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General Cricket => Cricket Training, Fitness and Injuries => Topic started by: Jimbo on January 14, 2020, 11:41:56 PM

Title: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on January 14, 2020, 11:41:56 PM
As the title suggests, I'm debating making the switch this year due to a longstanding shoulder niggle which is exacerbated every season by about the 5th indoor net. Have found that turning my arm over doesn't have the same impact so keen to give it a go, even if only just at nets.

Has anyone else made the same switch, and if so any tips would be welcome?
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 15, 2020, 06:11:44 AM
think you will need to practice a lot, it might look easy, at good level batter love going at off spinners, putting a lot of pressure, therefore staying calm is the key
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: tuffers007 on January 15, 2020, 08:17:37 AM
Do it, but you will have to practice hard. turning the ball is the easy bit. putting it where it needs to go is the hardest part. practice practice practice!!
and please dont give up if you find it difficult after the first net (see this all too often with the youngsters)
Dont worry about getting hit by the batsmen, thats part of your new job!
good luck with it
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: HellomynameisJ on January 15, 2020, 08:45:04 AM
In my experience, almost anyone can be an offspin bowler, but it's very hard to be a good offspin bowler.

Here's what I think makes a good off spinner hard to face
1. accuracy
2. Subtle changes of pace
3. Changing position on the crease
4. Drift
5. Bowling to a plan

Also, don't be afraid to get hit for six
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 08:54:02 AM
In my experience, almost anyone can be an offspin bowler, but it's very hard to be a good offspin bowler.

Here's what I think makes a good off spinner hard to face
1. accuracy
2. Subtle changes of pace
3. Changing position on the crease
4. Drift
5. Bowling to a plan

Also, don't be afraid to get hit for six


I think this is kinda true. Its easy to be a bad spinner. Its hard to be a good spinner.

Offspin and legspin are equivalently hard, the difference is that a bad legspinner is bad in more obvious ways than a bad offspinner. Bad offspinners tend to just bowl the same vaguely unthreatening ball over and over. Bad legspinners are all over the place.

To be a good spinner you need:

a) to be able to get good revs on the ball
b) to be able to land it on a line and length 5 ball out of 6
c) to be able to bowl at a decent enough pace that batsmen can't wander down the wicket and hit everything on the full toss, or camp on the back foot and play you off the pitch
d) to have at least 1, preferably 2, decent variations - either change the direction of spin or mix in some topspin or backspin.
e) to develop a reasonable understanding of tactics - setting the field, reading the batsman, making the necessary adjustments

Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on January 15, 2020, 10:17:43 AM
I think this is kinda true. Its easy to be a bad spinner. Its hard to be a good spinner.

Offspin and legspin are equivalently hard, the difference is that a bad legspinner is bad in more obvious ways than a bad offspinner. Bad offspinners tend to just bowl the same vaguely unthreatening ball over and over. Bad legspinners are all over the place.

To be a good spinner you need:

a) to be able to get good revs on the ball
b) to be able to land it on a line and length 5 ball out of 6
c) to be able to bowl at a decent enough pace that batsmen can't wander