checking if they are ok, most in world cricket do infact, I can't recall anyone else strutting back to their marks in stitches.

I'm sure Jofra isn't a bad guy, but I imagine he will look back at his reaction in years to come and think he could acted a bit differently
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 17, 2019, 02:11:25 PM
For all of Archerís pace, it didnít wield the clatter of wickets and the Aussies are inching towards parity - with the added caveat that Smith will probably still come out again
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 17, 2019, 02:16:26 PM


For the last few years, more specifically since Hughes, every time someone has been hit on the head, I would strongly argue that they make a point of checking if they are ok, most in world cricket do infact, I can't recall anyone else strutting back to their marks in stitches.

I'm sure Jofra isn't a bad guy, but I imagine he will look back at his reaction in years to come and think he could acted a bit differently

I agree since Hughes yes but thats getting less and less now even with Australia

Historically (and you can't ignore that) aus have been worse than anyone imo except maybe the west indies!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 17, 2019, 02:20:15 PM
Yes hopefully smith is ok there's been short stuff on both sides so we have to use it the Aussies used the short ball well.

Archer has got some heat !!

I just saw this after signing up for Willow TV streaming service and it looked nasty.  To me it looked as if it hit his neck missing helmet completely.

Edit: Bit disappointed with the crowd booing though when he came back out.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 17, 2019, 02:27:52 PM
^ I don't like this nastiness (booing etc.) one bit!

Smith came out to play again, good man he is!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 17, 2019, 02:30:38 PM
I just saw this after signing up for Willow TV streaming service and it looked nasty.  To me it looked as if it hit his neck missing helmet completely.

Edit: Bit disappointed with the crowd booing though when he came back out.

I don't know about the booing, I'm listening on the radio.the crowd clapped him off and now he is back out there .

He wouldn't of been let back out if he was concussed but for me you have to admire the bloke , he is a phenomenal player and he has got guts
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 17, 2019, 02:38:22 PM
Well, we got him out for a hundred
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 17, 2019, 02:53:15 PM
Think the boos for him walking back out after being hit was pathetic

Archer hit a few in the WC and did the same - walked back and didnít bother checking
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: manno on August 17, 2019, 03:03:56 PM
Think the boos for him walking back out after being hit was pathetic

Archer hit a few in the WC and did the same - walked back and didnít bother checking

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ikJj4JPgMBc (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ikJj4JPgMBc)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 17, 2019, 03:51:38 PM
9-1 Roy gone
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 17, 2019, 03:53:40 PM
Golden duck for Root
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 17, 2019, 03:57:28 PM
Let the moaning begin......
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 17, 2019, 04:00:07 PM
Back in shocking trouble again. Fragile the only way to describe our batting.

I suppose there will be calls for Root to go back to 4 but does it really matter...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 17, 2019, 04:30:49 PM
We just need another opener that wonít give it away and will offer the middle order some protection. Burns looks middling at best but he sticks about and does the first part of his job at least.

Needs more games to be sure but not really sure what Royís role in the side is?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 17, 2019, 05:00:10 PM
Crikey, how we feeling about Burns now? Looks like our best batsman at the moment 🙄
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 17, 2019, 05:11:09 PM
71-4 Denly and Burns gone to the ageless Siddle. Stokes dropped twice as well
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 17, 2019, 05:11:30 PM
How this team is so inept in their own conditions is beyond me
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 17, 2019, 05:13:33 PM
How this team is so inept in their own conditions is beyond me
Wouldíve been worse if Warner could catch
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 17, 2019, 05:15:06 PM
Ahhhh f*ck it!! Why do I support this spineless, paper-mache, wet paper bag, f*ckwit of a batting order?

I feel Butler owes us a few test runs here!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 17, 2019, 05:24:07 PM
I think....as I posted before we, well not us but we like to pick the team  :) , we might have to choose one batter keeper in the short term.

That would open a space for Sam Curran or...a specialist opener. Don't actually know who that would be to be honest, maybe Sibey

And then choose one of Denly of Roy at number 4.

Anyone else have a better idea?  :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 17, 2019, 05:27:05 PM
Ed Smith hired the likes of Marcus Trescothick and Jonathan Trott to help him eye out players within the County Championship, but instead goes with this beatnik theory of a white ball opener being perfectly capable of doing it with a red ball despite predominantly spending his first class career at 4/5. What's the point?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 17, 2019, 05:33:57 PM
Is anyone going to acknowledge that the ball Roy got today most players would get out to or does that not fit the script!

It was the same length as roots yet it got up to chest high yet roots was thigh?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 17, 2019, 05:48:39 PM
It's a similar pitch to the Ireland game yes....a better one that moved all over the shop, but uneven bounce on this one.

Damp and overhead conditions as well don't make for easy batting yes quite true.

But It's still not really good enough.

England will stick with Roy, he has to have a fair run, but would he be better at 4 rather than opening...if so do they have to pick one of Denly or Roy to do that job...

Or....swap them Denly opens and Roy takes his spot?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 17, 2019, 05:57:42 PM
Excellent day of cricket; shame we're up against it
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 17, 2019, 06:31:30 PM
Pretty much nailed on for a draw unless we bat terribly in the first session isnít it?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 17, 2019, 08:00:15 PM
If they can somehow (quickly) get 230-250 they might dangle a carrot and declare with two sessions left; all depends how ballsy Root wants to be
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 17, 2019, 08:18:33 PM
With a full day's play there's enough overs and enough in the pitch for us to get rolled with a lead of only 150

If Australia had held their catches might already be 7 down

I don't fancy bairstow to bat in a crisis so it will be down to butler and stokes to get to lunch somehow. A lead of 175 maybe if we get there a there's a chance we could win

The sort of day you just want to sit and listen to the radio/watch sky.im off zip lining over a London park.

Crazy I know
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 18, 2019, 09:28:06 AM
Weather experts completely wrong, absolutely lashing it down.

Inevitable draw now really
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 18, 2019, 11:24:19 AM
Smith now out
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 18, 2019, 11:24:50 AM
Steven Smith out of the match with delayed concussion. Australia have applied for Labuschagne to replace him. Smith unlikely to be fit for Leeds
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 18, 2019, 11:26:10 AM
Can't see any reasons why Labuschagne would be refused as a like for like replacement for Smith, is this the first time a concussion sub will be used in a test match?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 18, 2019, 11:32:28 AM
Can't see any reasons why Labuschagne would be refused as a like for like replacement for Smith, is this the first time a concussion sub will be used in a test match?
First time in test history
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 18, 2019, 12:33:25 PM
157-4 at lunch, lead of 165. Around 67 overs left. Maybe give it a welly for 15 overs and set the aussies 250 in 50 overs
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 18, 2019, 01:23:43 PM
157-4 at lunch, lead of 165. Around 67 overs left. Maybe give it a welly for 15 overs and set the aussies 250 in 50 overs

Or just pound the Aussie bowlers into the ground , draw the game and now smith is out target 1-1  next game
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 18, 2019, 02:11:24 PM
How bloody good is Ben Stokes?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 18, 2019, 02:28:57 PM
How bloody good is Ben Stokes?

Very good
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 18, 2019, 03:10:17 PM
Ouch!

So we have the first ever concussion substitute.
Are we also gonna have the first ever substitute being substituted?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 18, 2019, 03:23:42 PM
Might be a good time to get Leach on in tandem with Archer
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 18, 2019, 03:49:30 PM
Carey smith and labuscagne on 6 weeks!

Jusst seen on the live feed archer has hit the helmet of 15 batsmen in his career Lready!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 18, 2019, 04:02:36 PM
Was critical of archer when he hit smith. Looks like heís learnt and checked up on Labuschagne - credit to him
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 18, 2019, 04:06:10 PM
NUT
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 18, 2019, 04:53:50 PM
Labuschagne is playing really well here.

Impressive given the notice he had and his first few balls
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 18, 2019, 04:59:20 PM
If Smith's fit for Leeds, one of Warner or Bancroft will probably get axed as Labuschagne deserves to retain his place
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 18, 2019, 05:04:38 PM
Is that Roy drop our last chance for this game?




I also wonder, do the Aussies have a forum constantly wanting to drop there players? Who are they discussing.
Iíd presume Bancroft. But warner to? Paine our for Carey??

Be similar to why we want. Lol
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 18, 2019, 05:06:12 PM
Roy drops one so (hopefully) he drops himself. Ah.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 18, 2019, 05:06:19 PM
Carey's keeping is average at best. Paine might not score too many but he's a top quality keeper. And I'd always pick a better keeper - cough cough Foakes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Byo on August 18, 2019, 05:07:01 PM
Roy having one of the worst test matches ever!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 18, 2019, 05:40:06 PM
3rd umpire making shockers too
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 18, 2019, 05:40:31 PM
Not sure that was out at all.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jayralh on August 18, 2019, 05:41:28 PM
Rubbish..that's not out
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 18, 2019, 05:45:03 PM
Out from side on clearly landed in fingers
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 18, 2019, 05:47:42 PM
Out from side on clearly landed in fingers

His fingers were behind the ball, not under it.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 18, 2019, 05:52:37 PM
His fingers were behind the ball, not under it.

Not from side on, you couldn't tell from front on

Out 100 percent out
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 18, 2019, 05:57:39 PM
Not from side on, you couldn't tell from front on

Out 100 percent out

I think opinions will depend what side of the fence you sit on, for me I could clearly see his pinky finger behind the ball when it was touching grass, but as I say, people tend to see what they want.

Clearly not out for me.

Either way, heck of a knock from Labuschagne.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 18, 2019, 06:02:23 PM
Iím on Englandís side of the fence and it bounced.



Anyway thatís a ripper of a catch!!!


But.
If labuschange wasnít sweeping outside leg and paine isnít trying to pull. Neither for hose happen.
Are Australia trying to save this or not?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jayralh on August 18, 2019, 06:03:37 PM
His pinky and ring finger were behind ball bent on ground from side on,not under. Ball bounced in hands from front angle that's not not. Don't need any other angle if it's not out.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Byo on August 18, 2019, 06:04:41 PM
That drop by Roy proving very costly
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 18, 2019, 06:12:54 PM
Picking Roy (as an opener anyway) is proving pretty costly.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 18, 2019, 06:52:42 PM
3rd umpire making shockers too

We are talking about Joel Wilson so no surprise there  ;)

Well played to both England and Australia.  Excellent game of test cricket.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 18, 2019, 07:08:28 PM
A good game in the end thanks to Stokes getting runs when we needed it. Archer will get the headlines and well deserved but great performance by Leach I though showing the value of a specialist spinner , keeping things quiet so the seamers are trying to get wicket not worry too much about giving away a few runs.

Interesting now what England will do to try to get more from the batting order. I think myself if we are going to stick with Roy it's best move him now with 3 matches still to go. Him and Denly to swap places is an option.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: joymarvin on August 18, 2019, 07:19:38 PM
Think the boos for him walking back out after being hit was pathetic

Archer hit a few in the WC and did the same - walked back and didnít bother checking

Bad sportsmanship from Archer honestly. Test match cannot be at its best when one does not show good sportsmanship.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 18, 2019, 07:29:18 PM
Bad sportsmanship from Archer honestly. Test match cannot be at its best when one does not show good sportsmanship.

I think the tv footage didn't help him! They said the same on sky this morning, the clip of him laughing was after smith got up and once buttler had already checked on smith

Archer also checked bto make sure marnus was ok after his whack too!

We're a funny bunch we've all been looking forward to having big bad Archer and now he's too big and bad!

I think jofras interviews afterwards speak volumes about his character
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 18, 2019, 08:02:57 PM
England have showed enough concern post match for me, I'm sure none of the players want anyone injured.we are not that sort of team.

Intimidatory fast bowling is rare these days but back a few years and we have been on the end of a lot of it. The West Indies of the eighties  used it as well as Australia.

It's part of the game if you have a bowler that quick you are going to use it. Hopefully Smith recovers in time for the third test and although the actual ball missed protection thank god for helmets I say.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Luke-scicc on August 18, 2019, 08:10:39 PM
To be honest, I don't see a problem with how Archer has conducted himself at all, as has been said the TV footage made it look worse than it was.

Genuine fast bowling like archer bowls is a rarity in this day and age, I think it odd that pro level players don't all wear a neck guard not that I think it would have prevented the blow Smith took.

It's just reminds everyone what a dangerous sport cricket can be.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on August 19, 2019, 10:28:32 AM
Picking Roy (as an opener anyway) is proving pretty costly.

Will someone please remind Michael Vaughan that a few weeks ago he was strongly advocating the use of England's one-day opening partnership in the Ashes series?

Commentators generally seem very inconsistent when considering how different/ similar one-day and Test cricket are.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mo_town on August 19, 2019, 11:19:47 AM
Not sure why it is such an issue is a fast bowler is not apologetic after hitting a batsman with a bouncer. For me, its part of the game. You dont see a batsman apologizing to a bowler when he smashes a six or plays a ramp. I think fast bowlers have gone soft after the Hughes incident which is understandable to some extent. But its great to watch angry fast bowlers making life difficult for batsmen and enjoying it.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on August 19, 2019, 01:13:49 PM
Funny how when Mitchell Johnson was bowling at his best, the Australian's on the field were telling him to injure opponents, now they have all turned into snowflakes when they get some of it back.  At least Archer was sending it down to the top order - the short stuff in the second test was started by Pat Cummins bowling entire over a of bouncers at the tail
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 19, 2019, 01:17:01 PM
fast bowler is not apologetic after hitting a batsman with a bouncer.

I am perfectly ok in not being apologetic but making sure / checking up on the batsmen to make sure everything they are ok, should be considered as common courtesy.  That's just my viewpoint and other folks will have different viewpoint on it which I am perfectly ok with also.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: george_parv on August 19, 2019, 01:19:31 PM
No issue with fast bowlers not apologising its part of the game. Its the batsmen's prerogative to protect themselves .

On another note I am surprised to see Roy selected again. My only hope is to see him have a chance in the middle order rather than opening. The issue for selectors will be that everyone has just been playing t20 cricket at county level for the past month....
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 19, 2019, 01:23:19 PM
Roy has more of a chance to do well at 4 or 5

I think England my swap him and Denly round

Far as opening goes Roy can get by without a perfect technique but not without the mental ability to bat long periods and let balls go
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 19, 2019, 01:27:08 PM
Funny how when Mitchell Johnson was bowling at his best, the Australian's on the field were telling him to injure opponents, now they have all turned into snowflakes when they get some of it back.  At least Archer was sending it down to the top order - the short stuff in the second test was started by Pat Cummins bowling entire over a of bouncers at the tail

Far too much is being made of archers perceived reaction/ non action

No one Iím absolutely sure wants to see anyone injured from either side and I wasnít going to bring this up but...

Johnson to Anderson-Micheal Clarke. Deliberate attempt to injure an opponent.

England made no complaint after that particular incident
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mo_town on August 19, 2019, 01:48:06 PM
Roy can get by without a perfect technique but not without the mental ability to bat long periods and let balls go

Very well put. He is clearly not comfortable. I guess he needs that one good innings to get his confidence back.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 19, 2019, 03:28:03 PM
If people moan about Archer not apologising, have you seen the footage of Steyns fastest spells he was savage
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 19, 2019, 03:50:36 PM
Moeen Ali has been bowling medium pace for Worcestershire and has figures of 39.1-8-126-3

The man is (sadly), shot
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 19, 2019, 03:56:08 PM
Also Sammy has come out at #3 for Surrey like he has in the T20 and hooked his first shot for four. Get the feeling he's rather serious about getting into England's top order...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 19, 2019, 03:57:26 PM
If people moan about Archer not apologising, have you seen the footage of Steyns fastest spells he was savage

Donít think any of the Aussie team complained. Just CBF peeps. Fast bowlers need to maintain their fear factor (Ian Chappell mentioned they would stop lillee from checking on batsmen so he wouldnít lose his edge), and fair play to Archer for walking back.

 I do however think it was atrocious of the crowd to boo smith after such a blow - disgusting and unacceptable.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Buzz on August 19, 2019, 04:19:20 PM
Sam also getting used to batting at three for England, as Surrey put middle order player Ryan Patel up to open and he is inevitably out early.
No idea why Borthwick didn't open.

Edit
Sam Curran batting at three today was because he is meeting up with the test team and is being subbed by Conor Mckerr.
Made sense to give him a bat!
Good time, not a long time sadly...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: j.f.101 on August 19, 2019, 04:37:57 PM
Moeen Ali has been bowling medium pace for Worcestershire and has figures of 39.1-8-126-3

The man is (sadly), shot

Seems like he switched between off spin and medium pace a bit through the day.. not sure what the balance between the two was but it's strange either way

Edit: flicking back through the live stream, it looks as if he got to 0-92 off 25 overs with off spin before switching to medium pace for a few overs, then back to off spin when he got his wickets
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 20, 2019, 09:39:54 AM
Smith ruled out of the 3rd test. A real shame, but for England they will probably be happy, as twisted as that may sound.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 20, 2019, 09:49:37 AM
There's a lot of mania about Archer this week, and I hope he does really well- he's certainly very exciting.

However, I'm very uncomfortable about all this 'he's going to win us the Ashes' and 'he's the difference between the sides' stuff in the media and from the England camp. It's still early days, and I'd rather see him burn brightly throughout the rest of the series before proclaiming him the messiah.

I'd like him to get a couple of 5'fers first (and not get overbowled)!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: petehosk on August 20, 2019, 10:07:16 AM
There's a lot of mania about Archer this week, and I hope he does really well- he's certainly very exciting.

However, I'm very uncomfortable about all this 'he's going to win us the Ashes' and 'he's the difference between the sides' stuff in the media and from the England camp. It's still early days, and I'd rather see him burn brightly throughout the rest of the series before proclaiming him the messiah.

I'd like him to get a couple of 5'fers first (and not get overbowled)!

Totally agree! Archer looks to be a fantastic prospect but he needs time to get used to this format at International level!
He also needs to settle in too.

And shame Smith is out for another Tesrt although better safe than sorry to be fair. Plus it gives Smith more time to get over being hit a few times. He is probably strong enough but the extra week or so should help him get straight!
Plus that new kid looked rather promising and a very solid batsman! If he keeps getting runs, will be interesting to see who loses their place in the starting XI!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 20, 2019, 11:47:22 AM
Don't really get the concern so far with Jofra and his workloads; said before he's used to 50 odd overs across two innings, suspect he only bowled a bit more on Sunday because him and Leach were the obvious two capable of pushing the result.

Labuschagne hit this morning by a Starc bumper in the nets, how about that eh...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 20, 2019, 07:08:45 PM
https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27426209/jason-roy-suited-middle-order-says-bayliss-change-unlikely (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27426209/jason-roy-suited-middle-order-says-bayliss-change-unlikely)

Sigh. Just makes me detest Ed Smith even more to be honest
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 21, 2019, 12:18:02 PM
Ollie pope the middle order batsmen called up as cover for England opener Jason Roy....

That makes sense. Although Ollie hit 200 today
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 21, 2019, 12:50:10 PM
Ollie pope the middle order batsmen called up as cover for England opener Jason Roy....

That makes sense. Although Ollie hit 200 today

Apparently it was a Ďthrowdowní From trescothic that decked him. Tres must have one heck of an arm !
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 21, 2019, 12:55:10 PM
Should just drop Pope for Roy to be honest, put the former in at 4. Ah.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: j.f.101 on August 21, 2019, 03:26:05 PM
The fact that Pope has been called up as cover for Roy rather than, say, Sibley, suggests that Roy's moving down the order for the 3rd test. Presumably that means that Denly will open.

Makes sense to me - Denly looks marginally more capable of grinding out a 30 to see the openers off, and the potential benefit of Roy coming in later on against an older ball and more tired bowlers could be significant
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 21, 2019, 06:35:36 PM
From the press today Roy will open, Root says he wants him to open, Bayliff said he could bat down the order in future.
Easy for us sometimes to pick a team and order from our armchairs with no responsibility. I just find it hard to believe Root genuine thinks Roy has what it takes to be an opening bat, great talent but another middle order player in future I think.

Ollie Pope is potentially one for the future,  delighted England have shown consistency bringing him in as cover.

If I was picking the team  :) I would have the older player opening and get Roy in at 4 where he might be more suited.

Long term I think we have too many allrounders, the best keeper and the best spinner must play (Foakes and leach) then work out who the best batsman is out of butler , bairstow, roy and maybe pope.

Stokes bats 6 as the allrounder. Keeper bats 7.

But England probably will continue as we have been going for some time to come, not much will change I don't think.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Buzz on August 21, 2019, 08:40:58 PM
Ollie Pope should be starting ahead of Denley, Buttler and Roy.

He averages 60 div one cricket and scores a ton every four games. Exceptional for a 21 year old.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 21, 2019, 11:05:04 PM
Ollie Pope should be starting ahead of Denley, Buttler and Roy.

He averages 60 div one cricket and scores a ton every four games. Exceptional for a 21 year old.

Don't disagree with this save that he is another guy who wants to bat 5 or 6.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 08:04:53 AM
Sounds like Australia are making some changes with Harris reportedly coming in for Bancroft and Pattinson in for Siddle
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 22, 2019, 08:10:19 AM
Sounds like Australia are making some changes with Harris reportedly coming in for Bancroft and Pattinson in for Siddle

Potential for that benefiting England, Harris by all accounts is also out of nick and his head has been target practise this week in the nets. Siddle is very dependable and used to England conditions having been with Essex for a few years now and bowled very well in the two tests so far. Pattinson is also very good but not sure he will be as economic as Siddle so maybe some more scoring options.

Fingers crossed today our batting comes good
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 22, 2019, 08:40:44 AM
Potential for that benefiting England, Harris by all accounts is also out of nick and his head has been target practise this week in the nets. Siddle is very dependable and used to England conditions having been with Essex for a few years now and bowled very well in the two tests so far. Pattinson is also very good but not sure he will be as economic as Siddle so maybe some more scoring options.

Fingers crossed today our batting comes good

Cummins and Hazelwood are usually fairly economical, I think Pattinsons extra pace will be a welcome addition.

Nothing wrong with changing up at the top of the order either in my opinion, Bancroft was just plodding about, Harris will play with a bit of flare, whether it comes off is another matter but it will be a welcome sight after watching Bancroft trying not to get out for two tests. To be fair, if England had the depth to be making changes with their batting, they would be as well.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 10:07:15 AM
Win toss and bowl. Same team.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 22, 2019, 10:30:07 AM
Cummins and Hazelwood are usually fairly economical, I think Pattinsons extra pace will be a welcome addition.

Nothing wrong with changing up at the top of the order either in my opinion, Bancroft was just plodding about, Harris will play with a bit of flare, whether it comes off is another matter but it will be a welcome sight after watching Bancroft trying not to get out for two tests. To be fair, if England had the depth to be making changes with their batting, they would be as well.
Isnít Harris a bit of a blocker?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 22, 2019, 10:57:49 AM
Isnít Harris a bit of a blocker?

Not particularly, fairly aggressive outside of the off stump off the front and back foot. uses his feet to the spinners. Anything feels aggressive in contrast to Bancrofts plodding though.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 11:26:45 AM
What a beauty from Jofra
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 22, 2019, 11:27:31 AM
Fair pill that.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 22, 2019, 11:32:16 AM
Interesting(or not), TMS stated that the concussion sub nominated by England for the last test was Sibley.


Maybe our cbf selection committee are thinking on the same lines as Englandís........
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 22, 2019, 01:42:10 PM
Interesting(or not), TMS stated that the concussion sub nominated by England for the last test was Sibley.


Maybe our cbf selection committee are thinking on the same lines as Englandís........
Surely you donít name a concussion sub until it happens?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 02:16:20 PM
Shambolic that they're fannying about when it's clear...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 22, 2019, 02:35:35 PM
Surely you donít name a concussion sub until it happens?

TMS said England named a concussion sub for the entire side. But only mentioned that sibley was the one designated as a ďtop order replacementĒ on that list.


They was discussing if Australia could use smith this test if he was declared fit when it was needed. And mentioned that although the rules done state it needs to be named in advance England had named there replacements.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 22, 2019, 03:31:32 PM
Umpires taking centre stage utterly shambolic!!!!!

Not getting back out quick enough now off for bad light!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 03:51:28 PM
Not a great 20 minutes since tea
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 22, 2019, 03:57:09 PM
Seems like weíve bowled too short for the conditions. Thereís still plenty of movement when we drag the Aussies forward.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 22, 2019, 04:07:38 PM
Can someone please tell England they have to back up!!

So many buzzers
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 22, 2019, 04:11:05 PM
Woakes struggling a little. No real rhythm in his bowling
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 22, 2019, 04:21:38 PM
Last 10 overs 66 runs, combination of poor bowling and a good counter attack
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 04:26:59 PM
He remembers he has a spinner who can tie up an end right?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 22, 2019, 04:29:08 PM
Archer might be young and fit but Root is going to burn him out with the excessive use.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 04:48:02 PM
Absolute peach from Broad
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 22, 2019, 05:27:35 PM
Labuschagneís just had his beans refried. Doesnít seem a happy chap lol
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 05:38:49 PM
Why play a spinner and not bowl him
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 22, 2019, 05:45:52 PM
Why play a spinner and not bowl him

Over head conditions as they are it's a seamers day and we are only 43 overs in!!

That being said I'd have given leach a couple at least during the Warner marnus partnership
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 22, 2019, 05:48:05 PM
We be screwed if smith and Marnus play in the same test.......
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 05:58:52 PM
Jofra is a star
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 22, 2019, 06:13:10 PM
5 for jof
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 22, 2019, 06:14:59 PM
More impressive JOEL WILSON GOT A DECISION RIGHT!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 06:24:56 PM
Turd gets wickets
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 22, 2019, 06:25:20 PM
Bit gutted for Marnus there. Deserved a ton for his performance here and at lords.

Beamer and lights done him there though......... stokes for president!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 22, 2019, 06:25:32 PM
Have we tried that one to Smith yet???
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 22, 2019, 06:27:45 PM
I was just getting ready to write if Marnus would be able to pull a Smith with the tail but he just got out.

We know Smith is going to be back next game and the way Marnus is playing I do not see Aus dropping him for the next game, which means either Head or Wade are going to miss out, unless they decide to drop Paine and make Wade the keeper.  I hope that does not happen, since IMHO Paine is a better keeper.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 22, 2019, 06:30:36 PM
JOFRA
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 22, 2019, 06:31:03 PM
Decent day for England, but Aussies could have been 50 lighter if we went sonpoor after tea.


Letís hope itís bight blue skies and sun for a lovely bat tomorrow!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 22, 2019, 06:31:39 PM
6 for jof

179 all out! I'll take that! Better forcast ahead! Let's bat well and once!!! COME ON ENGLAND
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: liscon12 on August 22, 2019, 06:37:47 PM
I was just getting ready to write if Marnus would be able to pull a Smith with the tail but he just got out.

We know Smith is going to be back next game and the way Marnus is playing I do not see Aus dropping him for the next game, which means either Head or Wade are going to miss out, unless they decide to drop Paine and make Wade the keeper.  I hope that does not happen, since IMHO Paine is a better keeper.

Surely you would drop Kawaja and put Marnus in at 3, seems like the more logical decision to me??
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jimmy23 on August 22, 2019, 06:40:13 PM
There's a lot of mania about Archer this week, and I hope he does really well- he's certainly very exciting.

However, I'm very uncomfortable about all this 'he's going to win us the Ashes' and 'he's the difference between the sides' stuff in the media and from the England camp. It's still early days, and I'd rather see him burn brightly throughout the rest of the series before proclaiming him the messiah.

I'd like him to get a couple of 5'fers first (and not get overbowled)!

Thereís one for you 👍🏻
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 22, 2019, 06:43:55 PM
Surely you would drop Kawaja and put Marnus in at 3, seems like the more logical decision to me??

Or leave Harris out and open with Khawaja?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 22, 2019, 06:44:16 PM
I was just getting ready to write if Marnus would be able to pull a Smith with the tail but he just got out.

We know Smith is going to be back next game and the way Marnus is playing I do not see Aus dropping him for the next game, which means either Head or Wade are going to miss out, unless they decide to drop Paine and make Wade the keeper.  I hope that does not happen, since IMHO Paine is a better keeper.

Khawaja goes first imo, he's the softest cricketer I've seen in a long time, and easily one of the worst fielder's going around.

Hopefully the bowlers turn it on tomorrow and we have a game on our hands.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 22, 2019, 07:44:34 PM
How this guy marnus unprenounceablelastname has not been a shoe in before I don't know.played superb and to be fair so did the Aussies to get to 100-2 in very hard conditions.

Conditions very much in our favour today lets be honest, superb bowling from Broad and Archer.

Broad seems to be defying the predictions of 'not much left' and Jimmy looks like he is fit, who to leave out? But let's enjoy the game so far it's been good entertainment worry about the team later  :)

Australia have got to have marnus in rest of the games and not sure who they leave out. I've never thought khawaja is top class myself but stats over the last year prove otherwise-as someone told me today.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 22, 2019, 08:17:32 PM
Surely you would drop Kawaja and put Marnus in at 3, seems like the more logical decision to me??

Khawaja is another option, especially if he does not get any runs in the 2nd innings.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: hammersjr on August 22, 2019, 09:36:39 PM
Thought Marnus should've been in from the start due to scoring over a thousand runs in the CC this year

Shown he could play the moving ball and in good form
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 23, 2019, 08:41:42 AM
Thought Marnus should've been in from the start due to scoring over a thousand runs in the CC this year

Shown he could play the moving ball and in good form

Hasnít Bancroft scored barrel loads in the CC too?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mo_town on August 23, 2019, 09:21:16 AM
I just dont understand the logic behind not picking Mitchell Starc?? He was your best bowler in the world cup and he has got that X factor!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on August 23, 2019, 09:33:06 AM
Hasnít Bancroft scored barrel loads in the CC too?
Not particularly, 726 at 45 so an improvement on his previous county form (he was rubbish at Glos bar one knock), but he's a fair way off the best in the division.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 10:19:12 AM
Again, Jason Roy should be nowhere near this team
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 23, 2019, 10:22:01 AM
Batted Jason, go keep the seats warm again please mate
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 10:26:37 AM
And Root now. Jesus Christ we are awful.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 10:30:20 AM
Absolute crap, and saved by DRS
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 23, 2019, 10:34:00 AM
Who is our Test batting coach?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 23, 2019, 10:36:49 AM
Flat track bully root
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on August 23, 2019, 10:40:07 AM
Anyone who thinks Root should bat 3 needs to give their head a wobble. This includes Root and Bayliss!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 10:54:46 AM
We are crap
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 23, 2019, 10:55:13 AM
Ramps got booted out after the winter, donít think we have a bat coach

But they canít play for us anyway

If we get to their score Iíll be happy!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 23, 2019, 11:10:25 AM
Shocking again from Roy just brain dead, crap batting and Iím going to say absolutely crap management. Bayliss openly states Roy should by batting middle order but yet he still opens. At risk here of ruining him as confidence is fragile and we could ruin his white ball form. This Roy experiment has to end for this series now.

Root needs to go back to 4 and strong discussions about him giving up the captaincy as well in my opinion. Once again we are hoping our middle order can bail us out and looks very likely that we will be doing well to match Aus first innings score let alone get a sizeable lead as we have to bat 4th and we all know how that ends over the past few years.

Fingers crossed for Denly to come good.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on August 23, 2019, 11:11:13 AM
That Roy dismissal is so disappointing. Honestly it's like watching a village cricketer, hits 1 boundary and thinks he should cream absolutely everything outside off.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 23, 2019, 11:16:45 AM
Ashes....gone
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 11:18:33 AM
Just braindead. Absolutely braindead.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 23, 2019, 11:21:58 AM
Anyone who thinks Root should bat 3 needs to give their head a wobble. This includes Root and Bayliss!
Heís not really batting 3 though is he. Heís opening. How soon has he been in each innings this series?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 23, 2019, 11:27:45 AM
Office chat here just been asked what the follow on is!
I dunno

Wheels are well and truly off now
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 11:45:06 AM
How more (No Swearing Please) (No Swearing Please) can you get
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 23, 2019, 11:46:39 AM
Wow didn't have access to TV or radio was assuming Roy wouldn't get many but 45/5 is ridiculous. We are batting on a considerably better day than the Aussies yesterday yet we are imploding
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 11:49:30 AM
Fucktards. The lot of them.

And yeah, this is a performance worthy of foul language.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 23, 2019, 11:52:13 AM
Indefensible

Pathetic

Joke

Embarrassing

I will defend England more than most but this is crap complete and utter crap!

I'd love to see a beehive of hear dismissals I bet we could have left all of them
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 23, 2019, 11:54:33 AM
I guess simply put a very good white ball side but a bang average test or red ball side when it comes to batting. Feel sorry for the bowlers as they keep getting us in good positions only for our batters to be bang average. Roy was just shocking, Root got a decent enough ball but plays with an angled bat, Burns 50/50 if he should have played that shot given the situation, fortunately havenít seen the rest of the wickets as Iím currently in a soft play with my 8month old who Iím sure already has better game situation management than Roy or the England selectors
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 23, 2019, 12:18:17 PM
Can't see a good reason for Foakes to not take the gloves in the test side tbh
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: manno on August 23, 2019, 12:26:29 PM
Blame the bats of englishmen. But there appeared to be, to me at least, an Australian bowler involved in each of those wickets.....
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 23, 2019, 12:34:28 PM
Blame the bats of englishmen. But there appeared to be, to me at least, an Australian bowler involved in each of those wickets.....

Root got a good nut, few others god decent balls but far from unplayable.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Chompy9760 on August 23, 2019, 12:35:45 PM
The Aus bowling has been every bit as good as the English bowling yesterday.  Not every day you see four catches at first slip and two caught behind from the first six wickets!
Tight line and length (and some poor footwork) made Roy, Burns, Denley and Stokes have big swings at balls they all could have left.
Root fair enough - he got a great second ball, and I thought Bairstow was seeing them well until he nicked one without any footwork.
Persisting opening with Roy is what we would call "throwing good money after bad".
Burns' forward leaning batting stance is his achilles for short balls, and he can expect a lot of them for the rest of the series.

Interesting that Warner missed out on runs at Edgebaston, had another shocker at Lords plus dropped a couple (allowing Stokes to get a hundred), and here he makes runs and all the catches stick.
I guess that's why we all love cricket - knowing that despite poor form, sometimes it can all turn around for you! :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 23, 2019, 12:37:15 PM
Blame the bats of englishmen. But there appeared to be, to me at least, an Australian bowler involved in each of those wickets.....

Australia are a fantastic bowling side not argument there, but this English batting line up fails time and time again, even Irelandís attack had our players in all sorts. The conditions yesterday as all the pros and pundits said was as hard as you can get, today looks 10 times easier conditions wise but once again we implode, starting at the top with a white ball biffer and the middle order are in after 10-15 overs almost every innings.

But as you mention great use of the new cherry by the Aussie attack and whoever comes in bowling wise does the job. Even your flakey batting line up looks super solid compared to our muppets
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: manno on August 23, 2019, 12:44:03 PM
You know as well as i do, probably more so, that the decision to leave a ball is a question asked and often answered by the bowler alone.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 12:48:10 PM
Please mods, turn the swearing filter off
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: manno on August 23, 2019, 12:50:22 PM
Yeah thats all woakes.....
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 23, 2019, 01:03:32 PM
This is shocking. We are going to concede a hundred runs on first innings !!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 23, 2019, 01:04:09 PM
So what excuses are we going to get this time?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 23, 2019, 01:15:17 PM
England have had the best of conditions to bowl and bat in. Yet embarrassingly rolled over

Superb bowling from Australia - Denly and Roy are not test match cricketers. Could argue neither is bairstow
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 23, 2019, 01:15:32 PM
Joe Root probably the only one who can say he didn't throw it away. Incredible bowling by the Aussies. I think it was a common understanding that the bowling would decide this series. Australia will still have to play well to take this away from England.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 01:25:18 PM
Broad with one already. Still, this game has gone...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: token on August 23, 2019, 01:28:05 PM
Broad with one already. Still, this game has gone...

Labuschagne aside, this Australian batting line up is woeful. Game isn't gone just yet...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 01:28:44 PM
Labuschagne aside, this Australian batting line up is woeful. Game isn't gone just yet...

We are even more woeful though.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on August 23, 2019, 01:34:09 PM
Honest question - why were Broad and Anderson both overlooked for the captaincy? Does it have to be a batsman EVERY time?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 23, 2019, 01:38:57 PM
Rain or shine, AUS keeps marching! What a team!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 23, 2019, 01:39:54 PM
Anderson was interviewed for the job and wanted it

Root was the heir apparent despite not having an obvious advantage over any other player

It was the wrong call, root needs just to be able to concentrate on his batting only
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 02:08:58 PM
Oh look, our spinner gets a wicket for his first ball
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 23, 2019, 02:09:08 PM
Not a bad start from Leach
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jayralh on August 23, 2019, 02:11:59 PM
That was some ball
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 23, 2019, 02:15:39 PM
If Leech can produce that 1st up Lyon could be a nightmare even more dangerous than a 5th stump line to Roy.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 23, 2019, 02:28:53 PM
I hope Langer gives Khawaja an absolute serve for that, as a senior player to get set like that and then throw it away trying to chase cheap flashy runs when instead of digging in and putting England away is absolutely unacceptable.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 23, 2019, 02:29:43 PM
Is it just me was Archer walking tentative when walk towards his run up?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 23, 2019, 03:01:10 PM
Is it just me was Archer walking tentative when walk towards his run up?
That's what happens when your strike bowler bowls 70 overs inside a week with minimal recovery time
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 03:10:20 PM
Don't think we're winning this from here then. Ah.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 23, 2019, 03:33:04 PM
We have to bat for at least 40 mins today to stand a chance anything beyond that it done

We won't be batting until tomorrow so
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 23, 2019, 03:47:54 PM
Root drops a sitter now
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: norman1979 on August 23, 2019, 03:48:16 PM
Game over I think.
Start the car...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 03:48:40 PM
Pathetic drop
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 23, 2019, 03:48:46 PM
Rootís captaincy surely coming to a close
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 23, 2019, 04:01:59 PM
Great but from Stokes, certainly hit his tail up
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 04:02:24 PM
I miss seeing more yorkers
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 23, 2019, 04:35:46 PM
And yet most of these are lauded as great test batsmen

Stokes
Bairstow
Buttler

Even ali has been said to be top six on here....

Roy.....
Hales ...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 23, 2019, 04:40:52 PM
This is abject from England- with batting efforts like this, you donít deserve to win the Ashes.

Thereís 6 or 7 batters and some coaching staff who need to take a good long look at themselves for the money they are being paid - and take a little pride in the cross of St George.

Some of these openers like Robson who scrabbled  an average of 30 and were discarded arenít looking so bad now.

There has to be a better top 3 in England than this - sort it out ECB, Root, Thorpe, Baylis and Smith. You are f*cking embarrassing yourselves!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 04:54:11 PM
Trying to run Archer in the ground then
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 23, 2019, 04:57:17 PM
Trying to run Archer in the ground then

Root hasnít managed his workload at all

It was always on the cards - his speeds have dropped drastically
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 23, 2019, 05:00:26 PM
Root hasnít managed his workload at all

It was always on the cards - his speeds have dropped drastically

Yes...because itís impossible to bowl that quick for lengthy spells , Root has no idea what he is doing

I hope..I say hope...this test match results a a big rethink of how to get our best 11 long form cricketers in for the future

Totally agree with everyone itís just not good enough
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 23, 2019, 05:06:30 PM
Marnus survives again, out of a no ball
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 23, 2019, 05:07:38 PM
That sums up our say

Marnus given not out

Correctly reviewed by root but it was a no ball

Umps misses one there but they have been fairly good this test
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 23, 2019, 05:18:25 PM
Given what happened in the WI, and vs Ireland, the bigger surprise is that people are still surprised at these batting collapses.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 23, 2019, 06:16:31 PM
I know selection is always a hot topic but surly after this series or maybe even after this test the team card needs to be something like

Burns
*
*
Root
*
Stokes
*
*
Archer
Broad
Leech

6 I think deserve their places the other 5 not sure at all. My personal view is that Bairstow is not the best keeper and his batting in test cricket is down year on year. Butler just isnít a red ball player, neither is Roy. Yes butler had a decent series a while back but has a very average red ball batting average and hardly plays red ball ever prior to his test appearances. Denly has faired ok without a big score behind him but seems to look better than most but possibly is out of his depth having played most of his very long and decent red ball career in Div 2.

Surely we do not have to have our ODI side as our test side!!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 23, 2019, 06:20:41 PM
ENG should look for another 5 year plan to sort out the Test side. There is plenty of talent to groom and build an exciting Test team. What was done with white ball can be repeated again, I see no problem with that. Also, they need to groom a new captain - someone young with lot of potential - in the style of Graeme Smith.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 23, 2019, 06:21:41 PM
That Labuchagne fella has grit!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 23, 2019, 06:34:18 PM
Burns
*
*
Root
*
Stokes
Foakes
*
Archer
Broad
Leech
Anderson

Added Foakes to the list.

I know Morgan has not played red ball cricket but could he do something similar to Brearley (sp?) did in the 80's/90's to get the best out of the current players?  I do not believe Root knows how to motivate players or how to leverage the resources available to him.  Perfect example is the way he is over bowling Archer and under bowling Woakes.

Edit: Also, added Anderson but that is a long tail for England.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 23, 2019, 06:37:09 PM
That Labuchagne fella has grit!

Yep, he has been outstanding so far.  It's going to an interesting dilemma for Aussie selection on who to leave out for the next test, with Smith most likely to come in.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 06:37:17 PM
Something has to change upstairs, a complete disregard for the game and inept performances at their finest
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 23, 2019, 06:39:10 PM
I know selection is always a hot topic but surly after this series or maybe even after this test the team card needs to be something like

Burns
*
*
Root
*
Stokes
*
*
Archer
Broad
Leech

6 I think deserve their places the other 5 not sure at all. My personal view is that Bairstow is not the best keeper and his batting in test cricket is down year on year. Butler just isnít a red ball player, neither is Roy. Yes butler had a decent series a while back but has a very average red ball batting average and hardly plays red ball ever prior to his test appearances. Denly has faired ok without a big score behind him but seems to look better than most but possibly is out of his depth having played most of his very long and decent red ball career in Div 2.

Surely we do not have to have our ODI side as our test side!!!!

Agree with your 6, I'd like us to revert back to more specialists and having too many players who bat at 5 is no good.

So...adding to your 6 I'm putting Ollie Pope in at 5 for the near future and potentially long term.And the best keeper in the Country Ben Foakes who would bat 7 the traditional keeper position. I've got Chris Woakes batting 8.

That leaves a combined PPCC/Soulman 11 missing numbers 2 and 3- the most crucial positions.

If Root continued to bat 3 I'd have Pope at 4....but he's going to go back to number 4 isn't he?

So still need 2 and 3....is one of bairstow or butler good enough to bat there? No....I don't think so

That leaves 2 specialist batsmen needed

At 3 I'm going for Malan, experience and guts is what is needed

My side leaves us lacking a number 2 with no bairstow or butler...that is the problem.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 23, 2019, 06:55:08 PM
Added Foakes to the list.

I know Morgan has not played red ball cricket but could he do something similar to Brearley (sp?) did in the 80's/90's to get the best out of the current players?  I do not believe Root knows how to motivate players or how to leverage the resources available to him.  Perfect example is the way he is over bowling Archer and under bowling Woakes.

Edit: Also, added Anderson but that is a long tail for England.


Morganís talking about maybe having to give up the odi stuff because of his back issues, and weíve got people wanting him in the test side(your not the only one whoís mentioned it).

I really doubt Morgan will ever happen.


We gonna Lose this. Might as well through lot out.

Sibley, and pope in why not foakes.


Do we have enough back up to drop buttler and bairstow? Do we want to change the lot?

Buttler was the highest England red ball scorer last summer(not just a series) and bairstow was pretty epic a few years back........ but pick whichever one you think is in better form and go with that.


Burns
Sibley
Root
Pope
Stokes(c)
Buttler/bairstow
Foakes(w)
Woakes
Archer
Broad
Leach


Thereís a chance woakes May be dropped for Anderson next test. But thatís makes a massive tail in a side already struggling for runs.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 23, 2019, 07:07:57 PM
Woakes for captain - bats well, bowls well, and very well spoken too.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 23, 2019, 07:11:46 PM

Morganís talking about maybe having to give up the odi stuff because of his back issues, and weíve got people wanting him in the test side(your not the only one whoís mentioned it).


Somehow missed that injury bit about Morgan.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 23, 2019, 07:14:23 PM
oh... and what are the current odds on Root scoring a gloriously constructed ton in the final Test when it is inevitable a dead rubber? :D

I would take a 50 from him at this point   ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 23, 2019, 07:23:44 PM
Nail hit head from George Dobell

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27446421/jason-roy-woes-test-opener-epitomise-broken-system?platform=amp&__twitter_impression=true (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27446421/jason-roy-woes-test-opener-epitomise-broken-system?platform=amp&__twitter_impression=true)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 23, 2019, 07:42:29 PM
@ppccopener yes I agree with the Foakes inclusion 100% I left all the * as TBC

I would add Malan at 3 or if they see something in Denly Iím happy for him to bat 3 and have the rest of the series.

Pope at 5 works for me as arguably the best young bat in the championship. Ballance has scored bucket loads but there was a great piece from Mark Waugh and Ricky ponting before the start of play about how to play the moving ball and they said about getting to the ball and playing the leave as a positive shot. Ballance always has and from the highlights Iv seen plays from the crease and is a back foot player predominantly which for some reason most of Englandís players are. In addition he has had 2/3 chances and after a great start never settled at test level.

As for the opener it has to be Sibley as there must be merit in the county championship and picking on form and he is the opener in form this year and has been since his move to Birmingham.

Finally Iím not totally bothered if they leave the squad for the remaining series and stick with those they picked as long as they learn. Australia prepared for the ashes test last time 9 months in advance, resting the quicks purely for test cricket. I think England have lost there way in picking the same squads for ODI and test cricket and itís just not the same game. Not against the best in the world
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Number4 on August 24, 2019, 01:36:13 AM
I know selection is always a hot topic but surly after this series or maybe even after this test the team card needs to be something like

Burns
*
*
Root
*
Stokes
*
*
Archer
Broad
Leech

6 I think deserve their places the other 5 not sure at all. My personal view is that Bairstow is not the best keeper and his batting in test cricket is down year on year. Butler just isnít a red ball player, neither is Roy. Yes butler had a decent series a while back but has a very average red ball batting average and hardly plays red ball ever prior to his test appearances. Denly has faired ok without a big score behind him but seems to look better than most but possibly is out of his depth having played most of his very long and decent red ball career in Div 2.

Surely we do not have to have our ODI side as our test side!!!!

What ever happened to Hameed? I thought he showed some promise.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 24, 2019, 06:20:20 AM
What ever happened to Hameed? I thought he showed some promise.

He did... then ECB coaches got hold of him and then old him he had to Ďexpand his gameí.. never been the same since
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jamielsn15 on August 24, 2019, 07:57:39 AM
Root's knackered. I don't think it's got anything to do with batting at three, he's been in so many times before 20 overs are bowled in the past three years. He's not thinking clearly, his poor management of Archer shows that and he's dropping catches...

Hopefully we can stop this, he opens in odis so must be able to in tests. As oer the George Dobell article. Roy is not a test opener. Warner and Sehwag can leave and play with soft hands. Roy cannot.

Ashes are as good as gone, I'd go with...

Burns
Sibley
Root
Stokes
Pope
Bairstow
Foakes +
Woakes
Archer
Broad
Leach

If they deem Archer needs a rest, see where Anderson is at. Stokes is high at four, but is in form with the bat and allows Pope to bed in in a familiar position. Bairstow is needed to focus on batting and bring in Foakes with a point to prove. Buttler gone as one hundred in 33 tests for an impact batsmen isnt, for me, quite enough. Time for specialist players in specialist roles.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on August 24, 2019, 09:10:23 AM
Added Foakes to the list.

I know Morgan has not played red ball cricket but could he do something similar to Brearley (sp?) did in the 80's/90's to get the best out of the current players?  I do not believe Root knows how to motivate players or how to leverage the resources available to him.  Perfect example is the way he is over bowling Archer and under bowling Woakes.

Edit: Also, added Anderson but that is a long tail for England.


Is this opinion formed from your extensive time spent within the England camp? :D No international player should need motivating to bat long or bowl well. As for Woakes, he's been off in this test in my opinion, bowling too short and loose. So not why would you bowl him longer?

Stokes bowled 15 straight yesterday, so I'm sure Archer can handle the spells he's had. Not sure his cramp can be put onto Root over bowling him tbf. Although as with anyone he needs to be used sensibly, but I'm sure he'd advise his captain if he felt he couldn't bowl the spells he's bowling.

The batting was always going to let us down and it has.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 24, 2019, 10:22:16 AM
The quicker they get rid of botham the better - his comments about the concussion test are unwarranted. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 24, 2019, 10:30:23 AM
How many more chances does Bairstow get? This is weak
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 24, 2019, 10:31:15 AM
Bairstow is crap. Period
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 24, 2019, 10:54:28 AM
Another misfield from him. How Foakes got dropped is still beyond me
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 24, 2019, 10:56:58 AM
(https://i.postimg.cc/28fLb75Z/Snapchat-1626158834-2.jpg)



Sneak Peak at Johnny Bairstows player edition WK glove.

In all seriousness, they need to bring foakes in.
As a cricket fan, I'm genuinely gutted for Broad, he deserves alot better and has been undeservedly lost in Archers shadow over the last two tests.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 24, 2019, 11:11:46 AM
Just imagine the state of this game if weíd been able to cobble together 160 🙄
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 24, 2019, 11:21:40 AM
If your going to be bang average behind the stumps you need to be averaging close to 50 to warrant a place

Otherwise a specialist keeper should play

Foakes being dropped after the SL or WI series,canít remember which, was one of the worst decisions I can remember

Youíve been superb and scored valuable runs and erm...we are leaving you out
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 24, 2019, 11:26:40 AM
Anyone else think of a worse recent fielding display?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 24, 2019, 11:38:35 AM
Oh and we are not chasing this
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 24, 2019, 12:45:33 PM
I don't think ODI all-rounders fare well in a Test side, Stokes is an exception.

Test teams should be about specialists, players who are absolutes champs of whatever they do.

Regarding Tim Paine, he is not scoring much runs but he is a good wicket keeper and makes good decisions. He is a good captain, certainly proving better than Root.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 24, 2019, 12:49:23 PM
Separate format teams is the way to go with different captains. AUS gets it right - someone like Chris Lynn will never be in a Test team.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 24, 2019, 12:56:17 PM
This is predictably weak.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 24, 2019, 01:15:51 PM
This is a big innings for Root. Not because his place is in jeopardy, but because he is the leader of this group and needs to stand up and show them how itís done.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on August 24, 2019, 01:20:21 PM
Separate format teams is the way to go with different captains. AUS gets it right - someone like Chris Lynn will never be in a Test team.
Lynn was a really good red ball batsman before his career was destroyed by injuries and he took the T20 route.

Averages mid 40s playing on a spicy track at the Gabba
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 24, 2019, 06:05:49 PM
How can you tell weíve done alright for a few sessions?? Itís quiet on here.




Stokes 2 of 50 balls!! Definitely not a test innings that......
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 24, 2019, 06:28:46 PM
I guess the question is why can't they apply themselves like that all the time?

Still say it's Australia's to lose, but if Stokes and Root can see the majority of the morning out and build a partnership then who knows
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 24, 2019, 07:03:39 PM
I guess the question is why can't they apply themselves like that all the time?


Maybe cuz itís damn hard ? Just a wild guess...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 24, 2019, 08:08:42 PM
Maybe cuz itís damn hard ? Just a wild guess...

Doesnít seem to be that Ďdamn hardí for other test batsmen.... Smith and  Labuschagne for example
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 24, 2019, 08:10:56 PM
For once in my life it feels like Boycottís talking a whole lot of sense
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 24, 2019, 08:20:36 PM
Doesnít seem to be that Ďdamn hardí for other test batsmen.... Smith and  Labuschagne for example

Ones a class above and the other has played a pile of red ball cricket recently.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 24, 2019, 08:46:46 PM
Canít see the cricket only what is on BBC text, we have got a punchers chance tommorow and only that

But itís how we have scored the runs, graft and leaving the ball does pay off in the long form

@SOULMAN1012 had Denly still in the CBF selection panel he got a score and guts it out.

We can only get better by picking those who can adapt between formats.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 24, 2019, 08:51:19 PM
Ones a class above and the other has played a pile of red ball cricket recently.

Playing red ball before test cricket? Thatís a novelty isnít it!



Test is all about a) being good enough and b) adapting ones your weaknesses are found out.

Marnus hasnít had a weakness discovered yet. See how he gets on when one is found. But for now he seems a pretty decent player.

Smith was nowhere near the player he was now, heís adopted and improved and learnt what he needs to do in his style.




Burns was looking good earlier this series, but Aussies seem to have exploited a weakness, if he can find a way round thy he can be around a while.

Stokes has improve ten fold, heís a much better test batsman now than he ever was. Heís adapted. Letís hope his average goes up to show that. As heís much better than the 35 heís currently averaging.


Hopefully root has come out fo this bad spot. See if he scores runs rest of series, if he does heíll be captain a while.
If this is the only
Score he gets, be interesting if he steps down or is sacked as we need him to score runs and his weakness currently is being captain.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 24, 2019, 08:52:28 PM
Maybe cuz itís damn hard ? Just a wild guess...

Time and time again for the past 4 years we are 30 odd for 3. Wake up and smell the coffee that this is not a 'its hard' problem
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 25, 2019, 10:27:14 AM
God dam!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on August 25, 2019, 11:16:14 AM
New ball not doing a lot at all, think England have a very good chance of chasing this
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 25, 2019, 11:16:40 AM
If these two can survive till lunch then maybe. Still very hard though
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on August 25, 2019, 12:07:18 PM
Nobody move from your current positions, do not bet on England winning do not talk about them winning, do not tempt fate in any way!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 25, 2019, 01:11:06 PM
Aaaarrrrrggggghhhhhh
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 25, 2019, 01:12:05 PM
This was inevitable
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 25, 2019, 01:27:41 PM
And they fall like dominoes. Sigh
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 25, 2019, 01:29:32 PM
Regardless of the result England are likely to drop Buttler and Woakes next game.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 25, 2019, 01:31:09 PM
Iím not a fan of losing. But will accept to when we get beat by a better side, good bowling display or an extraordinary innings.

Yet we havenít.

Aussies bowled well in first innings but we was just as abysmal.

Today we atarted in a decent position.
Root looks like he got out to a predetermined shot. Wait till Lyon comes on and go over top. 2days joe! Okay on merit!

And that run out..... itís a test match, why we looking for risky singles!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 25, 2019, 02:12:31 PM
Stupid from Jofra
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 25, 2019, 02:13:05 PM
lmao jofra why oh why
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 25, 2019, 02:17:21 PM
One goes, they all go
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 25, 2019, 02:25:44 PM
To be 73 runs short really puts that first innings into perspective doesnít it?

We could have won this comfortably by now!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 25, 2019, 02:52:40 PM
Yes.. the way we have battled here is the way forward thou

Call it blind support for your team but we had hope!

Stokes is a hero, and pleased Denly got some runs, we need..I think..a couple of changes to compete going forward
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 25, 2019, 03:02:09 PM
This is mental
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 25, 2019, 03:17:32 PM
Joel Wilson, you coward.
Well played Ben Stokes, lady luck loves you at the moment, but take nothing away from that innings, special.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: dynamiccoins on August 25, 2019, 03:18:17 PM
Wow
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 25, 2019, 03:20:25 PM
Come on you beauty!

Stokes is a hero! He is a god! Applaud that man. Carried us for the last 3 days in this test!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 25, 2019, 03:23:05 PM
Stokes Ashes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 25, 2019, 03:23:54 PM
Unbelievable from stokes

Canít see it abroad on bbc but he was out lbw
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 25, 2019, 03:24:21 PM
Joel Wilson, you coward.

Joel Wilson you hero!!!

That was plumb!

ARISE SIR BEN STOKES!!!

DUCKING GET IN!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: AJ2014 on August 25, 2019, 03:25:04 PM
Well done Ben Stokes! Very happy again 😀😀
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 25, 2019, 03:26:27 PM
And yet most of these are lauded as great test batsmen

Stokes
Bairstow
Buttler

Even ali has been said to be top six on here....

Roy.....
Hales ...


Dude, keep bashing stokes. Everytime you do he goes big.
Last time you said he shouldnít be in the side he got his double Ton against SA. Lol
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 25, 2019, 03:50:09 PM
Uh that's utterly heartbreaking.
But that is easily the best test innings I've ever seen.

Atleast the series is alive, and right now I can't bring myself to be critical of the Aussie lads, batted through the worst of the conditions, and then had to bowl in the baking sun for the best part of two days, which I'm sure contributed to a few skill errors late. On to the next one, with our best player back and everything to play for.

Test cricket is alive and well.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 25, 2019, 04:00:12 PM
Also thank God Paine used that awful review and that misfield from Lyon for the runout
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on August 25, 2019, 04:14:44 PM
Superb from Stokes not much else you can say about him or the innings he just played. Confirmed himself as a world class all rounder today.

As for Butler & Woakes, well Butler just isnít that match quality in current form, woakes and YJB 50/50 if they should keep there places, if Anderson is for he has to come in and woakes will be the dropped player. YJB just maybe done enough but still on the way down
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 25, 2019, 04:16:22 PM
How is Stokes able to pull out these performances? Why is he so mentally strong? Is he physically better than rest of the playing field? Is he the fittest cricketer alive? Things that make you 'hmmmm'...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: token on August 25, 2019, 04:20:16 PM
Rain or shine, AUS keeps marching! What a team!

Things that make you 'hmmmm'...  ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WABH-J on August 25, 2019, 04:36:16 PM
I tell you what, GM have got their monies worth with their Ben Stokes contract this year :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 25, 2019, 04:54:50 PM
I keep watching that switch hit. Bloody hell it's an astonishing shot
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on August 25, 2019, 05:30:04 PM
Didn't watch it today but heard the last 50 runs on the radio in the car....amazing!

Yes he was obviously out LBW, but the reviews had been used. They're supposed to be saved for decisions like this. That said if the shoe was on the other foot I'd be fuming!  :D

Also Leach should have been run out, but it's all ifs and buts which shouldn't distract from what sounds like one of the greatest knocks of all time!

Hopefully we learn from this and play proper test cricket moving forwards. All though funnily enough one day batting won this really today as it was Stokes only option!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 25, 2019, 05:40:41 PM
Didn't watch it today but heard the last 50 runs on the radio in the car....amazing!

Yes he was obviously out LBW, but the reviews had been used. They're supposed to be saved for decisions like this. That said if the shoe was on the other foot I'd be fuming!  :D

Also Leach should have been run out, but it's all ifs and buts which shouldn't distract from what sounds like one of the greatest knocks of all time!

Hopefully we learn from this and play proper test cricket moving forwards. All though funnily enough one day batting won this really today as it was Stokes only option!

Interesting last comment  :) what about Denlys 50, jack leach 1 not out in a partnership of 70 odd, roots runs

Was this not the ultimate in test match cricket where defence was just as important in our second innings?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: e4sby on August 25, 2019, 06:13:44 PM
I was there today and can safely say thatís the best day of test cricket and individual innings Iíve seen

Seen Ben Stokes live 3 times
120* v Aus Perth 2013
258 v SA Cape Town 2016
135* v Aus Headingley 2019

Could say Iím his lucky charm!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 25, 2019, 06:14:47 PM
Joel Wilson, you coward.

Joel Wilson has been a cock up waiting to happen all series. If Paine blew the review on such a vain punt, you want to be calling him a coward really...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on August 25, 2019, 06:22:36 PM
Interesting last comment  :) what about Denlys 50, jack leach 1 not out in a partnership of 70 odd, roots runs

Was this not the ultimate in test match cricket where defence was just as important in our second innings?

It was I agree, but ultimately it came down to Stokes ability to hit boundaries under pressure. Obviously the earlier part of his knock was pure test match batting, but the end was pure one day stuff really.

On the radio Cook was saying if it was him and a number 11 they'd have had no chance, as he couldn't have scored the runs quick enough. That was my point, it needed someone who could play that innings. Someone who had a one day skillset.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: FattusCattus on August 25, 2019, 06:37:35 PM
That was magnificent and thrilling!

To move forward the selectors need to take hold of their testicles and pick the right side for the next test!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 25, 2019, 06:50:40 PM
It was I agree, but ultimately it came down to Stokes ability to hit boundaries under pressure. Obviously the earlier part of his knock was pure test match batting, but the end was pure one day stuff really.

On the radio Cook was saying if it was him and a number 11 they'd have had no chance, as he couldn't have scored the runs quick enough. That was my point, it needed someone who could play that innings. Someone who had a one day skillset.

Yeah....I see what you mean we are looking at the same thing from 2 different angles

I donít see a Ďone day skillsetí . What I see is a player who can adapt to the situation regardless of what format the game is played.

It was a phenomenal innings from whatever angle you look at it and Somersetís finest jack leach was a hero too.

Agree with @FattusCattus  on this one, we can strengthen the team.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on August 25, 2019, 06:59:40 PM
That was magnificent and thrilling!

To move forward the selectors need to take hold of their testicles and pick the right side for the next test!

Next test team for me...

Burns
Sibley
Root
Denly
Stokes
Bairstow
Foakes
Archer
Broad
Anderson
Leach

Woakes if Anderson isn't fit and would bat above Archer. Only alternative is to ask Denly to open and go with Pope or another  in the middle order.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on August 25, 2019, 07:17:20 PM
Roy buttler are in danger of being dropped. Sibley and pope probably the alternatives.

Woakes May be rotated if Anderson injured.


As much as people want it and keep saying it all over, I very much doubt there gonna drop bairstow for foakes.


Mainly as after winning the test, I doubt there gonna go for four changes.
May not even go for more than 2 changes. they may just move Roy down, denly up, Pope in for buttler, Anderson for woakes and leave it at that.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 25, 2019, 07:34:06 PM
Yeah agree, I donít think England will want to jettison Roy when they know he has the ability so I think him and denly will swap

Anderson must play if he is fit the only bowling place he could take is Woakes.

Jos butler had a very good 2018 but him and bairstow in the same team eventually wonít work. We need the best potential player in one of those spots- pope that is for me sooner or later. Getting foakes in is even harder much as I would like him playing

I think it will be one change if Anderson is fit. Butler given a bit more time, and bairstow who has not made a significant score for a while now more time too
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on August 25, 2019, 08:19:12 PM
I am still absolutely buzzing. Stokes was absolutely magnificent, I remember watching pietersen in 05 and thinking this guy is special. I will forever remember watching stokes drag us to a wc win and drag us from the doorstep of another 2 years without the urn. That innings was the greatest innings in any format that I can remember.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: potzy248 on August 25, 2019, 10:24:02 PM
You know he's a Kiwi right?  ;)

Doing that in that situation, under that pressure and to keep Englands hopes alive...Wow, what a player.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 25, 2019, 10:26:51 PM
I keep watching that switch hit. Bloody hell it's an astonishing shot

Most people will remember all the insane shots...but he applied himself and gave him time (was only 2 off his first 50 balls!!) to get comfortable before expanding his stroke play- I.e a proper test innings, played by a proper test batsman.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on August 25, 2019, 10:32:45 PM
Joel Wilson has been a cock up waiting to happen all series. If Paine blew the review on such a vain punt, you want to be calling him a coward really...

The review is irrelevant. The chap has been so incompetent that he was afraid to give a plum lbw out. This is the pinnacle of cricket, and this guy isn't fit to umpire kids.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: manno on August 26, 2019, 01:13:06 AM
Please excuse me while I slam my (No Swearing Please) in the car door.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 26, 2019, 01:41:19 AM
Well played Ben Stokes.

Congratulations to England.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: vibrate on August 26, 2019, 02:50:34 AM
Stokes what a player! I'm not even mad the slightest that Australia lost. Im actually more excited for the remaining tests now.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on August 26, 2019, 07:38:56 AM
Forget some random World Cup win.. the drama, the thrilling finish in a test match is what will revive cricket !!

Best test Iíve seen.. very 2005 esq

Stokes.. bloody fair play
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: dez107 on August 26, 2019, 07:48:08 AM
Congrats fellas, enjoy the moment. Sets us up for a huge final 2 tests. As an aussie im very gutted. Woke the mrs up screaming at the TV last night very early in the am. Haha the joys of ashes cricket. Huge by stokes, loves the big moments. Time for the aussies to galvanise now and hit back.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 26, 2019, 04:20:15 PM
The review is irrelevant. The chap has been so incompetent that he was afraid to give a plum lbw out. This is the pinnacle of cricket, and this guy isn't fit to umpire kids.

OK, I agree completely with you that he has had a shocking series and is a level below the rest of the ICC Panel, but the review is very pertinent - Paine threw it away on a ridiculous punt, so it wasn't available when it was needed.

I don't agree that it was stone dead either - having umpired a fair bit myself, I can well see why the ball angled in hitting Stokes as he pivoted away would be deceptive (indeed, my live reaction was that it was close but no more) - but certainly the kind of thing you'd wanna keep a review for.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on August 26, 2019, 05:03:57 PM
As much as the batting is failing, the only change I can see is Jimmy in for Woakes.

The confidence and momentum is with this group of players now.  It is shame that there is a gap now until the next test to give the Aussies time to regroup but this is the type of result that lifts everyone
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on August 26, 2019, 05:36:34 PM
As much as the batting is failing, the only change I can see is Jimmy in for Woakes.

The confidence and momentum is with this group of players now.  It is shame that there is a gap now until the next test to give the Aussies time to regroup but this is the type of result that lifts everyone

AUS have the benefit of two unscarred bowlers (starc and siddle) who can come in and replace anyone who is too shell shocked (Pattinson?) Canít ask for a better series !
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on August 26, 2019, 08:03:25 PM
I have been perplexed that Starc hasn't had a run out yet.  Of all the Aussie bowlers he is the one I think we would least like to face
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on August 29, 2019, 11:24:57 AM
I may be thinking too much about nothing here, but...

Australia are playing against Derbyshire  in a 3 day game that started today. The Aussies have an interesting looking side.
Steve Smith is back. Paine is not playing with Carey keeping wicket and Khawaja as skipper.

They may just be giving everyone a game so nobody would go into a Test "cold" if called upon, but can we read anything into the possible Australia side for Old Trafford from this?

Cameron Bancroft
Marcus Harris
Steven Smith
Usman Khawaja(c)
Marnus Labuschagne
Matthew Wade
Alex Carey(wk)
Mitchell Marsh
Mitchell Starc
Peter Siddle
Michael Neser
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 29, 2019, 02:05:27 PM
Not really; the only two certs in that side for next week are Smith and Labuschagne
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 29, 2019, 02:06:39 PM
I may be thinking too much about nothing here, but...

Australia are playing against Derbyshire  in a 3 day game that started today. The Aussies have an interesting looking side.
Steve Smith is back. Paine is not playing with Carey keeping wicket and Khawaja as skipper.

They may just be giving everyone a game so nobody would go into a Test "cold" if called upon, but can we read anything into the possible Australia side for Old Trafford from this?


Khawaja, was the only senior player left other than Wade/Marsh who could have captained the Derbyshire game.  Pulling information out of thin air but Paine will still be the captain for the rest of the series, Starc might come in for Pattinson and they might drop Wade/Head for Marnus and it's most likely going to be Wade since as of right now Head is the VC and consistent.  Wade has scored 160 runs in the series so far with majority of those runs from the 2nd inning century in the first test.  Now if Wade was keeping instead of Carey that would be interesting for Paine.

I think the Aus team will be: Warner, Khawaja, Marnus, Smith, Head, Wade, Paine, Cummings, Starc, Lyon, Hazlewood
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on August 29, 2019, 02:33:43 PM
...Alex Carey(wk)
...

This guy is Test material! Why not play him as a batsman.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on August 29, 2019, 03:48:38 PM
This guy is Test material! Why not play him as a batsman.

Alex Carey is gun, what a player. Such a shame both England and Australia have a few fringe 1XI wk / batsmen
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on August 29, 2019, 07:56:08 PM
Kind of surprised that Khawaja opened but it could be the indication on how Aus is likely to go in the next test.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on August 29, 2019, 09:20:11 PM
About the only thing you can take from it is that Head is safe which probably isn't a surprise, could be a shootout between Harris/Khawaja/Wade for two spots.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 30, 2019, 01:14:48 PM
Anderson out for the series. https://www.ecb.co.uk/england/men/news/1329324/england-name-squad-for-fourth-specsavers-ashes-test (https://www.ecb.co.uk/england/men/news/1329324/england-name-squad-for-fourth-specsavers-ashes-test)

How Roy is in the side is still beyond me...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on August 30, 2019, 01:59:18 PM
Overton's back! Didn't see that coming, although I suppose we should have done - classic England reaction to a batting failure: more seamers!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on August 30, 2019, 02:13:58 PM
Steve smith out for 23 caught in the deep off Matt Critchkry
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 30, 2019, 02:29:22 PM
Overton's back! Didn't see that coming, although I suppose we should have done - classic England reaction to a batting failure: more seamers!

Yes, that was a shock - he barely makes Somersets first choice side when everyone is fit, and has done lots of nothing much this year. The likes of Jamie Porter, Ben Coad etc must be seething...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Byo on August 30, 2019, 03:19:03 PM
Yes, that was a shock - he barely makes Somersets first choice side when everyone is fit, and has done lots of nothing much this year. The likes of Jamie Porter, Ben Coad etc must be seething...
He most definately does make Somerset first team, and has probably featured in every game. You're very wrong there I'm afraid.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Byo on August 30, 2019, 03:27:50 PM
Yes, that was a shock - he barely makes Somersets first choice side when everyone is fit, and has done lots of nothing much this year. The likes of Jamie Porter, Ben Coad etc must be seething...
If 32 wickets at 21 is lots of nothing then I'd like to know what constitutes a success!!!! His average is quite a bit better than Coad and Porter so they must have done boatloads of sweet fa...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 30, 2019, 05:39:47 PM
If 32 wickets at 21 is lots of nothing then I'd like to know what constitutes a success!!!! His average is quite a bit better than Coad and Porter so they must have done boatloads of sweet fa...

Not bad on paper, but playing primarily on the ridiculously bowler friendly pitches at Taunton (which accounts for most of the average difference in my opinion), its worth saying that that places him fourth in Somerset's averages (fifth if you allow Van Der Merwe) - behind his own, much quicker, brother.  Porter and Coad have more wickets, and have done so over the past few years consistently - as has Ollie Robinson, who appeared to be next cab when given the new cherry for the Lions.  No offence, but it seems an odd selection to me.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on August 30, 2019, 05:41:52 PM
He most definately does make Somerset first team, and has probably featured in every game. You're very wrong there I'm afraid.

8/11 with no injuries.   Its very hypothetical, but I would have expected, if everyone was available and in top gear, that Somerset would go Gregory, Brooks, Jamie O, Leach, Bess in their first choice side.  Going on pure stats, Criag has had a "better" year than Brooks, but he's not going to run through a top order the way that Jack will. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Byo on August 30, 2019, 07:23:28 PM
8/11 with no injuries.   Its very hypothetical, but I would have expected, if everyone was available and in top gear, that Somerset would go Gregory, Brooks, Jamie O, Leach, Bess in their first choice side.  Going on pure stats, Criag has had a "better" year than Brooks, but he's not going to run through a top order the way that Jack will. 
[/quote
No offence taken, just think he has been far better than a whole load of nothing!!! His brother and Bess have been on loan elsewhere which suggests they value him higher.  I personally think Craig has been brought in as cover for Woakes but actually has no chance of playing.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on August 30, 2019, 07:37:56 PM
Ugh, I can't bring myself to cheer for Overton.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Luke-scicc on August 30, 2019, 09:12:01 PM
Roy to bat 4 denly to open.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on August 30, 2019, 10:05:22 PM
Another sign that Ed Smith is braindead
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on August 31, 2019, 05:53:29 AM
Roy to bat 4 denly to open.

Must be a pile of angry middle order batsmen in the CC this week.

I could just about see the justification for Roy being picked to open (but didnít agree) but where is the justification for picking him to bat in the middle order?

Other than Ďheís better there than openingí there is none. Madness heís in over Pope.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on August 31, 2019, 07:45:01 AM
I didn't quite see the justification for Denly to be in the side if he wasn't going to bat in the top 3.  In his mid-30s and with a modest FC record, he was only ever a stop gap solution to the lack of top order batsmen.  Little point having him in the squad if he isn't going to be batting higher
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: cricketbadger on August 31, 2019, 08:57:45 AM
Boys club, face just fits, Ed Smith is a clown
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on August 31, 2019, 09:11:33 AM
Roy at 4 was on the cards, Denly has always been a stop gap it seems so itís easy for the selectors to swap them therefore not admitting Roy was not suitable test selection.

Butler and  bairstow (think we now see why he wanted the gloves so bad!) need to produce something with Pope waiting

Iíd like to see Pope in, he is the best young batsman in the Country.
But England you wouldnít think want to make too many changes...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 02, 2019, 09:11:45 PM
Papers speculating Woakes 'rested' and Sam Curran favourite to get picked.

Very promising is Curran more with the bat than the ball and would take some of the workload off Broad and Archer if  picked, Woakes hasn't bowled a lot so far not sure he is fully fit.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 03, 2019, 09:14:36 AM
Khawaja dropped, Starc Recalled

smith back (will probably bat at 3 as hes replaced khawaja)

one of starc or siddle to play as pattinson again rested
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 03, 2019, 09:20:39 AM
Marnus will bat 3 surely?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 03, 2019, 10:03:40 AM
Marnus will bat 3 surely?
yes hadn't even thought that!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: 19reading87 on September 03, 2019, 11:47:56 AM
Woakes out Overton in...

Correct call on all fronts. Woakes needs a rest and Overton is having a better season than Curran, simple...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on September 03, 2019, 11:49:32 AM
Woakes out Overton in...

Correct call on all fronts. Woakes needs a rest and Overton is having a better season than Curran, simple...
Bet Curran wishes he was a foot taller right now!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 03, 2019, 11:56:30 AM
Woakes out Overton in...

Correct call on all fronts. Woakes needs a rest and Overton is having a better season than Curran, simple...

Yeah but Curran can drag us out of the mire lower down the order.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Luke-scicc on September 03, 2019, 12:10:47 PM
I would have much preferred to see Curran in.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 03, 2019, 12:14:43 PM
Woakes out Overton in...

Correct call on all fronts. Woakes needs a rest and Overton is having a better season than Curran, simple...

So it's the right call to weaken both the batting and the bowling by replacing Woakes with Overton?

Curran is a better player than Overton, end of!
Form is temporary, class is permanent...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 03, 2019, 12:41:32 PM
if i recall correctly Overton batted well in australia and top scored with 30 odd when were were bowled out for FA in NZ.

Curran is the future and arguably more of a batting allrounder (especially on what hes shown so far in england colours) so overton is a more like for liek swap

obviously he isnt woakes but i think he'll do well! he has also got smith out previously!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 03, 2019, 01:41:30 PM
Very surprised to see Overton in the side.  A worse bat than eithrt Woakes or Curran and limited with the ball at this level.  Unless Woakes has an injury, I can't see any sense in this at all
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 03, 2019, 02:08:24 PM
Iíve had a look, and yep. No one predicted this swap on here.


We just arenít seeing what the selectors see are we. Us are them thatís clueless?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 03, 2019, 03:25:35 PM
Iíve had a look, and yep. No one predicted this swap on here.


We just arenít seeing what the selectors see are we. Us are them thatís clueless?

initially thought Ed Smith got it right, buttler proved a good selection but more recently he seems stubborn in picking people.

Obviously there isnt a lot to choose from which is forcing his hand somewhat.

i disagree with moving roy down, he either opens or doesnt play, sibley is the only viable option i think to replace

pope is scoring plenty this season and probably should play btu hes yet another 5. unless he moves to 3/4 for surrey he'l be unlucky or we will slate smith for picking him out of position or not picking him.

that being said denly and roy could both hti 100s art OT and we'll be praising the decision.

One thing that can be said is bayliss clearly doesnt care any more and i dont think hes trusted by root and smith to make the calls that need to be.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jamesisapayne on September 03, 2019, 05:47:48 PM
initially thought Ed Smith got it right, buttler proved a good selection but more recently he seems stubborn in picking people.

Maybe he's just backing his players regardless and doesn't want to resort to the career ruining revolving door style of selection England favoured throughout the whole of the 90s.

The guy is going to get slated whatever he does by armchair pundits who've never experienced a days professional cricket in their life, so he's probably going to back the courage of his convictions and stick with players for a while.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 04, 2019, 10:05:44 AM
1-1 warner back in the hutch, out to Broad again

marnus in early!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 04, 2019, 10:07:00 AM
Maybe he's just backing his players regardless and doesn't want to resort to the career ruining revolving door style of selection England favoured throughout the whole of the 90s.

The guy is going to get slated whatever he does by armchair pundits who've never experienced a days professional cricket in their life, so he's probably going to back the courage of his convictions and stick with players for a while.

yes! this is what i menat i dont think stubborness in this case is a bad thing entirely, however im not 100% convinces roy to open was a good decision but we'll see hwo the rets of the series goes!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 04, 2019, 10:43:01 AM
Crucial Period for England now with Australia's best two players of the series at the crease!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on September 04, 2019, 10:59:59 AM
The Aussies 2 best players in early, this is what we like to see!!!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 04, 2019, 11:11:29 AM
Good work by England getting rid of the openers.

From 28-2 we now we wait for Smith to get 150 and Labuschagne 80 ish.
When they're both gone it will be 260-odd for 4 and the bowlers can blitz out the rest of the Aussies for under 300  ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 04, 2019, 03:56:44 PM
We very quiet on here.

Granted, itís rained most of day. But when it hasnít been weíve been very lacklustre.


Jofra down on pace, is it the weather? Is it the end heís at? Is it a plan?

Broad seems miffed archer now his his end.

Crisp packets, no bails. Itís all about village and diva out there.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 04, 2019, 04:12:31 PM
Can we discuss Labuschagne conversion rate?? Root gets some abuse for this kind of failures.......



Overtons actually looked okay this spell. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 04, 2019, 04:47:43 PM
Can we discuss Labuschagne conversion rate?? Root gets some abuse for this kind of failures.......



Overtons actually looked okay this spell.

Nah, Labuschagne is only playing his 7 or 8th test and I believe he has batted anywhere from 3 to 6 during that period.  I would like to give him a longer run and pass before I start complaining about his conversion rate, plus if you are English supporter do you really want to complain about his conversion rate, especially with Smith usually converting :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 04, 2019, 05:20:53 PM
Can we discuss Labuschagne conversion rate?? Root gets some abuse for this kind of failures.......


To be fair the ball he got today probably would have sent most back to the pavilion, he was stuck with the tail through his 80 odd last game, was given out caught two hands one bounce the game before, credit where credit is due, he has been sensational.

 It's probably more of a monkey off the back thing, whereas Roots conversion issues need to be addressed if he wants to be talked about with the likes of Smith, Kholi and Williamson.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 04, 2019, 05:25:40 PM
Also, special mention to the umpires who didn't get a decision wrong today!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 04, 2019, 06:35:07 PM
Got up at 04:30am to get to Manchester for that subpar effort. Ah.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Komdotkom on September 05, 2019, 12:29:16 AM
This should be the new test uniform when playing in England. Summer, you must be kidding!
(https://n.nordstrommedia.com/id/sr3/0521cd80-96d0-4caa-ab17-31d572089395.jpeg?crop=pad&pad_color=FFF&format=jpeg&w=780&h=1196)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 09:05:44 AM
And now we have Day 2. Don't see anything other than us toiling trying to get Smith out like the first two tests. Really need some more gas from Jofra as well, looks a bit ordinary without that extra pace we know he's capable of.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 10:09:34 AM
Jofra really should have caught that
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: KettonJake on September 05, 2019, 10:16:49 AM
Also, special mention to the umpires who didn't get a decision wrong today!

Except for playing without bails.

How does one decide a run out? At what point are the stumps broken?
How does the lack of bails relate to the DRS mapping for lbw calls? Is it clipping the bails for umpires call, even if the bails aren't physically there?

Shambolic that the 4th umpire sat on the rope for 2 overs whilst play carried on without bails, then all he did was run out a cap to swap for umpire Erasmus's wide brim.

Took an eternity for the heavy bails to finally arrive. Lucky there wasn't a contentious decision during this period.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 10:23:13 AM
Broad around the wicket to the lefties is beautiful
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 05, 2019, 10:53:15 AM
Except for playing without bails.

How does one decide a run out? At what point are the stumps broken?
How does the lack of bails relate to the DRS mapping for lbw calls? Is it clipping the bails for umpires call, even if the bails aren't physically there?

Shambolic that the 4th umpire sat on the rope for 2 overs whilst play carried on without bails, then all he did was run out a cap to swap for umpire Erasmus's wide brim.

Took an eternity for the heavy bails to finally arrive. Lucky there wasn't a contentious decision during this period.

I just assumed it was because they didn't have any heavy bails? Otherwise they would have brought them out straight away, the bails they did bring out eventually looked like they just had some screws hastily screwed in. I'm not sure how Hawkeye works but the structure of the stumps would be a permanent unchanging factor, so it would operate as per usual.

As for deciding runouts, they could have made do with cameras and potentially a soft signal in case of inconclusive footage.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 11:56:07 AM
Really don't see how we can win any game if they can't figure out a way of getting Smith out...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on September 05, 2019, 12:00:15 PM
We should add 100 and retire. That way we can get the other 10 out. Or just keep smith down the other end and bowl everything at the other end. Even Marnus is half the player this guy is.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 12:46:33 PM
Why on effing Christ is Roy in the slips
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 05, 2019, 01:06:17 PM
Thatís just embarrassing.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 01:06:55 PM
You can't make this up
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 05, 2019, 01:08:30 PM
I don't think Millichamp & Hall will be putting that one on a shirt
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 05, 2019, 01:10:13 PM
How the duckworth lewis does a spinner bowl a front foot no ball?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on September 05, 2019, 01:11:38 PM
See now the thing is that Leach has probably overstepped a dozen times already but they haven't called it because they never check and the consequence of that is Leach thinks his front foot is perfectly fine.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 05, 2019, 01:23:59 PM
I can't understand this lacklustre performance after the confidence boost of the result at Leeds.  Two woeful mistakes by Roy and Leach
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 01:37:35 PM
Really don't know why Jofra's just going at low 80s, unless there's a plan I'm missing
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 05, 2019, 01:43:22 PM
I think Jofra is carrying some injury, plus Root has over bowled him the last two matches.  Last test he was walking back gingerly towards his run up.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on September 05, 2019, 01:50:45 PM
Archer's speeds have been on the decline, hasn't got the fitness to keep bowling at that pace. Doesn't help that root has bowled him into the ground
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 05, 2019, 01:58:21 PM
Archer's speeds have been on the decline, hasn't got the fitness to keep bowling at that pace. Doesn't help that root has bowled him into the ground

At the time of posting this, he's bowled 94 overs in Tests since his debut (14th August).

Root has bowled into the ground and asked him to keep going!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jjelricksmith on September 05, 2019, 02:00:36 PM
At the time of posting this, he's bowled 94 overs in Tests since his debut (14th August).

Root has bowled into the ground and asked him to keep going!

Short bursts of speed aimed at the badge please Jofra. Go dance in the Windies for a few weeks, come back and youll be bowling 90 clicks.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 05, 2019, 02:07:06 PM
Smith making Kohli and Williamson look second rate - thatís something in itself
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 05, 2019, 02:24:16 PM
Stokes has just walked off injured!!


We might as well give the Aussies the urn now. Tis all over.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 02:36:51 PM
Another drop. This team is an absolute disgrace
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 05, 2019, 02:37:56 PM
This is pathetic - Broad aside
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 05, 2019, 02:38:57 PM
Wheels coming off for England now.

Archers body language is toxic.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 05, 2019, 02:46:11 PM
Archer just doesnít seem that Johnson style bowler whom enjoys whacking it in half way down. Archer seems more like Steyn - bouncers are a secondary option

Secondly obviously Archer must be fatigued but he doesnít play enough red ball cricket to get miles In the legs. T20 obviously made him rich but doesnít prepare you for Test matches
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mo_town on September 05, 2019, 02:52:22 PM
Looks like all that celebration after the last test win has tired the English team!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 03:02:15 PM
Can't see us winning, I'm afraid. Time for a long rain dance...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 05, 2019, 03:45:18 PM
WE HAVE A WICKET

sorry im just surprised
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on September 05, 2019, 03:47:59 PM
Disappointed to see Paine go, he needs runs to justify his position in the side. I'd like to see him have a good career. He stepped in to helm a side that was in bad shape. Good man Tim Paine.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SLA on September 05, 2019, 03:49:29 PM
Archer bowls mid 80s in Leeds, gets called a genius for throttling back on his pace.

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/cricket/jofra-archer-embraced-as-headingley-hero-with-world-class-bowling-at-its-best-1-9952163 (https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/cricket/jofra-archer-embraced-as-headingley-hero-with-world-class-bowling-at-its-best-1-9952163)
https://www.cricket365.com/dave-tickner/archer-reinvents-himself-to-leave-australia-reeling-again/ (https://www.cricket365.com/dave-tickner/archer-reinvents-himself-to-leave-australia-reeling-again/)


Does the same thing at Manchester, everyone immediately forgets Leeds happened and accuse him of being lazy/injured/half-hearted.


Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 04:07:38 PM
Archer bowls mid 80s in Leeds, gets called a genius for throttling back on his pace.

https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/cricket/jofra-archer-embraced-as-headingley-hero-with-world-class-bowling-at-its-best-1-9952163 (https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/sport/cricket/jofra-archer-embraced-as-headingley-hero-with-world-class-bowling-at-its-best-1-9952163)
https://www.cricket365.com/dave-tickner/archer-reinvents-himself-to-leave-australia-reeling-again/ (https://www.cricket365.com/dave-tickner/archer-reinvents-himself-to-leave-australia-reeling-again/)


Does the same thing at Manchester, everyone immediately forgets Leeds happened and accuse him of being lazy/injured/half-hearted.

Yeah, but his efforts the past two days have looked incredibly lazy/half-hearted. He's had 12 days off as well.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 05, 2019, 04:11:32 PM
Listening to TMS and it seems to be a strange tactics from England, bowling wide. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 05, 2019, 04:26:17 PM
In a summer of terrible wickets, this is another to add to the list.  Flat and dry no real pace or bounce.  There isn't anything in it to be bowling short at express pace.  Important toss to win as it is going to be a very dry pitch for the final 2 days
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 04:27:42 PM
In a summer of terrible wickets, this is another to add to the list.  Flat and dry no real pace or bounce.  There isn't anything in it to be bowling short at express pace.  Important toss to win as it is going to be a very dry pitch for the final 2 days

We will make this look like an absolute minefield, put your money on it
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jayralh on September 05, 2019, 04:33:06 PM
What a player Steve Smith is. Only chance he gave to be out turned to be no ball.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 05, 2019, 04:35:32 PM
What a player Steve Smith is. Only chance he gave to be out turned to be no ball.

He was dropped by Archer this morning.  As abject as we have been, we had the chances to end this innings before Australia had amassed a score to set up the game
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on September 05, 2019, 04:36:10 PM
Smith carries on answering with the bat -
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 05, 2019, 04:36:36 PM
We will make this look like an absolute minefield, put your money on it

I think it will start playing badly later on tomorrow.  It was a huge toss to win to bat first on it
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on September 05, 2019, 04:37:33 PM
What a player Steve Smith is. Only chance he gave to be out turned to be no ball.

Worlds best by far. Absolute Legend (even though he chucked a Masuri stem guard on his Shrey... a bit village)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 04:39:20 PM
This is what happens when you drop Smith on 108 from a spinner off a no-ball
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jayralh on September 05, 2019, 04:42:47 PM
He was dropped by Archer this morning.  As abject as we have been, we had the chances to end this innings before Australia had amassed a score to set up the game
I don't think archer had a chance it came back double the speed. Anyway he's out now
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on September 05, 2019, 04:49:43 PM
BBC : ďSo we've learnt Steve Smith has a weakness to no ball's from left-arm spinners and trying to reverse sweep part-timers when he's into the 200s.Ē

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 04:52:30 PM
The rails have truly gone off here
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mo_town on September 05, 2019, 04:54:15 PM
Starc in the 40s...*sigh*
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 05:20:16 PM
20 minutes until we're 20 odd for 3
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: spoonbed on September 05, 2019, 05:48:35 PM
Denly is looking good :(
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 06:01:34 PM
Denly opening worked out well then
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: 19reading87 on September 05, 2019, 06:03:12 PM
Plot Twist...

Overton brought into the team to bat 3 😂
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 05, 2019, 06:09:15 PM
Jeez, when are the England selectors going to pick proper openers.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 05, 2019, 06:16:58 PM
So Burns has already outscored Harris and Denly made more than Warner. We're ahead man for man at this stage.

Overton batting at 3 also means Root gets to come in at 4 where he prefers and Roy will be a proper middle order player at 5.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on September 05, 2019, 06:20:52 PM
Overton.  He remains the wrong selection (our fourth seamer needed to be more different to the other three - so a left armer or someone a bit quicker/bouncier) but actually, has been quietly impressive - bowled with intelligence, and got Labuschagne with a classic one two, and showed gumption this evening.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 05, 2019, 06:22:31 PM
No criticism of Denly from me, he has taken one for the team.

Heís opening because Roy gets to bat when the ball is older. Whether he can make it at 4 remains to be seen.

Whether Denly should be playing probably splits opinion on here but he is stepping up because thereís no others suitable in the team currently.

And yes I was an opener for 25 odd years so Iím biased!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on September 05, 2019, 06:56:03 PM
Starc -54, Lyon- 26...sheesh! AUS Tail is kicking ass too!

What a team! Can't keep them out or down for long.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 05, 2019, 08:29:32 PM
On the plus side, it is due to rain loads tomorrow. Ah.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 05, 2019, 09:11:32 PM
On the plus side, it is due to rain loads tomorrow. Ah.

 :) hoping for a draw here and win or bust at the Oval. Can't see us getting 450-500 to put any pressure on.
The Aussies are good and they have the best batsmen in the world who has been simply superb.

Havnt seen any highlights but sounds like England wanted a green track and movement as Bairstow has all but said.

Old Trafford used to be quick and spun later but has normally been a good track to bat on.

Do England have the right to have the wickets we want ? Said before the series we need wickets that move to win and the batsmen will have to lump it.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on September 05, 2019, 09:26:30 PM
No criticism of Denly from me, he has taken one for the team.

Heís opening because Roy gets to bat when the ball is older. Whether he can make it at 4 remains to be seen.

Whether Denly should be playing probably splits opinion on here but he is stepping up because thereís no others suitable in the team currently.

And yes I was an opener for 25 odd years so Iím biased!!

No bias, that's a spot on reading of the situation.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 05, 2019, 10:20:08 PM
:) hoping for a draw here and win or bust at the Oval. Can't see us getting 450-500 to put any pressure on.
The Aussies are good and they have the best batsmen in the world who has been simply superb.

Havnt seen any highlights but sounds like England wanted a green track and movement as Bairstow has all but said.

Old Trafford used to be quick and spun later but has normally been a good track to bat on.

Do England have the right to have the wickets we want ? Said before the series we need wickets that move to win and the batsmen will have to lump it.

One of they key advantages to playing at home is that you determine the pitches that the series is played on.  I have been absolutely baffled by the pitches this summer that have thrown away the home advantage.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on September 05, 2019, 10:43:28 PM
One of they key advantages to playing at home is that you determine the pitches that the series is played on.  I have been absolutely baffled by the pitches this summer that have thrown away the home advantage.

Nearly got blown away by Ireland playing on those home advantage wickets.
Batting is too brittle to risk playing on them
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 06, 2019, 07:13:36 AM
Assuming we lose a fair chunk of the morning due to rain, I wonder how long we can bat for. Ah.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: KettonJake on September 06, 2019, 09:56:07 AM
Nearly got blown away by Ireland playing on those home advantage wickets.
Batting is too brittle to risk playing on them

Agreed. We are a one day batting line up playing red ball cricket.

A green seamer would be a bloodbath.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 06, 2019, 02:22:32 PM
Decent job here from the lads. Pitch is a road as per Australia's first innings...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 06, 2019, 05:00:37 PM
Ah, balls. Decent job from Rory anyway
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 06, 2019, 05:14:29 PM
One goes, they all go
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 06, 2019, 05:16:40 PM
2 gone quickly after what looked to be a good day.


Nooooo
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on September 06, 2019, 05:18:49 PM
Root succumbing to the nervous 50s-80s once again
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: KW9221 on September 06, 2019, 05:40:46 PM
What a beauty by Hazelwood to get Roy out.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 06, 2019, 05:48:13 PM
I was one of the person who thought Roy deserved to be in the Test squad but he needs to be dropped and a proper opener can come in for the last test, with Denly who took one on the chin for the team by opening moving back to 4.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 06, 2019, 05:49:50 PM
Please for the love of God just avoid the follow on
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 06, 2019, 06:05:24 PM
Please for the love of God just avoid the follow on

No way Aus is enforcing follow on unless the weather does not cooperate and they believe only one more innings is possible.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 06, 2019, 06:23:30 PM
What a beauty by Hazelwood to get Roy out.

You forgot to add what an absolute shocker of a shot
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 06, 2019, 06:35:28 PM
Not looking like such a road when we are batting on it.
Hazlewood is such a good bowler...Roy, well letís see if he can make a go of it but that was a cracking delivery.

Itís the moving ball that sorts out top order from middle order players and thatís nothing new over the years.

Could of been further forward @RPC/Blueroom Cricket - Adie yes if thatís what you mean but it cut back in beautifully
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 06, 2019, 07:05:19 PM
Decent ball that got Roy but he doesn't seem to play a solid forward defensive, he sort of pushes at the ball leaving a gap between bat and pad. I love him in ODI's but just don't think he can last against such a good attack, as his defence isn't good enough. Hope he proves me wrong. Root acts Burns were excellent all day, gritted it out when Cummins bowled a seriously good spell. Need to bat time tomorrow and not get rolled over cheaply.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 06, 2019, 07:13:03 PM
Decent ball that got Roy but he doesn't seem to play a solid forward defensive, he sort of pushes at the ball leaving a gap between bat and pad. I love him in ODI's but just don't think he can last against such a good attack, as his defence isn't good enough. Hope he proves me wrong. Root acts Burns were excellent all day, gritted it out when Cummins bowled a seriously good spell. Need to bat time tomorrow and not get rolled over cheaply.

Yes absolutely. Maybe the difference in the formats is Roy doesnít need to play many defensive shots normally, so he it does not come naturally.

Thereís a few like that, Bairstow is another who gets bowled way too much for a test player.one thing is for sure, decent bowling in the longer format finds you out.

But yes, lots of us want him to adjust..jury is out whether he can or not I think
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 06, 2019, 07:19:55 PM
Not looking like such a road when we are batting on it.
Hazlewood is such a good bowler...Roy, well letís see if he can make a go of it but that was a cracking delivery.

Itís the moving ball that sorts out top order from middle order players and thatís nothing new over the years.

Could of been further forward @RPC/Blueroom Cricket - Adie yes if thatís what you mean but it cut back in beautifully

Not behind the ball
Grand Canyon between bat and pad
Going hard st the ball
Playing way ahead of himself
Bald foot coming through (literally past his front foot itís that bad)

Take your pick really
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: KW9221 on September 06, 2019, 08:41:50 PM
You forgot to add what an absolute shocker of a shot
True but hazelwood made the ball talk. He is such a good bowler.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on September 06, 2019, 08:45:18 PM
Good man that Rory Burns, showed some fight!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 09:13:22 AM
So, anyone see us batting at least two sessions today? I don't...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 07, 2019, 10:52:45 AM
Cracking delviery and set up from starc though.


One that went across. Then one that looked like it was Going to first slip before booming back in late.


Wasnít many times our bowlers looked to get that much late swing.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Calzehbhoy on September 07, 2019, 10:53:42 AM
Bairstow bowled playing a booming drive.... Where have I seen that before?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 11:03:43 AM
Good ball but a poor, poor shot that he did time and time against last summer. Can we just have Foakes in the side?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 11:11:46 AM
Sigh.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 07, 2019, 11:24:48 AM
We are getting cooked here with quality bowling and a bit of poor technique

We need rain  :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 07, 2019, 12:00:56 PM
YJB should be dropped for not learning if nothing else.

Also foot no balls need taken away from the on field umpires and on a goal line technologies style buzzer system. Cummins is bowling off about 15 yards here.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 01:03:01 PM
Buttler not protecting the tailenders at all, bit poor really
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 07, 2019, 01:07:18 PM
If he isnít going to hit out now then whatís the point in picking a very aggressive number 7?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 07, 2019, 01:12:49 PM
So... Bairstow... bowled again... bowled through the gate..again ... bowled going hard at the ball.. again..

And people still call him a top batsmen and as someone who can bat high ...

Clueless

Should be kicked out and not return until he changes away from his white ball technique and mentality

Also, ffs get leech in before the awful broad and archer
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 07, 2019, 01:14:03 PM
Not sure Australia would have taken the follow on anyway, but another scared umpire afraid to make an important decision.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 07, 2019, 01:14:53 PM
Not sure Australia would have taken the follow on anyway, but another scared umpire afraid to make an important decision.

Donít gamble away the reviews then 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️  That type of decision is literally the reason for DRS
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 07, 2019, 01:16:52 PM
Hence the issue with the DRS, the blame is shifted to somebody else for a poor decision.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 01:36:38 PM
BUNNY BUNNY BUNNY
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 07, 2019, 01:36:45 PM
Warner needs to be dropped for the next test.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 02:01:59 PM
Harris is a moron for reviewing that.

Please please don't bowl short again to Smith
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 02:21:39 PM
Well, how about this?!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 07, 2019, 02:32:31 PM
Well, how about this?!

Itíll be worse to bat on next innings so tbf.. Aus donít need many to put England in deep deep do do
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 02:39:08 PM
Perfect response after getting slapped from Jofra!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shax12 on September 07, 2019, 03:26:34 PM
Have to rate Australia. Have completely outplayed England and the 2 umpires. Should been 2-1 and England following on and losing this test too. But just like world cup final the umpires trying their best to save England. Now please don't bring reviews waisted into this. 50-50 LBWs are given when Australia are batting not even that some were even not out in this series but still given and when England batting absolute stone wall LBWs are not given. Reason Australia keep losing reviews as they can't trust the umpires anymore and you can't blame them.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Sam on September 07, 2019, 03:59:21 PM
Have to rate Australia. Have completely outplayed England and the 2 umpires. Should been 2-1 and England following on and losing this test too. But just like world cup final the umpires trying their best to save England. Now please don't bring reviews waisted into this. 50-50 LBWs are given when Australia are batting not even that some were even not out in this series but still given and when England batting absolute stone wall LBWs are not given. Reason Australia keep losing reviews as they can't trust the umpires anymore and you can't blame them.

People don't seem to want to acknowledge the fact that more incorrect decisions have been made in Australia's favour than England's favour so far this series, it's just been Australia being awful with their reviews.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 04:07:07 PM
Really poor half hour, this.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 07, 2019, 04:14:03 PM
Smith is a freak  :o

Edit: Why did England review that?  Stokes was shaking is head as soon as it was turned down.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shax12 on September 07, 2019, 04:30:11 PM
People don't seem to want to acknowledge the fact that more incorrect decisions have been made in Australia's favour than England's favour so far this series, it's just been Australia being awful with their reviews.

Not really. England have had more incorrect decisions go their way. Warner 2 LBWs this series were missing the stumps. Stokes plumb LBW last test and this test Leach plumb LBW
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Sam on September 07, 2019, 04:32:12 PM
Not really. England have had more incorrect decisions go their way. Warner 2 LBWs this series were missing the stumps. Stokes plumb LBW last test and this test Leach plumb LBW

I had a look at the 1st game a while back (where most of the wrong decisions were), 10 incorrect decisions favoured Australia whilst only 6 favoured England. This test so far off the top of my head each team has had 1 incorrect decision. There's definitely been more on-field decisions in Australias favour.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shax12 on September 07, 2019, 04:45:55 PM
I had a look at the 1st game a while back (where most of the wrong decisions were), 10 incorrect decisions favoured Australia whilst only 6 favoured England. This test so far off the top of my head each team has had 1 incorrect decision. There's definitely been more on-field decisions in Australias favour.

What about the last 2 tests why you only mentioning 1st test. If you put whole series together then England have had the decisions in their favour more often and most importantly when it mattered at most.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 07, 2019, 05:12:11 PM
What about the last 2 tests why you only mentioning 1st test. If you put whole series together then England have had the decisions in their favour more often and most importantly when it mattered at most.

So use the reviews ....

Stop wasting them (same applies to England btw who also use them tactically)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 05:14:13 PM
Anyone see us batting out half an hour and a whole day tomorrow? I don't
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 07, 2019, 05:18:38 PM
There you go.. what a Ďreviewí by England... 🤦‍♂️
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 05:22:27 PM
I mean, it was merely to waste time, nothing else.

I will be gobsmacked if the openers can see this half hour or so out...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 05:33:27 PM
Yup
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 05:35:18 PM
This is pathetic
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 07, 2019, 05:36:29 PM
Uh oh
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 07, 2019, 05:36:56 PM
Two summers running Root been exposed as massive hype job. Kohli last year and Smith buried him this summer
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 07, 2019, 05:40:55 PM
Here We Go Again (https://youtu.be/9JBCQu4BHa8)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on September 07, 2019, 05:43:13 PM
Why didnt they send out a nightwatchman. Root had no business being out there. I have more faith in Overton than Roy and Denly anyway  :(
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 07, 2019, 05:44:07 PM
Two summers running Root been exposed as massive hype job. Kohli last year and Smith buried him this summer

The clowns around say he can bat top 3. Sensible people know heís a 4/5 and a bloody world class one at that. Sadly, this side is sooooo bad it simply has a load of 6/7ís so there is little choice
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 05:44:47 PM
The disregard our administrators have had for red ball cricket and this Ashes series meant this was only inevitable. Poor selections and having players batting in positions they shouldn't be was only asking for trouble.

The only players who I've any time for are Broad and Stokes who've played out of their skins, the rest are just hiding behind this 'World Cup was tiring' narrative.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 07, 2019, 05:45:41 PM
I thought Roy wasnít opening this game?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 07, 2019, 05:47:43 PM
I thought Roy wasnít opening this game?

😂😂😂
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 07, 2019, 05:51:08 PM
The clowns around say he can bat top 3. Sensible people know heís a 4/5 and a bloody world class one at that. Sadly, this side is sooooo bad it simply has a load of 6/7ís so there is little choice
It's also the captaincy. It suits some e.g. Kohli/Williamson and doesn't suit others e.g. Root/Tendulkar

Root needs to bat 4 and give up the captaincy. Non captain average 53. Captain average 40.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 07, 2019, 05:55:26 PM
It's also the captaincy. It suits some e.g. Kohli/Williamson and doesn't suit others e.g. Root/Tendulkar

Root needs to bat 4 and give up the captaincy. Non captain average 53. Captain average 40.

Who could do it..... the problem is there isnít anyone (no one sensible anyway)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 07, 2019, 06:01:40 PM
Who could do it..... the problem is there isnít anyone (no one sensible anyway)
Broad probably the only logical option tbh
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 07, 2019, 06:07:47 PM
Broad probably the only logical option tbh

If you have Stokes as VC, why not give it to him, unless there is concern with him having similar issues as Root?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 07, 2019, 06:08:11 PM
Ed Smith spent his day at the Financial Times Festival. Get rid of this man.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 07, 2019, 06:09:52 PM
If you have Stokes as VC, why not give it to him, unless there is concern with him having similar issues as Root?
Because Stokes bats, bowls and is the best fielder. Can't have him also being captain.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 07, 2019, 06:13:46 PM
Because Stokes bats, bowls and is the best fielder. Can't have him also being captain.

Fair enough.  If that is the case why make him the VC in the first place.  I always thought the VC position was future captain in training :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: 19reading87 on September 07, 2019, 07:53:57 PM
Give it Tom Abell and bat him at 3!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Sam on September 07, 2019, 09:09:58 PM
Not exactly known for having a brain on the field! England's last only real strength as a team, in quality of reviews would also be lost  :D

Seemed to have an incredibly good cricketing brain when he did some commentary work for Sky.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Jaffa on September 07, 2019, 09:51:38 PM
Who could do it..... the problem is there isnít anyone (no one sensible anyway)

Why not give Eoin Morgan a go?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 07, 2019, 10:16:54 PM
Buttler would be the obvious skipper (presuming YJB or Foakes keeps) if he could just actually score a few runs.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 07, 2019, 10:34:52 PM
Why not give Eoin Morgan a go?

Couple pages back it was mentioned that Morgan's back might not be up to snuff for test cricket and he was considering giving up the short format also.

Edit: Reading some Aus papers online
Is Ian Chappel (sp) out of his f'ing mind for suggesting Smith for captain on https://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket. (https://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket.)  Outside of DRS issues and occasional mistake (that he has admitted too) what does Paine need to do get respect from Aus media on his captaincy.  The guy stepped into a difficult situation and has started earning Aus test team the respect.  His keeping is damn good, he has led with humility and I rather see Smith concentrate on his batting.

Is the Aus public of the similar opinion that Paine needs to be replace as captain?  If Aus win or keep the Ashes, would you retire if you were in Paine's shoes, considering that the last Aussie captain to win the Ashes in England was Steve Waugh back in 2001.

I would like him to continue but would understand if he walks away on a high note.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: vibrate on September 08, 2019, 02:00:04 AM
Couple pages back it was mentioned that Morgan's back might not be up to snuff for test cricket and he was considering giving up the short format also.

Edit: Reading some Aus papers online
Is Ian Chappel (sp) out of his f'ing mind for suggesting Smith for captain on https://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket. (https://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket.)  Outside of DRS issues and occasional mistake (that he has admitted too) what does Paine need to do get respect from Aus media on his captaincy.  The guy stepped into a difficult situation and has started earning Aus test team the respect.  His keeping is damn good, he has led with humility and I rather see Smith concentrate on his batting.

Is the Aus public of the similar opinion that Paine needs to be replace as captain?  If Aus win or keep the Ashes, would you retire if you were in Paine's shoes, considering that the last Aussie captain to win the Ashes in England was Steve Waugh back in 2001.

I would like him to continue but would understand if he walks away on a high note.

I think Paine has done fantastic as captain. I actually think with the captaincy off smith has been a massive blessing cause it let's him focus on his batting since returning to the side. Giving advice to Paine in the slips on fielding positions and bowling changes has been fantastic. I don't see calls for warner being dropped who has scored less runs then paine.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 08, 2019, 07:07:57 AM
Totally agree about Paine, he is not the best batsman but solid keeper and skippering is more than just numbers

The Aussies had to do this but does it show the value of not making your best players Captain so they can fulfill their potential ?

I think it very much does and Iím very impressed with their team as a whole

Think Paine deserves a lot of credit
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 08, 2019, 08:38:35 AM
Two summers running Root been exposed as massive hype job. Kohli last year and Smith buried him this summer

Harsh. I'm not sure anyone has put him in the Kholii/Smith class of late. Root is a class player who isn't in great form at the minute, so trying to grind it out. To say the above is somewhat disrespectful in my opinion.

I feel for Root as he really can't win. Bats 4 and he should move up for the good of the team. Moves up (effectively opening most of the time) and he's not good enough. Added to that he's lost his leading bowler for the series, had Roy opening and doesn't have a class spin option either.

Let's not forget how good this Aussie attack is too, it's high class. Credit where its due.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 08, 2019, 09:06:27 AM
Harsh. I'm not sure anyone has put him in the Kholii/Smith class of late. Root is a class player who isn't in great form at the minute, so trying to grind it out. To say the above is somewhat disrespectful in my opinion.

I feel for Root as he really can't win. Bats 4 and he should move up for the good of the team. Moves up (effectively opening most of the time) and he's not good enough. Added to that he's lost his leading bowler for the series, had Roy opening and doesn't have a class spin option either.

Let's not forget how good this Aussie attack is too, it's high class. Credit where its due.
First and foremost I might be harsh but there's been plenty of cricket pundits saying that Smith, Kohli, Williamson and Root are the cream of the class which I agree with.

Should Root bat 3? Most certainly not. But should Root as captain select the right players for the team? Most certainly yes.

We've tried all these makeshift openers why isn't Root pushing for Sibley? We've seen Burns come of age in this series. I don't get the obsession with needing a slogger at the top of the order. Then you pick someone from CC that actual bats at 3 to do so in the Test side.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 08, 2019, 09:15:49 AM
So glad I'm playing today and not putting myself through even more misery
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 08, 2019, 11:20:46 AM
First and foremost I might be harsh but there's been plenty of cricket pundits saying that Smith, Kohli, Williamson and Root are the cream of the class which I agree with.

Should Root bat 3? Most certainly not. But should Root as captain select the right players for the team? Most certainly yes.

We've tried all these makeshift openers why isn't Root pushing for Sibley? We've seen Burns come of age in this series. I don't get the obsession with needing a slogger at the top of the order. Then you pick someone from CC that actual bats at 3 to do so in the Test side.

What I hear from most is its Smith, then a gap to Kholi, then Williamson, then Root generally. Not sure who puts Root up there and I'm sure I've never heard Root say it.

I agree with the point on the opener. I'd said before I'd have had Sibley in myself and dropped Roy, with Denly at 4. Not sure who's pick Roy was, so surely its speculation to say that's all on Root? Smith seems to have earmarked people he wants in the side regardless, like Butler. So who has the final say?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on September 08, 2019, 02:28:28 PM
I'd rate Williamson higher than Kohli.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 08, 2019, 03:04:06 PM
It's been strangely quiet on here today, and what conversation there has been has somehow been about Kohli...

Is there not an Ashes Test currently going on, that England are fighting tooth & nail to save?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 08, 2019, 03:25:13 PM
It's been about Root tbf. I think either everyone's not wanted to jinx it m, or are resigned to the seemingly inevitable!  :(
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: A-Swing-And-A-Miss on September 08, 2019, 03:29:18 PM
What I hear from most is its Smith, then a gap to Kholi, then Williamson, then Root generally. Not sure who puts Root up there and I'm sure I've never heard Root say it.

I agree with the point on the opener. I'd said before I'd have had Sibley in myself and dropped Roy, with Denly at 4. Not sure who's pick Roy was, so surely its speculation to say that's all on Root? Smith seems to have earmarked people he wants in the side regardless, like Butler. So who has the final say?

It comes from around 2015 when all 4 were relatively young, averaging around 50 and seen as the future greats of the game. Smith has moved into another gear since then, Kohli and Williamson are still class and Root has fallen away (Very interesting analysis on Sky yesterday morning about the technical differences in his batting between 2015 and now)

It's good to see England battling hard here with good contributions from less likely sources. There's three blokes in this team you'd expect to be making the major contributions to keeping the Aussies out, they're the three with the highest average this series.. Burns, Root and Stokes. Yet all 3 have scored just one run between them and the "passengers" have stood up to keep the Aussies at bay.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 08, 2019, 03:42:00 PM
It's been about Root tbf. I think either everyone's not wanted to jinx it m, or are resigned to the seemingly inevitable!  :(

Itís usually because we donít have anything bad to say.

Roy got a peach and was fighting.

Buttlers got 30 of a 100 so definitely not playing white ball.

We donít tend to moan when stokes fails as he carries us most of times.


So the forum rather be quiet than praise.............
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 08, 2019, 03:55:58 PM
At least we're fighting but it's a tough ask against a quality attack on a day 5 pitch.

Been some decent nuts, but I think Roy's still struggling as a test player unless he sorts the defensive flaws hew has.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 08, 2019, 03:56:27 PM
Judgement error from Jos but did the ball stay a bit low?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Jaffa on September 08, 2019, 04:59:13 PM
I think this Aus side are good enough to field first.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 08, 2019, 05:00:19 PM
Disappointed with Starc so far.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 08, 2019, 05:07:14 PM
Well that's likely that

As much as I'd love to see England hold on, Broad is a walking wicket as soon as anyone with a bit of pace comes on :(
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on September 08, 2019, 05:09:27 PM
Itís usually because we donít have anything bad to say.

Roy got a peach and was fighting.

Buttlers got 30 of a 100 so definitely not playing white ball.

We donít tend to moan when stokes fails as he carries us most of times.


So the forum rather be quiet than praise.............

I agree - too much pessimism on the forum. The only difference between the two sides was the second best Test batsman in the history of the game...no shame in that
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 08, 2019, 05:16:46 PM
Sack our selection panel. Please please please.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 08, 2019, 05:20:20 PM
And we are back! Lost now. Better go moan on the forum
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 08, 2019, 05:22:47 PM
6.15! On day five. 6.15 on day five! Yet the Aussies are apparently awesome and we are dire.


We are dire, but the Aussies have smith. Yet They still struggling to finish us off. Without smith it would be closer.
Even without smith they should have beat us easily but couldnít.


So either they arenít as good as people think, or we arenít as bad as the England fans on this forum keep making out.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 08, 2019, 05:24:02 PM
Well played Australia and England,  Congratulations Australia.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 08, 2019, 05:27:49 PM
And we are back! Lost now. Better go moan on the forum

They prepared everything for this tour. We did absolutely nothing and picked players who had no right to be there or batted in positions they shouldn't be.

Only ones who come out of this with any respect are Broad and Stokes, the rest has been abject
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 08, 2019, 05:29:49 PM
As an England fan it's the hope that makes the defeat that much more painful :(

Now we've lost a home Ashes series, I'll ask the forum this:
Was the focus on dominance in ODI cricket since the last World Cup worth the decline in the Test match arena?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 08, 2019, 05:32:55 PM
Only ones who come out of this with any respect are Broad and Stokes, the rest has been abject

Yes, Rory Burns has been an embarrassment at the top of the order, hasn't he...
And Denly, for all the stick he gets from the "experts" on here has fought admirably and performed well without being spectacular.

Not sure you've been watching the same series as everyone else?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 08, 2019, 05:37:08 PM
Yes, Rory Burns has been an embarrassment at the top of the order, hasn't he...
And Denly, for all the stick he gets from the "experts" on here has fought admirably and performed well without being spectacular.

Not sure you've been watching the same series as everyone else?

I have watched Burns for God knows how long. I just expect better from him.

Denly shouldn't be there in the first place. Root should have been the man at #4, not shoved up to accommodate him. A couple of decent knocks, but just nowhere near the quality of an international batsmen. Come on.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 08, 2019, 05:38:20 PM
They prepared everything for this tour. We did absolutely nothing and picked players who had no right to be there or batted in positions they shouldn't be.

Only ones who come out of this with any respect are Broad and Stokes, the rest has been abject

Seriously dude, where do you put your keyboard when we  are doing well as your always absent?


Pretty sure Rory burns as had a half decent series.
Denly made two fifties despite being messed about.Ēyour three, no your four, no your openingĒ
Leach has a following after his last two games......(granted for his batting).
Jofra no showed this test but was decent the two test before it.

But yeah just stokes and broad.........
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 08, 2019, 05:40:33 PM
Are both teams likely to make changes for the last test?  If Lyonís finger is shot will Aus play extra bowler?  If yes who gets dropped.  England had too many players that could be dropped but they will not make any changes.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 08, 2019, 05:41:38 PM
I'm going to go out on a limb and say it. Burns looks to be a decent find and could have solved half our opener conundrum. If you expect better or not he's doing a decent job at the top of the order, something England have been caring out for since Strauss retired!

As far as Denly goes, you're knocking a bloke for being selected and playing a couple of decent knocks? He isn't to blame for his selection, Ed Smith is. Denly's making the best of the situation he's been thrust into, whether you feel he should be there or not.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 08, 2019, 06:04:46 PM
Yeah I'm pretty much with @WalkingWicket37 , not too disappointed to be honest. I thought it was a 50/50 series with them having the better bowlers, which normally means a series win.

I wanted us to really fight and I think we did that, Smith is absolutely the best and you could say his runs made the bowlers job much easier. He is a class player there's no doubt

Denly and Burns, yep pretty good I think, Denly taking one for the team moving up and showed his experience, not a world beater but we don't have many of those available. burns showed an openers mentality and grit and that's what we need. His technique is a bit all over the shop but he knows his game and it's runs that count.

I know I have said this before but for me we are not far away. The middle order might need thinning out. I don't know if bairstow,butler can fit in the same team as has others have mentioned they both do one job.

I'd like to see Foakes in but that may be unrealistic, but one of the above being dropped might leave a place for a specialist batsman or Sam Curran to come in.if that was a batsman I'd like to see Ollie Pope be given time to develop.

Bairstow I'm afraid as has been said before is no longer top order. There might need to be a shoot out between Roy,bairstow and butler to take the team forward.

It's not all doom and gloom by any means, the Aussies are a very good side.

Best team won the series no doubt in my mind.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 08, 2019, 06:05:38 PM
Burns, Denly, Stokes, Broad and Archer can't really be knocked. Overton and Leach have battled hard but not convinced their bowling is good enough at Int level. Roy shouldn't ever have been opening and Root should be at 4. Anderson has been a huge loss too, he'd have given us control and would have given Smith more problems early in his innings. Could have evened things up.

We now need to build for the Ashes in Oz. We'll need to find another opener, a number 3, and maybe replace a number of bowlers. We need to plan now and get this right.


All that said, I'm not sure the Aussies have been that much the better 'team'. Credit to them and they deserve the win but we're heavily reliant on Smith, along with a great bowling unit. The rest of their side hasn't really shown up (Marnus apart). Both sides are far from vintage really.

Onto the Oval to try and at least tie the series.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on September 08, 2019, 06:11:30 PM
Congrats to the aussies. I personally feel aus have been much better throughout the series in the bowling department, I feel selection has cost us big time, and I feel like we missed jimmy massively. I would like to see a completely new outfit for the 5th test, I'd like to see Foakes come in, Roy dropped, sibley in, bairstow dropped and although Denly has done OK this series, I don't see him as a long term option so he unfortunately misses out. I'd bring pope in to bat in the middle.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 08, 2019, 06:20:15 PM
Congrats to the aussies. I personally feel aus have been much better throughout the series in the bowling department, I feel selection has cost us big time, and I feel like we missed jimmy massively. I would like to see a completely new outfit for the 5th test, I'd like to see Foakes come in, Roy dropped, sibley in, bairstow dropped and although Denly has done OK this series, I don't see him as a long term option so he unfortunately misses out. I'd bring pope in to bat in the middle.

I think Denly was always a temporary player...I'm not so sure now if that middle order does see some changes, let's say Sibley does play..that's two newish openers

Denly might...fill a gap at 3. Root back to 4.

Interested to hear others on Root, I think he should bat 3, he's clearly does not want to.

He's our best batsman by miles...I wonder if he will revert back to 4. He's shouldn't be captain I don't think but realistically he will be.

We need his runs more than anyone, if he feels better at 3 is it time to dump the Ashes experiment(3) ?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on September 08, 2019, 06:28:02 PM
Let's not get too despondent here: it's 2-1 and England dominated the rain affected fourth game. There are factors - poor selection on our part and there being a couple e of very influential tosses, but the big differences have been the form of Smith (who may be a pretty low human but is an incredible bat) together with the absence of Anderson, who was our best bet to dismiss him.

England's selection is screwed. Our top seven has three players desperate to impose themselves, one whose batting is shafted by being captain (cf Hussain, Vaughan, Strauss, Cook...) and two new lads.

Moving forward, only Burns, Root and Stokes should be confident of their places. Denly has nothing to be ashamed of but is not a long term option, and at least one if not two of Buttler, Roy and Bairstow need to go for the balance of the side. In South Africa, Malan should play - he should have here - and I'd like them to give the next opener a dead rubber.

My side for the Oval:
Burns
Sibley
Malan
Root
Denly*
Stokes
Bairstow
Jamie Overton or Saqib Mahmood
Archer
Leach
Broad

The asterix is because I really wanted to go Bairstow at five with Foakes to keep.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 08, 2019, 07:04:51 PM
I agree - too much pessimism on the forum. The only difference between the two sides was the second best Test batsman in the history of the game...no shame in that
And that they picked (it got close to anyway) their best batting line up while we went with bunch of Ed Smith hunches who average 30 in FC cricket.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on September 08, 2019, 07:19:48 PM
Iím going to throe something into the mix for the anti burns and Denley brigade. Apart from Smith those two are no better or worse than any batter in the Aus side.

Apart from Kohli at test level they are no better or worse than an other Indian test batter.

Apart from Williamson they are no better or worse than any of the Kiwi batters.

Better than all of SL, WI and SA so maybe the standard of test batting has dropped??

I think Denly has done a great job since coming into the side and being a true team man, played a masisve part in the 3rd teat win, played a great hand today to drag the game into the final session. Yes he could do with a TON and getting some bigger 50ís but has done a great job of occupying the crease.
Burns I think has done enough to now be our opening bat for some time, not sure who alongside at the minute but should be Sibley, Roy needs to focus on red ball cricket next summer and earn a test spot based on red ball stats not white ball.
Personally for me Butler and YJB need to be binned off for a while like Ali and earn a spot back.

Bowlers have been superb all series. Now we need to tie the series and restore some pride after after two gutsy 2nd innings performances over the past 2 tests
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: billyb on September 08, 2019, 07:21:00 PM
I'd just like to mention how absolutely brilliant Smith has been in this series. After all that trouble, to come here and have 82 as his lowest score after Archer sconned him is nothing short of genius. It's his world and we're just living in it.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 08, 2019, 07:25:40 PM
Burns
Sibley
Malan
Root
Denly*
Stokes
Bairstow
Jamie Overton or Saqib Mahmood
Archer
Leach
Broad

The asterix is because I really wanted to go Bairstow at five with Foakes to keep.

For me the England Oval team would be:
Burns, Sibley, Denly, Root, Stokes, Pope, Foakes, Woakes, Archer, Leach, Board

I understand Denly is stop gap but he has done enough to retain is position over Baristow, Roy or Buttler.  England will not make 4 changes next week so the only change that is likely to happen is Roy being replace by Pope or Sibley.  I hope they pick Sibley, otherwise they are going to ask Pope to bat at 3 and he will be batting out of position.  Why have multiple people batting out of position.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 08, 2019, 07:29:03 PM
Denly has done as well as he could have, but that isnít any great shakes. Nothing against the bloke but if weíre going to pick someone probably not good enough they are better served being 24 than 34.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 08, 2019, 07:30:03 PM
Would add he should probably get the nod at the oval as thereís 3 other blokes less deserving of another go in Roy, Bairstow and Buttler.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 08, 2019, 07:40:17 PM
Burns
Sibley
Denley
Root
Stokes
Pope
Bairstow
Woakes
Archer
Leach
Broad

Roy dropped. Only other options I toyed with were Foakes in to keep and bat 7, with Bairstow 6 and Pope missing out, but I'd like to see how Pope goes and think 6 would be good for him initially. Or Butler keeps his place and we save Pope for next summer to give him a go and let most of the players who've lost this test have a go at levelling the series.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 08, 2019, 08:50:18 PM
Iím going to throe something into the mix for the anti burns and Denley brigade. Apart from Smith those two are no better or worse than any batter in the Aus side.

Apart from Kohli at test level they are no better or worse than an other Indian test batter.

Apart from Williamson they are no better or worse than any of the Kiwi batters.

Better than all of SL, WI and SA so maybe the standard of test batting has dropped??

I think Denly has done a great job since coming into the side and being a true team man, played a masisve part in the 3rd teat win, played a great hand today to drag the game into the final session. Yes he could do with a TON and getting some bigger 50ís but has done a great job of occupying the crease.
Burns I think has done enough to now be our opening bat for some time, not sure who alongside at the minute but should be Sibley, Roy needs to focus on red ball cricket next summer and earn a test spot based on red ball stats not white ball.
Personally for me Butler and YJB need to be binned off for a while like Ali and earn a spot back.

Bowlers have been superb all series. Now we need to tie the series and restore some pride after after two gutsy 2nd innings performances over the past 2 tests
So let me get this right, Burns and Denly are equal to the likes of Pujara, Rahane, Taylor, Nichols, Markram?

Think you lost that argument
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 08, 2019, 09:08:33 PM
From https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27570206/headingley-broken-lot-teams-tim-paine (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27570206/headingley-broken-lot-teams-tim-paine)

"My dream was to come here and win an Ashes. I certainly didn't want to be the captain winning the Ashes. It doesn't mean any more or any less to me. I have said a lot of times my part in the this team is just one job that many are doing, I just get a lot of the credit I suppose but it is something we share around between the players and staff. I am just happy to be a part of it. I could have been working at Kookaburra [in 2017], so this isn't bad."

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27569316/pumped-tim-paine-says-steven-smith-best-seen (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27569316/pumped-tim-paine-says-steven-smith-best-seen)
I like Paine better and better after every interview.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 08, 2019, 09:17:45 PM
Yeah totally. I think he must know he is not the best player but his job is to get the best from his players.

He took over in a difficult time where they need a culture change.

The Aussies have used a squad of bowlers really well, Cummins has bowled a lot but itís been  shared around pretty well. No one had looked overworked
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: 19reading87 on September 08, 2019, 09:45:02 PM
When is the next test squad announced?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 08, 2019, 09:45:11 PM
Roy has to go
Bairstow has to go
Overton out for Woakes

First two simply must be dropped

Buttler to go for pope too
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 08, 2019, 09:51:18 PM
When is the next test squad announced?

Monday. Oval test starts thurs.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 08, 2019, 10:19:49 PM
Yes Smith is the reason the Urn is coming home with the Australians, but Ben Stokes is the reason England have looked like a team who can compete with Australia. Massive respect to England for fighting that hard yesterday, also to Stuart Broad who has been a one man army with the ball for England.

The Australian bowling has been amazing, Cummins is the #1 in the world for a reason, Hazelwood not far behind and Lyon has had a tough series, but he is the Goat for a reason and will bounce back. The main difference for mine is that the Aussie bowlers operate as a team, Broad just doesn't have that around him.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 08, 2019, 10:46:34 PM
Yes Smith is the reason the Urn is coming home with the Australians, but Ben Stokes is the reason England have looked like a team who can compete with Australia. Massive respect to England for fighting that hard yesterday, also to Stuart Broad who has been a one man army with the ball for England.

The Australian bowling has been amazing, Cummins is the #1 in the world for a reason, Hazelwood not far behind and Lyon has had a tough series, but he is the Goat for a reason and will bounce back. The main difference for mine is that the Aussie bowlers operate as a team, Broad just doesn't have that around him.

Shows how big a loss Anderson was. On home soil he's right up there with the best (if not the best swing bowler around) and was a huge loss for us. Add Archer to him, Broad and Stokes and in the UK that's a high quality attack who could work together well.

We always knew the ball would dominate, but you've had the best player in the world on fire with the bat and chanced upon your next best player, who may not have even played without Smith's injury. The rest of your batting stats are woeful (as are ours too btw). While we've made selection errors and been missing a guy with almost 600 test wickets.

You've deserved the Ashes but there's not a massive amount between the two sides when you break it down.

Anderson missing was a real shame for everyone, as not sure we'll see him again in an Ashes series, certainly not at home anyway. He deserved one last go at the Aussies on home soil
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 08, 2019, 11:25:00 PM
Anyone know of the link where the complete after the game interviews might be located?  The bits and pieces interview are missing the questions.

Edit: Found them
Tim Paine's Interview - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjWNKqDJ3wY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjWNKqDJ3wY)
Joe Root Interview - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vlGUcUTWhA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vlGUcUTWhA)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 09, 2019, 02:22:58 AM
Shows how big a loss Anderson was. On home soil he's right up there with the best (if not the best swing bowler around) and was a huge loss for us. Add Archer to him, Broad and Stokes and in the UK that's a high quality attack who could work together well.

We always knew the ball would dominate, but you've had the best player in the world on fire with the bat and chanced upon your next best player, who may not have even played without Smith's injury. The rest of your batting stats are woeful (as are ours too btw). While we've made selection errors and been missing a guy with almost 600 test wickets.

You've deserved the Ashes but there's not a massive amount between the two sides when you break it down.

Anderson missing was a real shame for everyone, as not sure we'll see him again in an Ashes series, certainly not at home anyway. He deserved one last go at the Aussies on home soil

Yeah Anderson is class, and absolutely deserved one last series and I agree the series would have a different look, but I guess that's where the real difference between the two sides becomes more apparent, Australian cricket maybe has the depth that England don't, especially in the bowling stocks.

 Unfortunately for England I don't see it getting much better with Anderson now essentially done, Broad only has a few years left, and the gap between Anderson and Broad to the next tier of quality would be a concern for England I'd imagine.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on September 09, 2019, 03:59:32 AM
Burns and Denly will get better with time. They showed good fight, it'd be a shame to see them dropped from the England side.

Australian side as a whole had more experience and actually a better captain. I saw the AUS celebration when the last ENG wicket fell and it made me laugh - these guys have been thru so much and they have come back in a big way! Good for them, I say.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Cholrudee on September 09, 2019, 04:29:21 AM
Adil Rashid needs to get a run again.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 09, 2019, 05:45:11 AM
Burns and Denly will get better with time. They showed good fight, it'd be a shame to see them dropped from the England side.

Australian side as a whole had more experience and actually a better captain. I saw the AUS celebration when the last ENG wicket fell and it made me laugh - these guys have been thru so much and they have come back in a big way! Good for them, I say.
Burns isnít getting dropped, Denly is 33 so time isnít on his side. If he was 23 Iíd be happy to see him given the winter.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Number4 on September 09, 2019, 08:33:03 AM
I think Root shouldnít be captain. Just my opinion but his performance with the bat has been down since he took the job and his captaincy is terrible. As much as I hate 5o say it I think Stokes should be captain
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 09, 2019, 08:43:37 AM
How can anyone say Denly deserves to be dropped?

hes hit two back to the wall 50s and starting to look at home. and arguably in the series how baeen in our top 4 best players with stokes root (hes hit 2 50s but been mixed) and burns

Roy should be dropped but at least tried to put away the big shots and dig in yesterday

Bairstow is coming back into form but needs champo cricket to find it, buttler is woefully out of nick

when theres better players pick them!

for me the third test should be(including decision beacuse selectors wont make too many changes)

burns
sibley
root
denly
pope
stokes
bairstow (id rather have foakes but it wont happen)
Woakes
Archer
Leach
Broad
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 09, 2019, 09:57:20 AM
Nail hit head from George Dobell https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27571263/england-not-good-think-are (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27571263/england-not-good-think-are)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: fazza1970 on September 09, 2019, 10:34:17 AM
Both for his batting and with the long-term captaincy issue in mind, I think Northeast is worth a go at #3, with Root going back to #4 and Roy being dropped.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 09, 2019, 11:05:40 AM
slightly surprisingly, England just announced a unchanged team    :)

I guess.....any changes to the team will have to wait until the winter tours, where it may be easier to have a new opener, or a new middle order batsman?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: JTtaylor145 on September 09, 2019, 11:28:42 AM
No surprise that England announced an unchanged squad for the final test at the Oval. For the players it must be comforting to know that the selectors will give them plenty of opportunities to prove themselves but it can be really frustrating for fans of English cricket. Anyone watching will know that Jason Roy isn't up to standard at test level. You can't play YJB and Buttler in the same side and there is an argument that neither of them should be playing.  It is just frustrating sometimes that you can see something isn't working but the sheer bloody mindedness of the selectors is 'no we are sticking to these players'. It's not as if these players have terrific records to fall back on.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Number4 on September 09, 2019, 11:42:19 AM
No surprise that England announced an unchanged squad for the final test at the Oval. For the players it must be comforting to know that the selectors will give them plenty of opportunities to prove themselves but it can be really frustrating for fans of English cricket. Anyone watching will know that Jason Roy isn't up to standard at test level. You can't play YJB and Buttler in the same side and there is an argument that neither of them should be playing.  It is just frustrating sometimes that you can see something isn't working but the sheer bloody mindedness of the selectors is 'no we are sticking to these players'. It's not as if these players have terrific records to fall back on.

So how many games do you give a player before you drop him? Sometimes selectors just canít win. People complain if they keep changing the team and next if they donít change the team people complain.

Not sure how much you guys follow State of Origin over here but Queensland who were successful for such I long period were known for selecting consistently even if the player was out of form for his club. This gave the player the confidence knowing the selectors trusted their ability
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 09, 2019, 11:45:26 AM
slightly surprisingly, England just announced a unchanged team    :)

I guess.....any changes to the team will have to wait until the winter tours, where it may be easier to have a new opener, or a new middle order batsman?
Definitely an opportunity missed by the selectors to give Sibley a debut on his ex home ground. Weather looks decent this week and The Oval is a decent place to bat most of the time.

Sibley will probably end up facing Boult on a green top in a few weeks time instead...not much fun
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: JTtaylor145 on September 09, 2019, 12:10:09 PM
So how many games do you give a player before you drop him? Sometimes selectors just canít win. People complain if they keep changing the team and next if they donít change the team people complain.

Not sure how much you guys follow State of Origin over here but Queensland who were successful for such I long period were known for selecting consistently even if the player was out of form for his club. This gave the player the confidence knowing the selectors trusted their ability
I think you can get a pretty good impression of someone after 10 or so tests. The selectors haven't been given a dealt a great hand by the ECB. How do you select players when they don't play much First Class cricket in July/August and the test matches are in July/August? The whole structure needs a massive overhaul. It's not the selectors fault that Australia are a better test match side than England.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 09, 2019, 01:27:39 PM
Yeah Anderson is class, and absolutely deserved one last series and I agree the series would have a different look, but I guess that's where the real difference between the two sides becomes more apparent, Australian cricket maybe has the depth that England don't, especially in the bowling stocks.

 Unfortunately for England I don't see it getting much better with Anderson now essentially done, Broad only has a few years left, and the gap between Anderson and Broad to the next tier of quality would be a concern for England I'd imagine.

Agree that Anderson is a great bowler and could have made a difference.  Personally, I think Root needs to have his head examined.  He mismanaged both Woakes and Archer.  Under bowling Woakes and over bowling Archer.  Was Woakes injured and that was the reason that he was dropped?  Why was he so under bowled?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on September 09, 2019, 02:10:57 PM
Burns isnít getting dropped, Denly is 33 so time isnít on his side. If he was 23 Iíd be happy to see him given the winter.

As long as a batsman maintain his fitness and keeps scoring runs, his age does not matter. England needs another "5 year plan" and until a "20 year old phenom" opener surfaces from the system, guys like Denly will be doing a great service for their country for next 2 to 3 years.

Tim Paine is almost 35 , took helm of AUS team when he was 32 (or 33). Not bad at all!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 09, 2019, 02:24:05 PM
Tim Paine is almost 35 , took helm of AUS team when he was 32 (or 33). Not bad at all!

He's not good, either...
Decent gloveman, so so batsman and was put in charge of a sinking ship at a time of crisis.

Were he not Captain, his place would be one of the most vulnerable of the current Australia side.
I think he knows this, which is part of his *grits teeth* charm as a leader, I genuinely believe he feels blessed to be there so makes the most of every minute.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: hammersjr on September 09, 2019, 02:27:38 PM
As long as a batsman maintain his fitness and keeps scoring runs, his age does not matter. England needs another "5 year plan" and until a "20 year old phenom" opener surfaces from the system, guys like Denly will be doing a great service for their country for next 2 to 3 years.

Tim Paine is almost 35 , took helm of AUS team when he was 32 (or 33). Not bad at all!

Didnít Rogers and Voges both come into the test fold for Aus pretty late on and still do a job. Might be wrong but I think they were both older than Denly when they had a proper crack at test cricket.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 09, 2019, 02:29:08 PM
I do not understand Ian Chappell.  One day he calls for replacing Paine was captain and the next he is all praise for him.  There is no pleasing ex-players in media.  If the game was a draw yesterday knives would be out for Paine to be dropped and removed from captaincy.

"The man charged with resurrecting Australian cricketís reputation Ė skipper Tim Paine - deserves a lot of credit for the success of the team. Heís been a calming influence, has a steady pair of gloves, has made some useful contributions with the bat and provided commonsense leadership. In short, he was the right man for a difficult job in desperate times."

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket/australia-ultimately-proved-the-better-of-two-flawed-teams-20190909-p52pho.html (https://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket/australia-ultimately-proved-the-better-of-two-flawed-teams-20190909-p52pho.html)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 09, 2019, 02:38:13 PM
Paineís position has never been under threat. You just had to see the interview with Langer after the yesterdayís match. Langer said, and it was aimed at Warne, that Australia wants the best glove man. Itís the top 6 batsmenís job to get the runs.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on September 09, 2019, 02:43:14 PM
He's not good, either...
Decent gloveman, so so batsman and was put in charge of a sinking ship at a time of crisis.

Were he not Captain, his place would be one of the most vulnerable of the current Australia side.
I think he knows this, which is part of his *grits teeth* charm as a leader, I genuinely believe he feels blessed to be there so makes the most of every minute.

Sometimes that is all you need - a decent player who can bring some stability to a jittery squad. He did his job. Now AUS are on the up-and-up, he is not good enough?  This search for perfection is just ridiculous!

For the sake of ordinary joes like Paine who step up in times of sh!!ty crises, I hope he and his side win the series!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on September 09, 2019, 02:45:56 PM
Didnít Rogers and Voges both come into the test fold for Aus pretty late on and still do a job. Might be wrong but I think they were both older than Denly when they had a proper crack at test cricket.

Chris Rogers? In my book, he is a rockstar!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on September 09, 2019, 05:18:11 PM
England need to decide if they need Root the batsman (excellent), or Root the captain (garbage)....since he clearly canít do both.  Maybe make Butler the captain and let Root go back to scoring a ton of runs?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 09, 2019, 05:54:58 PM
England need to decide if they need Root the batsman (excellent), or Root the captain (garbage)....since he clearly canít do both.  Maybe make Butler the captain and let Root go back to scoring a ton of runs?

The issue is Butler shouldn't be in the side, let alone captain. You need someone who's place is guaranteed, which is difficult at the minute! Broad maybe, but not for me. Please not Stokes, we're asking enough of him already.

I don't think Root has had it easy, we've not exactly helped him out with performances. Difficult to set fields and rotate bowlers correctly when we're constantly in the sh*t!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 09, 2019, 06:53:45 PM
It is indeed difficult for Root, Anderson missing all series made it much harder still.

Paine has shown the modern captain does not need to be the best player but create a team that gives the very best the chance to influence the game.

Don't generally like stats to judge players but sometimes they are telling. Root averages 40 as Captain and over 50 not captain.

Vic Marks has written a good article in the Guardian today which is where I got that stat from.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on September 09, 2019, 07:08:03 PM
I do not understand Ian Chappell.  One day he calls for replacing Paine was captain and the next he is all praise for him.  There is no pleasing ex-players in media.  If the game was a draw yesterday knives would be out for Paine to be dropped and removed from captaincy.

"The man charged with resurrecting Australian cricketís reputation Ė skipper Tim Paine - deserves a lot of credit for the success of the team. Heís been a calming influence, has a steady pair of gloves, has made some useful contributions with the bat and provided commonsense leadership. In short, he was the right man for a difficult job in desperate times."

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket/australia-ultimately-proved-the-better-of-two-flawed-teams-20190909-p52pho.html (https://www.smh.com.au/sport/cricket/australia-ultimately-proved-the-better-of-two-flawed-teams-20190909-p52pho.html)

All you need to know is Chappelli talks complete nonsense, don't pay any attention to him.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jamesisapayne on September 09, 2019, 07:30:06 PM
All you need to know is Chappelli talks complete nonsense, don't pay any attention to him.

Indeed. In fact why listen to ex pros who've played at the highest level at all, when you can get all the nonsense you need from club players right here, a lot of whom struggle to average double digits with the bat ;)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 09, 2019, 07:37:43 PM
The issue is Butler shouldn't be in the side, let alone captain. You need someone who's place is guaranteed, which is difficult at the minute! Broad maybe, but not for me. Please not Stokes, we're asking enough of him already.

Bold is mine.

A certain Mike Brealey comes to mind from years ago.  At the current moment England have only 4 spots (Broad, Stokes, Root, Archer) that are taken, with Burns and Denly continuing based on the last 2 test.  Everyone else is on borrowed time.  I have not seem Buttler keep much so cannot comment but I thought he was considered a better keeper than Bairstow and neither one of them is close to Foakes which Buttler has said is the standard for keepers in Sri Lanka.

If I have to choose between Buttler and Bairstow, I would go with Buttler, outside of the current Ashes Buttler has better overall score and make him the keeper and bat at 7 and drop Bairstow for Pope or some other middle order batsmen.

I looked at the last 5 test series, since Buttler was added to the test squad:

Total Score/Position Compared to Rest of the Team

Pakistan - 161/1st, Bairstow was 9th with 46 runs from 3 innings
India - 349/1st, Bairstow was 5th with 230 runs from 9 innings
Sri Lanka - 250/2nd, Ben Foakes was first, Bairstow only batted twice for a total of 125
West Indies - 178/2nd, Ben Stokes was first, Bairstow was 7th with 110 runs
Australia - 130/7th, Stokes, Burns, Root, Woakes, Denly, Bairstow ahead of him one place with 178 runs


Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 09, 2019, 07:42:17 PM
Indeed. In fact why listen to ex pros who've played at the highest level at all, when you can get all the nonsense you need from club players right here, a lot of whom struggle to average double digits with the bat ;)

I am more than willing to listen to both provided both sets are consistent with their comments.  Chappell had called for Paine to be replaced with Smith less than 48 hrs ago  :o
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Komdotkom on September 09, 2019, 09:46:43 PM
I heard this morning that England have named the same squad, but Stokes may play as a specialist batsman due to shoulder pain.
Who's going to bowl first change then? Overton and who? I suppose Root isn't doing much with the bat so he may as well try and bowl himself into form! Seems like a strange plan, I'd hate to see Broad injured due to a high workload after carrying the team all 'summer'.
Although not setting the world on fire Denly has showed a bit of patience and grit which is sadly missing from most test batsmen these days, too many batsmen forget that the game lasts for 5 days ....if it's not raining.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 10, 2019, 03:39:57 PM
With the Oval test being the last test for Bayliss, who are the leading candidate for replacement?  It seems to be pretty quiet on that front considering NZ tour in October and SA tour in Dec.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on September 10, 2019, 03:53:44 PM
I reckon it has to be Alec Stewart
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on September 10, 2019, 05:20:59 PM
Indeed. In fact why listen to ex pros who've played at the highest level at all, when you can get all the nonsense you need from club players right here, a lot of whom struggle to average double digits with the bat ;)

https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/21/Appeal-to-Authority (https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/21/Appeal-to-Authority)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 10, 2019, 06:24:39 PM
Ollie pope got a lovely fifty today on a track everyone else was 185 for 15.........


His first class average is 61. Only 12 people in the history of first class cricket have ever scored 2000 runs at a higher avaerage than him.


Such a shame for pope, he happens to exist in an era where England have such and awesome batting line up............





(Post shameless Stolen from twitter.......)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on September 10, 2019, 09:02:35 PM
Ollie pope got a lovely fifty today on a track everyone else was 185 for 15.........


His first class average is 61. Only 12 people in the history of first class cricket have ever scored 2000 runs at a higher avaerage than him.


Such a shame for pope, he happens to exist in an era where England have such and awesome batting line up............





(Post shameless Stolen from twitter.......)

Watched that 50. It had the same aura as every Bairstow innings from 14-16, that weird sense that one guy had brought his own private pitch.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 10, 2019, 09:17:56 PM
This lad needs to come in, along with a specialist opener. The only way I can see it happening is if one is chosen from bairstow and butler, and one of Denly or Roy because they basically do the same job and I'm not sure how much longer we can carry on being unbalanced.

I'm a bit retro, back to more specialists which means Foakes plays ahead of bairstow and butler....but I don't see England picking him or making wholesale changes.

Don't know whether Roy deserves more time now at number 4. Of the above presuming Foakes remains out in the cold I would pick(from my armchair  :))

Butler...seems to be able to think about the match situation a bit more

Denly....don't care how old he is

You would then leave places available where we are in most need, number 2 number 5.

At some point or other we have to strengthen the batting and can't see any other way of doing it.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 11, 2019, 12:34:56 PM
roy and overton miss out

woakes and curran play

stokes as specialist bat
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 11, 2019, 12:45:08 PM
roy and overton miss out

woakes and curran play

stokes as specialist bat

(https://harrythehedgehogwow.files.wordpress.com/2017/11/58d17676-26ae-4f4f-9cbc-b98f3cb35d87.png?w=768)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 11, 2019, 12:45:33 PM
Thank God the Roy experiment is officially dead
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 11, 2019, 01:04:37 PM
but whats the batting lineup going to be?

burns
denly
root
stokes
bairstow
buttler
curran
woakes
archer
leach
broad

to say our batting is the weak suit thats a  long tail and lot of pressure on a fragile top 4 and then the two all rounders

unless curran bats higher
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 11, 2019, 01:08:12 PM
1 change to the Australia match day squad too

Mitch Marsh replaces Travis Head
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 11, 2019, 01:10:22 PM
Odd decision by the Aussies to axe Head tbh. Heís 25 and one of their VCs. Wade fortunate
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 11, 2019, 01:51:37 PM
James Vince is currently 54* off 39 balls against Surrey.

Anyone else got a feeling he may end up on a tour this winter? :-[
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 11, 2019, 01:56:29 PM
Is there any reason for such a long winter tour in terms of tests? 2 in NZ, 4 in SA, 2 in SL.

Also going I was probably harsh on Burns and Denly the last time, but I'm not sure about the latter being a long term solution at 3; then again, I'm not sure there's anyone out there who can fill the role like the players of old...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 11, 2019, 02:02:59 PM
@rickjames is the schedule in some way dictated by the Test Championship?
I'll be honest and say I've not really looked much into it, but I presume that's got something to do with the 8 Test winter?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 11, 2019, 02:05:22 PM
The 2 tests in NZ aren't part of the WTC, as far as I'm aware. Considering we were only there 18 months ago I just find it odd we're going back so soon.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 11, 2019, 05:14:13 PM
Harsh on Overton.



ďHey thanks for that one match, where you absolutely played your heart out with the bat.
But unlike Roy, we are only giving you the one opportunity to bowl well, and you failed. So off you goĒ
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on September 11, 2019, 05:34:55 PM
Harsh on Overton.



ďHey thanks for that one match, where you absolutely played your heart out with the bat.
But unlike Roy, we are only giving you the one opportunity to bowl well, and you failed. So off you goĒ

Normally I'd agree with this, but I find it difficult to have any sympathy for an unapologetic racist so good riddance to Overton.

Glad Woakes is back as long as he's 100% fit.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 11, 2019, 05:47:51 PM
Woakes needs to come back yes he needs to be fully fit. stokes only batting so Curran has to come in really. Don't know if Roy will slot back in when Stokes can bowl or if it's something more permanent.

Whether he deserves more chances at no 4 is a difficult one. If the choice is from Denly...who could bat 3 if a new opener comes in therefore Root going back to 4 think I would pick Denly regardless of age.
Number 3 for Root hasn't worked has it?

Pope at least needs to be on the winter tours, I would have him at 5, no bairstow and Foakes or butler to keep.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 11, 2019, 06:08:16 PM

Glad Woakes is back as long as he's 100% fit.


Was he injured last game and that was the reason that he was under bowled in the other matches also? He does not come across as someone who has attitude problem and always seems to be team player, but what do I know about inner workings for ECB and test teams :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 11, 2019, 08:27:34 PM
https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27593545/recalled-mitchell-marsh-challenged-emulate-ben-stokes (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27593545/recalled-mitchell-marsh-challenged-emulate-ben-stokes)

Did not see this coming and I am wondering how often are the Marsh brothers going to continue getting chances.  I guess this move was forced due to having way to many lefties in the team.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 12, 2019, 08:05:03 AM
Harsh on Overton.



ďHey thanks for that one match, where you absolutely played your heart out with the bat.
But unlike Roy, we are only giving you the one opportunity to bowl well, and you failed. So off you goĒ

In general I would agree about giving players time to find their feet, but in this case Overton was such an unfathomable selection in the first place that it would have been a shock had he played more than one game.  Clearly the pitch at OT was nothing like England were wanting, but as a "horses for courses" pick for that one game, there was no value in retaining him for the Oval
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 12, 2019, 09:23:09 AM
https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27593545/recalled-mitchell-marsh-challenged-emulate-ben-stokes (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27593545/recalled-mitchell-marsh-challenged-emulate-ben-stokes)

Did not see this coming and I am wondering how often are the Marsh brothers going to continue getting chances.  I guess this move was forced due to having way to many lefties in the team.

As long as they keep being the best options to be selected? Shauns selection issues have had as much to do with injury as form and he constantly tops run scoring tables in domestic cricket. As for Mitch Marsh, he is simply the best Allround option in Australian cricket at the moment.

If these guys weren't brothers and didn't share the Marsh name, there wouldn't be half the outrage when they get selected.

As for the selection, I think being a right hander helped, but I get the feeling that they are going for the foot on the throat approach and ideally they would be resting Pat Cummins, but want to win the ashes and not just reclaim them, so I'd be surprised if Cummins bowled much more than two spells an innings, with Marsh to make up the rest.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on September 12, 2019, 09:30:52 AM
https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27593545/recalled-mitchell-marsh-challenged-emulate-ben-stokes (https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/27593545/recalled-mitchell-marsh-challenged-emulate-ben-stokes)

Did not see this coming and I am wondering how often are the Marsh brothers going to continue getting chances.  I guess this move was forced due to having way to many lefties in the team.

Marsh likely to take over as Aus captain if paine retires after this series so they have to play him
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 12, 2019, 09:35:25 AM
Put in to bat. Don't mind that...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on September 12, 2019, 10:00:56 AM
Is this now the bit where we have a massive collapse followed by Sam Curran making everyone else look like an idiot?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 12, 2019, 10:32:41 AM
its a dead rubber far as im concerned but a chance for Denly, Curran to make a decent contribution for the future

also like to see Root get back to scoring big runs with a fair amount of the press suggesting he would be better off without the Captaincy, which I wholeheartley agree with...but which probably wont happen.

giving up on Bairstow going back to being a test class batsman  :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 12, 2019, 10:41:15 AM
Poor shot from Denly driving at one, no need
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Big Mac on September 12, 2019, 11:05:54 AM
Was he injured last game and that was the reason that he was under bowled in the other matches also? He does not come across as someone who has attitude problem and always seems to be team player, but what do I know about inner workings for ECB and test teams :D

I'd hope that was the reason because as you said he doesn't seem the kind of bloke to annoy the captain and he's too good to be underutilised like he was last time.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 12, 2019, 11:50:41 AM
Two lifelines from Root with some very poor fielding
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 12, 2019, 12:39:31 PM
Two lifelines from Root with some very poor fielding

He better make it count but knowing him he will score a fifty odd and find a way to get out.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on September 12, 2019, 12:43:51 PM
Root dropped for the 3rd time - poor shot
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 12, 2019, 01:23:06 PM
Rory Burns that is an ugly way to get out!

played very well up until then too
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: t2ylo on September 12, 2019, 01:32:35 PM
Root is England batting personified.

Looks good but too often 39-3 (or should be)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 12, 2019, 01:51:46 PM
england in danger of cocking this up

Stokes out similar to burns but caught at point
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 12, 2019, 01:52:00 PM
Another poor one
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 12, 2019, 01:54:42 PM
this would be an outstanding time for Jonny to find some form!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 12, 2019, 02:33:57 PM
this would be an outstanding time for Jonny to find some form!

In a dead rubber of a fixture ?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 12, 2019, 02:41:40 PM
We are the worst offenders but this over rate is shocking
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 12, 2019, 02:51:33 PM
In a dead rubber of a fixture ?

Itís only a dead rubber in regards the ashes
England are right there test championship points and we can draw the series so hardly dead


But yeah why not we have a long winter and Iíd rather have an in form Jonny going to South Africa this winter so yeah this would be a good tome for Jonny to find some form
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 12, 2019, 03:14:04 PM
So if Root makes a ton he's been lucky/only does it when it doesn't count and if Bairstow scores runs it's in a dead rubber so doesn't count for much either?! Not sure its any easier, still facing the same attack, Root against the new ball just about and with a lot still on the line for both. The chance to draw the series, Root having to face criticism about his captaincy, Bairstow knowing people are questioning him too.

Disappointing we've not won the Ashes back but we're so down on our sportsmen sometimes. I reckon both these players would get into most (if not all teams) in the world tbh, yet we don't rate them!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 12, 2019, 03:19:13 PM
No chance of Root making a ton.  He did not cash in on all the lifes that he received.

Cummins just said the fielders have butter fingers so I am just going to bowl him  :o
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 12, 2019, 03:19:19 PM
Root bowled 57 by Cummins. Gets dropped 3 times and still canít get a century. Woeful
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 12, 2019, 03:21:13 PM
Root def would he is that good. If you read some of the criticism/comments in the press the majority are saying he has the talent to be one of the worlds best players, there would be loads on here that would agree with that.But the Captaincy being questioned as in is it stopping him becoming the best player he can be(massively agree with this myself)

test cricket format, there's no way on earth Bairstow would get into most teams, he's just not good enough.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 12, 2019, 03:22:25 PM
Woeful?!  :D :D :D
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 12, 2019, 03:26:00 PM
In a dead rubber of a fixture ?


Dead rubber?

Would it be a dead rubber at 2-1 down with 1 to play against India? Pakistan? South Africa?

Nope it wouldnít it would be a game to draw the series?

So why do people keep banging on about this being  a dead rubber? Is it because it doesnít suit there agenda if we manage to actually draw this series???


Series draw is a series draw, regardless of who won the last series. Get behind the lads and support them or jog on.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 12, 2019, 03:28:40 PM
As for today.

Australia arenít having a great day, weíd probably be all out if theyíd turned up.
Stokes, and denly got themselves out.
Burns still a mistake.

And Root, well, he would have gone early if Australia could catch. But for someone in the fifties and 100 balls in. That was shocking foot movement, he really should be getting that front foot moving that far in to an innings!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on September 12, 2019, 03:29:36 PM
Root bowled 57 by Cummins. Gets dropped 3 times and still canít get a century. Woeful

No shame in getting out to that kind of a delivery
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 12, 2019, 03:36:35 PM
I know thereís a big pity party for Joe Root, seemingly forever unlucky. The truth of the matter is his footwork is awful. That ball hit halfway up the stumps, Root was camped on the back foot to a pitched up ball.

Root isnít as good as everyone thinks he is. Pietersen was many leagues above
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 12, 2019, 03:37:33 PM
Root's dismissals have been pretty consistent this series with him getting caught on the crease to balls he should be getting forward to. 

I hope he takes a break rather the  touring NZ in October.  He has looked shattered all series and his concentration whilst batting doesn't seem to be there at all
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 12, 2019, 03:38:48 PM
Bairstow the career failure...how this imbecile plays over Foakes is a mystery
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 12, 2019, 03:39:08 PM
now johnny, told you wed cock this up
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 12, 2019, 03:45:02 PM
I know thereís a big pity party for Joe Root, seemingly forever unlucky. The truth of the matter is his footwork is awful. That ball hit halfway up the stumps, Root was camped on the back foot to a pitched up ball.

Root isnít as good as everyone thinks he is. Pietersen was many leagues above

Never said he was unlucky and wasn't comparing him to Pieterson, but he's far from woeful.

He's facing the best bowler in the world and got a good ball. Yes he maybe should have been further forward, but people get out to good balls. Apart from you by the sound of it mate :D Get your application in for the coaching job!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 12, 2019, 03:45:18 PM
Cummins what have you done.  Curran survives.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 12, 2019, 03:48:48 PM
Bairstow's test career is sadly finished. Was good while it lasted.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 12, 2019, 03:54:55 PM
Bairstow's test career is sadly finished. Was good while it lasted.
All of one year? 2016 is the only year he averaged over 40
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 12, 2019, 03:58:07 PM
Very poor review by Bairstow. Unfortunately a regular offender when it comes to burning one of the team's reviews.

Butler to take the gloves got the winter tests in my view.  For all the calls for Foakes to be in the side, he has looked in wretched form with the bat th is summer and an average of 27 in the CC this summer had probably flattered him.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 12, 2019, 04:01:11 PM
If mitchell marsh gets runs aswell. The Aussies will have wished they told him to channel ben stokes earlier!

Heís not only swinging it both ways, he seems to be bowling a tad quicker than usual to.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 12, 2019, 04:01:16 PM
Root's dismissals have been pretty consistent this series with him getting caught on the crease to balls he should be getting forward to. 

I hope he takes a break rather the  touring NZ in October.  He has looked shattered all series and his concentration whilst batting doesn't seem to be there at all

nail on the head this. he's knackered and having him skipper is going to hamper his game if it carries on much longer. He's the best we have by an absolute street.

I doubt this will happen but I hope the new coach starts by grasping the nettle. Root has not failed by any means as captain but we need him at his best.

he's a diamond we(England) need to look after. Anyone else can skipper. Stuart Broad.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 12, 2019, 04:03:44 PM
Collapsing to Mitchell sodding Marsh...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on September 12, 2019, 04:07:13 PM
Did someone forget to tell Curran he was playing in a test match and not a  t20. That was a woeful display from him
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 12, 2019, 04:10:40 PM
Says a lot for how bad this team is when they're coming unstuck by Mitchell Marsh
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on September 12, 2019, 04:12:15 PM
Says a lot for how bad this team is when they're coming unstuck by Mitchell Marsh

Heís bowling quite well (and quick!!!) to be fair - wonder if that speed gun is accurate
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: csnew on September 12, 2019, 04:15:00 PM
Anderson wanted pitches with more in them. Heís got to be joking having seen his side bat on flat tracks

M Marsh being made to look like a world beater
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 12, 2019, 04:17:26 PM
Marsh has bowled well tbf and the one to Bairstow was a good nut. Not saying he's a world beater but credit where credits due.

Shocking from Curran, how dare he flash like that at a wide one......insert one of the following....Never seen a test player/His career is finished/etc etc.  I bet he's responsible for the Brexit mess and the state of the economy too!

Woakes daring to get out to Marsh too. His career over as well I suspect?!

(Please take all this in jest, I'm just trying to make light of a poor situation!  :D)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 12, 2019, 04:19:47 PM
Heís bowling quite well (and quick!!!) to be fair - wonder if that speed gun is accurate

I do Wonder if these are watching or just judging of old thoughts on players.

Generally between 86-89moh, swinging both ways and in good areas.
Broad, Anderson and stokes do that and there bowling well. Marsh is doing it and itís all nad batsman making him look
Good apparently.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on September 12, 2019, 04:21:58 PM
Marsh has bowled well. He hasn't bowled that well though.

As for Root, he's got an issue with the full straight ball, clearly. Gary Ballance got torn to bits for that!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 12, 2019, 04:36:58 PM
Looks like England might get couple of overs against Aussie openers.

I thought Archer could bat.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 12, 2019, 04:37:43 PM
Something good has come out of this ashes for England!!

Finally, finally after years of broad pretending like he could bat. Heís rightfully now down at 11!!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 12, 2019, 04:38:30 PM
Looks like England might get couple of overs against Aussie openers.

I thought Archer could bat.


White ball bat. He has no clue against the red ball.

Fits in this England side well.......
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 12, 2019, 04:41:50 PM
Finally, finally after years of broad pretending like he could bat. Heís rightfully now down at 11!!

I think Leach needs to bat in front of Archer also.  He looks compact and plays within his limits.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 12, 2019, 04:49:23 PM
Leach could be 5 and im serious!!   :)

Jos had thought sod this im going one day mode.

I like Jos Butler.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 12, 2019, 04:51:23 PM
I think if you are batting with #9 to 11 you might as well go for it.

Marsh walking off the field :o
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 12, 2019, 04:58:24 PM
Did someone forget to tell Curran he was playing in a test match and not a  t20. That was a woeful display from him

You do realise Curran is a white ball hitter right ?? Heís simply never a test batter irrespective how much heís bull crapped up as the next great hope
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on September 12, 2019, 05:07:39 PM
One worrying thing for Root is an increased propensity to whinge. He called the Ireland pitch sub-par (!!!) and then the reaction today after getting out was weird- balls seam around in England, so to tap the pitch like that as if He was so unlucky to get a seaming delivery was just bizarre. Seems like the pressure is getting to him - as captain you canít be whinging so much...affects everyone else.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ProCricketer1982 on September 12, 2019, 05:21:28 PM
Buttler doing alright here. Keep going lad

He is a bit of a luxury player but he just shows more mental maturity that the likes of Curran, Bairstow etc.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on September 12, 2019, 05:34:09 PM
Buttler doing alright here. Keep going lad

He is a bit of a luxury player but he just shows more mental maturity that the likes of Curran, Bairstow etc.
He's noticeably tightened up during this series to be fair, defence looks far better now. Went to the last test and he actually looked our most comfortable bat by a distance.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on September 12, 2019, 05:39:21 PM
He's noticeably tightened up during this series to be fair, defence looks far better now. Went to the last test and he actually looked our most comfortable bat by a distance.

Should be captain. Will free up Root and as keeper his place will always be guaranteed
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on September 12, 2019, 05:40:17 PM
Butler and Leach (http://custombats.co.uk/cbforum/Themes/mobile20/images/post/thumbup.gif)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 12, 2019, 06:05:12 PM
Since his recall last summer, only Root has made more Test runs for England than Butler.  He would be my captain and keeper for the winter tours
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 12, 2019, 06:32:20 PM
Canít think of a worse description of Ďluxury playerí for Butler than in the last 12 months, heís the complete opposite of luxury how he has knuckled down when we needed him.

Luxury player would apply to those being carried who donít contribute enough.

Donít want to sound like a broken record but England will have to choose between Butler and Baistow to get a specialist batsman in.

Donít even think itís a close call between the 2 myself over the last 12-18 months of test cricket.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on September 12, 2019, 06:36:14 PM
You do realise Curran is a white ball hitter right ?? Heís simply never a test batter irrespective how much heís bull crapped up as the next great hope

Ive never bought into the Curran hype personally, hes done well in the chances hes been given but has done nothing to indicate hes going to be a mainstay of the team. My issue was more the entire approach he took to his innings. He seemed to have decided to hit out or get out from ball one which is taking the piss from someone who is in the side as an all rounder batting at 7. Butler is also a white ball hitter and he at least made an effort to construct and innings by choosing the balls he would go after
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 12, 2019, 06:46:45 PM
If they have to choose between Buttler and Bairstow then it's inevitably the latter who probably moves for Foakes. I would still like more from Buttler, even with 'only Root got more runs than him last year' I'd still like him to crack on and get a few tons here and there; 1 in 62 innings with 14 50s seems a bit tame. Granted he has to bat with the tail a lot of the time, but as per today's innings he's more than capable of doing it; just seems to have Root's problem of 50 then failing to convert.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 12, 2019, 06:54:43 PM
I rate Buttler higher than Bairstow but I have no vote in the matter :).

Something that Sky was showing at the end of the day where they interviewed Buttler, one of the stats that was thrown up was # of times batsmen have played 100 or more balls.  Buttler was number 2 with 9 and Kohli was 1 with 10 innings or something along those lines.  It would be interesting to see that stat for all of England batsmen compared to runs.  In my opinion, if you are going to drop Buttler, you need to drop Bairstow also.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 12, 2019, 07:01:11 PM
Canít think of a worse description of Ďluxury playerí for Butler than in the last 12 months, heís the complete opposite of luxury how he has knuckled down when we needed him.

Luxury player would apply to those being carried who donít contribute enough.

Donít want to sound like a broken record but England will have to choose between Butler and Baistow to get a specialist batsman in.

Donít even think itís a close call between the 2 myself over the last 12-18 months of test cricket.

If Butler is a luxury player, then we could do with finding a few more of them.

His record is good with the exception of the tests he has played against Australia. 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: brokenbat on September 12, 2019, 07:02:34 PM
The reason to make him captain is not because heís a genius tactician .. it is to enable Root to score.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 12, 2019, 07:49:03 PM
Random question, since I do not follow CC.

What happened to Northeast and Livingston as the next cab of the assembly line right around the A tour in WI last year?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 12, 2019, 08:10:16 PM
Northeast has had a decent summer. He's scored 3 hundreds and 5 fifties, and is currently third leading run scorer in Div 1 of the Championship with 930 at 54.7 (Sibley - 1,000 at 55.55 and Ballance - 969 at 51.0 are first & second)

Livingstone hasn't had such a great time of it in Div 2, 437 runs at 43.7
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 12, 2019, 11:12:48 PM
Random question, since I do not follow CC.

What happened to Northeast and Livingston as the next cab of the assembly line right around the A tour in WI last year?

Livingstone had a torrid year in 2018 having taken on the captaincy at Lancs and was part of batting unit than got the Club relegated to Div 2 despite a very strong bowling unit. 

Having stepped down as captain for 2019, he has had a stronger year.  His average is good but having missed the start of the season due to the IPL and a section mid-season with injury, he hasn't played enough games for a big return of runs.

Overall, he is better suited in my view to white ball cricket, but there aren't a lot of players around in England with a FC average over 40 right now.  England are desperately short of guys to bat in the top 3 though and Livingstone isn't equipped for that role.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 13, 2019, 08:51:07 AM
there aren't a lot of players around in England with a FC average over 40 right now.

A lazy look at the stats and there are 14 and 28 in Division 2.
These numbers do not take into account overseas players or those who have retired from international cricket. The actual number available for England to pick will naturally be a lot lower.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on September 13, 2019, 09:46:49 AM
The 3 spot is easily the biggest problem - the only potential county candidate that bats there normally is Ballance. So if Root moves it means batting someone out of position. Old school test option and pick three openers? Or take a leaf out of the odi side's book and just shove Sam Billings in there!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 13, 2019, 10:20:51 AM
A lazy look at the stats and there are 14 and 28 in Division 2.
These numbers do not take into account overseas players or those who have retired from international cricket. The actual number available for England to pick will naturally be a lot lower.

I should have been clearer that i meant a career average over 40 rather than in an individual season
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 13, 2019, 10:26:16 AM
I should have been clearer that i meant a career average over 40 rather than in an individual season

Sorry, my bad.
I was short sightedly thinking of this season only and who could be going to New Zealand on the back of a good season haha
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 10:30:57 AM
All out for 294 is yuck
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 10:45:28 AM
Good review, but that did not look out
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 13, 2019, 10:52:26 AM
Got to love the consistency in this ashes, England at least 100 light with the bat and Warner out cheaply!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 11:06:08 AM
Bad openers are bad
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 13, 2019, 12:02:03 PM
The 3 spot is easily the biggest problem - the only potential county candidate that bats there normally is Ballance. So if Root moves it means batting someone out of position. Old school test option and pick three openers? Or take a leaf out of the odi side's book and just shove Sam Billings in there!

As we haven't got an obvious 3 I'd be asking Denly to do it as a stop gap or trying Balance again, then Root can move to 4. After that we've got lots of options of Pope, Stokes, Bairstow, Butler etc. Not sure we've got that many openers to ask to bat 3!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 13, 2019, 12:20:20 PM
As we haven't got an obvious 3 I'd be asking Denly to do it as a stop gap or trying Balance again, then Root can move to 4. After that we've got lots of options of Pope, Stokes, Bairstow, Butler etc. Not sure we've got that many openers to ask to bat 3!

yes me too, a bit of experience for the next 12 months maybe is what we need if a new opener(sibley) comes in for the tours

I think much as some of us, well me, think Root should bat 3 im now of the opinion he should bat where he is comfortable, and that's 4 and batting him 3 has not really worked.

hes going to continue as Captain so he needs as much space to think as he can get.....

(I actually think he should skip new Zealand and have a rest)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 01:10:51 PM
ECB need to open a research department for the next series on how to try and get Smith out; only way they're gonna get close to competing
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 01:14:16 PM
Ouchie
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 13, 2019, 01:15:09 PM
The flex and then wobble on Labuschagne arm than in the hd slow mo reply was eerrrggggg
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on September 13, 2019, 01:25:20 PM
As we haven't got an obvious 3 I'd be asking Denly to do it as a stop gap or trying Balance again, then Root can move to 4. After that we've got lots of options of Pope, Stokes, Bairstow, Butler etc. Not sure we've got that many openers to ask to bat 3!
I'd probably lean towards Ballance myself, at least we know he has the capacity to score big runs if he can get in. Beyond that it would just be choosing who to throw under the bus! Think a big problem in this series has been our celebrated lower-middle order has been rubbish! Apart from Stokes, noone else has played a really significant innings. Can't see how we can keep Buttler and Bairstow in the same side, opposite problems in that Buttler is performing ok and improving but has struggled to play the big innings (not entirely his fault tbf), whereas Bairstow at least has proved he can get the tons but is going backwards faster by the series. Got to find space for Pope somewhere imo, it's been a long time since England had someone in the number 6 'promising apprentice' type spot (Bell?). Sort the top 3 out, hopefully get the best from Root at 4, get Pope in then the rest of the order gets easier, it's just about choosing a keeper.

More on the topic of this match, it's depressing how predictable it's getting by this point! England struggle to an average score, openers go early, Labuschange and Smith bat comfortably, Archer gets overbowled and Woakes hardly bowls.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 01:31:59 PM
Jofraaaaaaaa
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 13, 2019, 01:41:10 PM
Woakes has been (No Swearing Please) since the Ireland match
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 13, 2019, 01:45:20 PM
As funny as the old keeper pretending to take the ball trick is to make batsman panic, would it not fall under the new rules about deliberate distraction or deception of a batsman?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 03:27:45 PM
That was Classic Mitch Marsh
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 03:31:07 PM
And a very, very bad drop from Root
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 03:47:02 PM
Really wish we'd have seen Curran earlier on in the series
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 13, 2019, 03:48:32 PM
that was a great spell to paine! only ending one way

that root drop was costly but it was absolutely flying
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 03:49:59 PM
AND A BEAUTY

How did Overton get in at OT over him
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 13, 2019, 03:52:52 PM
AND A BEAUTY

How did Overton get in at OT over him

Agreed.  That was a truly dreadful selection call on England's part
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: edge on September 13, 2019, 03:55:53 PM
You know how every so often you and all your clubmates end up in the bar after the game having a chat along the lines of 'how did that bloke get us all out today'? I imagine that's how international teams feel after playing against Sam Curran.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on September 13, 2019, 04:02:55 PM
And a very, very bad drop from Root

Very bad? Costly yes, but it wasn't an easy one. Don't think it helped that Stokes started going for it either and Smith went at it too.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mo_town on September 13, 2019, 04:07:00 PM
One good spell and Sam Curran is a world class player again. Lets be honest, he is an average test cricketer.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 04:27:07 PM
Hoorah for Chris Woakes
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: LEACHY48 on September 13, 2019, 04:36:49 PM
One good spell and Sam Curran is a world class player again. Lets be honest, he is an average test cricketer.

He's young and a good test cricketer and will only get better. Probably no good outside of England yet but in home conditions he's a very good bowler
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 04:49:32 PM
This is some trash to the tail though, typical after getting their best player out
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 05:04:06 PM
Glad they brought Archer back on, absolute talent. That catch from Burns was Stokesy at Trent Bridge esque
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 13, 2019, 05:04:48 PM
6 for Jofra.

Good knuckle ball and a cracking catch from burns.

Iíll dmit I thought it was stokes as it went in there!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 13, 2019, 05:17:50 PM
3 balls of heat from Cummins to start.


Not one Aussie seemed itnersted burns took that to the grill and Cummins went back to his mark.

I wonder if this will be as  a big a deal as when archer hit smith? Probably not.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 13, 2019, 05:49:38 PM
Well played England.  Now please do not crash and burn tomorrow.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 13, 2019, 06:58:25 PM
This is from Ed Smith in the FT

Quote
His take on the difficulties opening stood out to me:

Many pundits believe that Englandís top-order batsmen have failed against Australia because they couldnít transition from the big hitting of one-day matches to slower Test cricket. Smith is sceptical. He allows that the ďincredibly challengingĒ schedule may partly explain some batting failures. However, he emphasises another, largely overlooked factor: ďThe game has changed due to drainage,Ē he says.

Modern drains, he explains, mean pitches now dry unprecedentedly fast. That raises the risk of excessive dryness over a five-day Test, during which the ground staff arenít allowed to water. Some ground staff therefore retain moisture in the pitch before the match. So the pitch can start green, which helps bowlers move the ball wickedly off the seam. Then the pitch dries out anyway, and becomes difficult in other ways. The consequence: top-order batting has got harder across five-day matches in England in recent seasons. None of the three men who opened the Australian batting in the first four Ashes Tests has averaged more than 11 this series.

Englandís data analysts try to quantify the difficulty of a batsmanís innings by adjusting for the opponents and the context of the match. They calculate each playerís weighted batting average ó as opposed to the headline averages that misled some past selectors.

Smith says: ďComing into the fourth Test, Joe Denly had a headline Test average of 24, and his weighted average is 46. Thatís how hard itís been out there.Ē

Drainage is the problem, lads. Drainage.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 13, 2019, 07:21:05 PM
Wonder what Smiths adjusted average is...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: A-Swing-And-A-Miss on September 13, 2019, 07:31:32 PM
This is from Ed Smith in the FT

Drainage is the problem, lads. Drainage.

I do think he may be on to something. I know Cook said that his last few years opening in England were the toughest he ever dealt with.

Combine the challenges presented by these modern variable pitches with a wave of genuinely high class Fast bowlers that has developed across the world and you've got a real test for opening batsmen.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 13, 2019, 07:51:16 PM
Surely all the more reason not to pick a white ball dasher to open the batting?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 13, 2019, 07:58:40 PM
Iím not sure the fast bowling is actually better now than it was a few years ago but def think Smith has a point and itís worth considering.

Thatís why I mostly stick up for openers in my comments, Denly especially as he has moved up to do a difficult job.

If you look at our openers compared to the Aussies we have done very well. Burns I think is a real find, the coaching manual has been torn up and he has proved he has real grit and stickability.

Not sure where that leaves Jason Roy, he had a hard job to do and a very good bowling attack to face.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 13, 2019, 08:07:04 PM
I think it leaves him an a very good international white ball opener, and a middling county middle order red ball player.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on September 13, 2019, 08:10:06 PM
I'd buy the argument if we were adjusting a run or three but...

... Is it really harder than an uncovered pitch in the 60s, or a hooping 70s ball? Are Cummins and Hazelwood really better than Marshall and Ambrose, Roberts and Holding, Wasim and Waqar, Donald, De Villiers and Pollock, McGrath and Gillespie and so on?

I watched a fair amount of cricket over that period (apart from Roberts) and there is no competition. The likes of Gooch and Atherton didn't repeatedly nick off on sixth stump or get done through the gate. To quote a couple of names off the top of my head, I reckon we'd kill to have Marty. Moxon and Wayne Larkins now. Or Bill Athey, Rob Key, Tim Robinson...
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 13, 2019, 08:19:39 PM
I think it leaves him an a very good international white ball opener, and a middling county middle order red ball player.

Yes but I suppose if he is/was going to have an impact itís now a question of if he deserves more chances in the middle order.

This is the problem when players move down and not up, canít disagree opening in five day cricket is a specialist position.

In my ideal top 7 he does not get in, I would keep Denly(3) and jettison Baistow. Pope would be in or in the squad.

Your point I think is our middle order is too crowded and totally agree.

Roy has an attacking game first, defence second...you canít suceed that way round unless you are exceptional.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 13, 2019, 09:15:14 PM
I have been unimpressed with the pitches we have prepared this summer and the way we have thrown away home advantage both against Ireland and Australia, but I do sympathise with the way the drainage systems suck moisture from the square. 

This Oval pitch had enough moisture in it on day one to convince Tim Paine to bowl first but by the end of day two it is starting to dust over.

I am sure that a solution to seal off the square so that it retains moisture will be divised, but until then it is in our best interests to prepare wickets with moisture in them and so opening the batting in this country will remain difficult
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Calzehbhoy on September 14, 2019, 11:47:08 AM
Denly is never going to get a better chance to score a ton and book himself on the winter tours.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on September 14, 2019, 12:12:37 PM
Its good to see Denly fighting hard for his place, im still not sold on him as an opener but maybe he will figure it out 
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on September 14, 2019, 03:32:57 PM
So close to a 100 for Denly. I reckon he has done enough to get another run on the next tour
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 14, 2019, 03:34:43 PM
No, Joe 
That's the most upset I've been to see someone dismissed in the 90s since Jack Leach! :(
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 14, 2019, 06:22:12 PM
England well ahead and only two outcomes possible either England win or itís a draw.  The only way Australia wins is if other batsmen in top 6 step up especially the openers.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 14, 2019, 06:36:04 PM
Time to put Bairstow out of his misery. 69 Tests, averaging 35 with just 6 centuries. It's quite clear he's not going to improve.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 14, 2019, 07:22:06 PM
Thought Denly was exceptional today, fair play to him. Seemed to put that big drive away for once and just took his time, although enjoyed the way he took on Lyon early in the day. Kudos to Stokes too, maybe Buttler too but he got out quite cheaply. Smith's catch to get Woakes was great. Suspect we've more than enough, but would like to see us get over 400 to put the nail in the coffin.

Really hope that's the last we see of Bairstow for some time from the test side, that being said it's all set up for him to have a strop in front of the press; nobody to blame but himself. I know Foakes has had a poor season, but I'm still of the opinion he was unfairly dropped in the first place just to accomodate Bairstow.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 14, 2019, 07:34:07 PM
@rickjames Buttler made 47, is just shy of waving your bat considered "quite cheaply" now? ???
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 14, 2019, 07:48:25 PM
@rickjames Buttler made 47, is just shy of waving your bat considered "quite cheaply" now? ???

Some of the shots he played were very good and it was fun to watch, but I don't think he needed to play the shot he did; granted with the lead we have he had a bit of license, but he kinda fell hook line sinker for it.

Also Leach should be in ahead of both Archer and Broad
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 14, 2019, 07:53:28 PM
Butler has been solid for us for 12 months, reading him described as a luxury player on here is just mind boggling.

Denly seriously pleased for him, I know his selection has split us armchair selectors but heís done pretty well. Initially probably a temporary stop gap but Iím not sure he is anymore. If Root goes back to 4 long term, Denly could bat 3 with a new opener in place, gives a bit of experience ahead of Root.

Bairstow as @rickjames mentions may be heading for some karma, toys out when Foakes took the gloves and clearly he wants two positions in the team. Heís got to go, may not be Foakes that replaces him but Butler. Cannot see how Bairstow is a better keeper and over 12-18  months heís not a better batsman than Butler..who is the ultimate Ďwhite ball bifferí Turned into intelligent lower order batsman in tests.

Pope should be in the squad for the winter with Bairstow gone and probably Roy leaving gaps to pick Sibley and Pope.

I think myself Bairstow and Roy should just be short format players.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 14, 2019, 07:57:59 PM
Not that I think it's a smart move right now and the focus should be on his batting, but if they really wanted to invest in Pope long term you could gradually work him in as a keeper-batsman; filled in admirably at Surrey when he's had to, but again, shoehorning might not be great idea
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 14, 2019, 07:59:19 PM
Some of the shots he played were very good and it was fun to watch, but I don't think he needed to play the shot he did; granted with the lead we have he had a bit of license, but he kinda fell hook line sinker for it.

Did you actually watch the game?
It looked as if Buttler was actually trying to play a "dab pull" into the gap for a single, but got a top edge. It's kinda harsh to say a mistimed shot was falling "hook line sinker for it"
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 14, 2019, 08:09:55 PM
Did I watch the game? I was bloody there! Woakes had just gone, just don't think he really needed to play the shot at all, man was out there ready and waiting
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 14, 2019, 08:34:07 PM
Did I watch the game? I was bloody there! Woakes had just gone, just don't think he really needed to play the shot at all, man was out there ready and waiting

And pulled off the second best catch of the game,

Should have spent less time in the bar! Butler hardly fell for the trap

Cam is right he top edge a dab pull
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 14, 2019, 08:39:25 PM
Didn't leave my seat all day thanks; I still stand by my opinion, and you can all have yours. Hey ho.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 14, 2019, 09:32:13 PM
Didn't leave my seat all day thanks; I still stand by my opinion, and you can all have yours. Hey ho.

Strong bladder?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 14, 2019, 09:33:25 PM
I think Harris has been off the field all day today, will he be allowed to open tomorrow?  If not who opens for Aus?  Would it be Wade?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 14, 2019, 09:34:34 PM
Strong bladder?

Pretty much
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 14, 2019, 11:52:17 PM
I think Harris has been off the field all day today, will he be allowed to open tomorrow?  If not who opens for Aus?  Would it be Wade?
Harris can still open he suffered the injury on the field. Seems likely he'll open though, he had stitches and his mitt was heavily bandaged.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on September 15, 2019, 02:05:50 AM
England well ahead and only two outcomes possible either England win or itís a draw.  The only way Australia wins is if other batsmen in top 6 step up especially the openers.

With Smith in the form he is I wouldn't write off an Aussie win
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 15, 2019, 10:07:19 AM
Paine got a review right!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 15, 2019, 10:58:21 AM
Marcus Harris finishes the series with 58 runs at 9.66.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 15, 2019, 11:01:13 AM
And Broad ends his bunny stranglehold
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 15, 2019, 11:18:36 AM
Well worth dropping Bancroft for Harris this series........lol.


What happened to renshaw and burns??
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 15, 2019, 11:32:49 AM
Burns had/has some sort of virus doesnít he?

Renshaw just had a terrible Aussie summer.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 15, 2019, 11:35:29 AM
Burns had/has some sort of virus doesnít he?

Renshaw just had a terrible Aussie summer.

As terrible as Warner/Harris/Bancroft have had an English summer?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 15, 2019, 11:37:42 AM
He was excellent at Somerset last year, can't recall his numbers during his short stint at Kent this season.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 15, 2019, 11:45:53 AM
That was cracking to get Labuschagne
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 15, 2019, 01:07:30 PM
So, that's how you get Smith out?
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on September 15, 2019, 01:11:22 PM
Beggars belief really.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 15, 2019, 01:17:06 PM
Maybe 2020 is the year leg slip becomes a fashionable thing again
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: InternalTraining on September 15, 2019, 02:18:06 PM
AUS in trouble.

Great Test match!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on September 15, 2019, 02:21:04 PM
He was excellent at Somerset last year, can't recall his numbers during his short stint at Kent this season.

Did nothing really for Kent early season. 3 matches, 6 innings, 118 runs at 23 with top score of 48* so pretty poor even for England early season
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Kulli on September 15, 2019, 02:35:13 PM
As terrible as Warner/Harris/Bancroft have had an English summer?
donít think so, but they all had better winters than him.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 15, 2019, 05:04:13 PM
Decent knock from Wade
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 15, 2019, 05:12:34 PM
Boooooommmmm


This poor England side has drawn this test series!! Haha.


Worse thing is itíll probably mean no foakes, Pope to Sibley for winter.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 15, 2019, 05:15:55 PM
All over now changed my view slightly this test did matter but the ashes are gone for another two years.

The Aussies I think deserved to retain the urn with a better bowling attack (just about) and the phenomenal Smith who won over a lot of the crowds here.

I hope England can move forward by having slightly less allrounders and squeeze in some young batsmen.

And broad proved the doubters wrong!  :)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: mr_reagan on September 15, 2019, 05:16:19 PM
not gonna lie i was worried for a second
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 15, 2019, 05:17:53 PM
Scarily.......

Had we not had rain in the drawn test match, we would have gone on to win that and won 3-2........

This side will think there doing alright at test cricket and carry on regardless. Doh.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 15, 2019, 05:19:38 PM
England won and tied the series, they'll be declared class again soon!

Just waiting for someone to claim they'd have won the Ashes if it hadn't rained at Lord's...

Edit, someone already has!
Scarily.......

Had we not had rain in the drawn test match, we would have gone on to win that and won 3-2........

This side will think there doing alright at test cricket and carry on regardless. Doh.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 15, 2019, 05:26:11 PM
Haha quality!! Iíd like to think England will think carefully on a couple of places.
Donít need a butchers knife just a scalpel
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: rickjames on September 15, 2019, 05:30:57 PM
Fair result, really and both teams got what they deserved over the English summer. They'll both rue chances to have put the games at Edgbaston at 122-8 and Headingley with 1 wicket to win away.

Looking forward to a bit of an overhaul to address the balance between test and LOI sides as well as a few players here and there being moved on.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: smilley792 on September 15, 2019, 05:31:49 PM
England won and tied the series, they'll be declared class again soon!

Just waiting for someone to claim they'd have won the Ashes if it hadn't rained at Lord's...

Edit, someone already has!

Stole the post from some dude named Cameron elsewhere......
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on September 15, 2019, 05:33:38 PM
How is Jofra man of the match, based on the first innings alone?!
It should have been Leach!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 15, 2019, 05:34:55 PM
Leach is doing it for us that bat in glasses

Love the bloke
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on September 15, 2019, 07:03:22 PM
I think a drawn series is a fair result. Englandís batsmen improved slightly as the series went on with Burns proving a good selection and should now get a long run opening. Denly seemed to find his feet and got better and better as series went on without making a Ton but certainly has played his part in our 2 test wins this series. Stokes was superb just seems to be getting a bit injury prone in the bowling department.
Broad, Archer and Leech did superb jobs and other bowling options did there job ok.

As for Australia smith was just world class, canít stand the bloke really but with a bat in hand he is far and away a great of the same. Wade big or nothing and labu (however you spell his name) did very well a bit like Denly without the big score he probably deserved. Rest of Aussie batters just shocking, Paine as captain well jury well and truly out on that, as a batsmen no where near good enough at this level but keeping is tidy enough.
Cummins & Hazelwood again world class and well supported. Lyon started well but did nothing really except a few handy lower end batting partnerships.

Interesting to see the squads for both sides next series. Personally as has been said a couple of small changes for me. Bairstow dropped and either stick Butler with the gloves and play a middle order batter (pope or Northeast) or drop bairstow and Butler for Foakes and another middle order batsmen (NOT ANOTHER ALLROUNDER)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on September 15, 2019, 07:37:41 PM
Well summed up, interesting some of the commentators I was listening to today had butler keeping for the winter(a few of us want Foakes but that prob won't happen) and Bairstow out making a spot at number 5 or 6 for a specialist bat.

The point being made was its easier to start someone in the middle order to help adjust to the higher level.

Hugely agree with this and I think Northeast is a high class player but the most talented young batsman in the country is Pope by quite a long way.

Specialist opener yes we still need but there does not need to be big changes. I think Roy probably should give way unfortunately not everyone can bat 5- we got to stick with the best young player.

Denly at 3 for me helps the side, has experience and I think Root will revert to 4 where he wants to bat.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on September 15, 2019, 08:28:07 PM
Interesting, isn't it? I suspect those talking about Lords are semi joking, but it's not daft to say England were 90 minutes less rain from the Ashes. Yet no one could credibly dispute that Australia were the dominant side.

I'm genuinely not sure what to make of that fact. Was it as simple as that Smith was the difference? I don't think it's that simple, because there were other exceptional performances, not least from Pat Cummins, who bowled longer and better than a man with his injury history has any right to.

Ho hum.

So, England. Lots of questions for the new coach to resolve, first of which has to be, what are England trying to achieve. Bayliss was a one day specialist who did well in one day cricket. We need a test man.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: A-Swing-And-A-Miss on September 15, 2019, 08:29:12 PM
I think a drawn series is a fair result. Englandís batsmen improved slightly as the series went on with Burns proving a good selection and should now get a long run opening. Denly seemed to find his feet and got better and better as series went on without making a Ton but certainly has played his part in our 2 test wins this series. Stokes was superb just seems to be getting a bit injury prone in the bowling department.
Broad, Archer and Leech did superb jobs and other bowling options did there job ok.

As for Australia smith was just world class, canít stand the bloke really but with a bat in hand he is far and away a great of the same. Wade big or nothing and labu (however you spell his name) did very well a bit like Denly without the big score he probably deserved. Rest of Aussie batters just shocking, Paine as captain well jury well and truly out on that, as a batsmen no where near good enough at this level but keeping is tidy enough.
Cummins & Hazelwood again world class and well supported. Lyon started well but did nothing really except a few handy lower end batting partnerships.

Interesting to see the squads for both sides next series. Personally as has been said a couple of small changes for me. Bairstow dropped and either stick Butler with the gloves and play a middle order batter (pope or Northeast) or drop bairstow and Butler for Foakes and another middle order batsmen (NOT ANOTHER ALLROUNDER)

Interesting that you suggest dropping Buttler. Since his return to the team last year he's the 2nd highest run scorer(just 15 runs behind Root) with the fourth highest average(Behind Stokes, Foakes and Cook).

Sibley, Burns, Denly, Root, Stokes, Pope, Buttler(WK), Archer, Leach, Broad, Anderson or
Denly, Burns, Root, Stokes, Buttler, Pope, Foakes(WK), Archer, Leach, Broad, Anderson

Would be the teams I'd like to see for the winter, obviously relying on Anderson and Stokes being fully fit to bowl. Although it does give the team quite a long tail it's the best bowling line up we have to bowl teams out and win games of cricket. I suppose Ali might be able to squeeze in ahead of Leach if he finds some red ball form.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Manormanic on September 15, 2019, 08:33:28 PM
Well summed up, interesting some of the commentators I was listening to today had butler keeping for the winter(a few of us want Foakes but that prob won't happen) and Bairstow out making a spot at number 5 or 6 for a specialist bat.

It's tricky, isn't it? There is probably only space for one of Bairstow, Buttler and Foakes in a balanced side, unless Bairstow hypothetically returns to three which won't be happening.

Foakes is the best keeper, followed by his shadow, but there seems to be a suspicion that top level quicks will work him out. If he's not a consideration, you're choosing between the specialist bat, Bairstow, who is now much the better glove man, and the specialist keeper, Buttler, who may not be the better bat per se but might add more.

Not a choice anyone can win at.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SD on September 15, 2019, 09:19:48 PM
I can't see England making any substantial changes in the short term because:

1. This side isn't nearly as bad as some have made out.  Australia retained the Ashes on the back of one of the best individual series performances in the history of the game from Steve Smith and being saved by the rain at Lord's.
2. The isn't a large pool of players in the CC putting forward in inarguable case that they are better than what is currently there.

The one obvious change for me is to drop Bairstow with Butler taking the gloves at 7 and Pope coming in at 5/6.  Denly and Burns have done enough to warrant more time although both averaging high 20s will need to be improved on.  I would have root at 4 and Sibley in to open.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Mister Le Chiffre on September 15, 2019, 09:24:43 PM
Bairstow should be axed. Not even up for debate. Pathetic with the bat averaging 20 suggests he's more a tailender than a batsman. Buttler as the keeper. Pope at 6 - boys averaging 60 in FC and he's a not a crybaby like Bairstow
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on September 15, 2019, 10:16:56 PM
Interesting that you suggest dropping Buttler. Since his return to the team last year he's the 2nd highest run scorer(just 15 runs behind Root) with the fourth highest average(Behind Stokes, Foakes and Cook).

Sibley, Burns, Denly, Root, Stokes, Pope, Buttler(WK), Archer, Leach, Broad, Anderson or
Denly, Burns, Root, Stokes, Buttler, Pope, Foakes(WK), Archer, Leach, Broad, Anderson

Would be the teams I'd like to see for the winter, obviously relying on Anderson and Stokes being fully fit to bowl. Although it does give the team quite a long tail it's the best bowling line up we have to bowl teams out and win games of cricket. I suppose Ali might be able to squeeze in ahead of Leach if he finds some red ball form.

Foakes was man of the series and highest run scorer on his last tour and was dropped. I would suggest dropping Butler for a better balanced side and no other reason. Of course that relies on someone coming in and doing better than he has but as you pointed out one of those 3 whom have a better batting average is the best wicket keeper in the country so in someways thatís answers the choice. However we all know that wonít happen in all probability as YJB must have some serious dirt on someone to have kept his place. Not just for his below par performances but also for the way he handled the whole Foakes situation and his public outburst.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: HellomynameisJ on September 15, 2019, 11:09:10 PM
Disappointing way to end the series for Aus,  the only thing they got right in that test was the selection of Marsh. 3 things that really stood out to me were the decision to bowl first, after backing themselves to bat first in far worse conditions through the tour, the selection of Peter Siddle after Starc played pretty well in the last test and gives Lyon footmarks to bowl into and just looks like he gels with hazelwood and Lyon better, and the retention or David Warner, there are some form slumps that can't be turned around, and Stuart Broad has become a specialist left hand remover, atleast Bancroft hung around a little bit, and Joe burns would be sitting at home shaking his head wondering how he was left out of the picture.

But the urn is coming home, and it has been an interesting series to watch, but I really am looking forward to a far healthier sleep routine!
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: Chompy9760 on September 16, 2019, 10:46:37 AM
How is Jofra man of the match, based on the first innings alone?!
It should have been Leach!

Marsh took more wickets than both of them, and made one less run than both of them put together!  M.O.M sometimes leaves me scratching my head..........

I think Paine was very good behind the stumps, but really had an ordinary series as captain.  His record on reviews was terrible at best.  Flipping a coin would give a better success rate!
I remember at the toss of the first test, when electing to bat he said something like "I'd rather be batting here on day one, than on day five", so its very hard to fathom why he chose to field in test#5, but perhaps it reflected his confidence in his openers!

There was a stat on the TV commentary where (I think) they said that it was the second lowest ever test average opening partnership across the summer (including AUS/ENG/IRE).  The bowling certainly was first class, and most top order batsmen were made to look second rate.

Pretty easy to be armchair experts with the beauty of hindsight. Any amount of "if's and buts" would have changed the series, but it's all in the history books now.

Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on September 16, 2019, 10:53:15 AM
Autralias highest opening partnership was 18

England's was 50 odd (we also had a 27 wooo!

the partnerahips for those were harris/warner and Burns/Denly

Id say on purely individual scores englands openers far outperformed autralias and thats including roy!!!

Australias 3/4 pair were miles ahead though
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 16, 2019, 02:40:14 PM
Congratulation to England for winning the test and Aussies in retain The Ashes.

The tests were played between two evenly matched bowling teams with flawed batting.  There were some brilliant individual performance on both side.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: shadowlight on September 16, 2019, 02:48:49 PM
His record on reviews was terrible at best.
I remember at the toss of the first test, when electing to bat he said something like "I'd rather be batting here on day one, than on day five", so its very hard to fathom why he chose to field in test#5, but perhaps it reflected his confidence in his openers!

Paine, needs to be better at reviews and he has come out and said he sucks at it and needs to improve.  As for batting, he might have seen the green and decided to bowl first.  I think the primary reason that Aus lost is not the bowling first but fielding and batting.  I think they had close to 6 or 7 dropped catches in the first innings and couple more in the second.  In the 5th test both Smith and Marnus (sorry cannot seem to spell Marnus's last name) had a bad innings but non of the other batsmen were able to string a partnership together.

For me the biggest disappointment was the Aussie opening pair, they barely lasted the first 10 over the whole series with both of them back in the pavilion.  At least England had one opener who got decent scores after Roy was dropped/moved to lower order.
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: jonny77 on April 11, 2020, 06:04:43 PM
Anyone been watching the Headingley test today on Skysports? My mate in Madrid was 😆 Feel free to share...

https://twitter.com/Scottcricketbat/status/1249031419843825665?s=19 (https://twitter.com/Scottcricketbat/status/1249031419843825665?s=19)

https://www.instagram.com/p/B-2Vnt2hh_T/?igshid=pfo8wrvou1wl (https://www.instagram.com/p/B-2Vnt2hh_T/?igshid=pfo8wrvou1wl)
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: ppccopener on April 17, 2020, 07:19:17 PM
Yes the replays of some old matches have been great. Presuming the test team plays in June or maybe July thru September how does the forum see the side developing?

I mention this because slightly surprisingly Moeen today says he is available for tests..
With Giles,Silverwood and Root all saying they want him back over the last year how,if at all, does he fit in?

Waiting to come back in also
Burns
Anderson
Title: Re: Englands Test Summer - IRE + AUS
Post by: alexhilly1492 on April 17, 2020, 07:26:35 PM
Burns Anderson and archer will all come back in
Burns at the top with Sibley, Crawley or denly to miss out on the 3 spot

Anderson for woakes archer and wood to rotate

For me mo needs to earn his spot, leach and bess have earnt the chance to fight for the spinner spot and deserve it moving forward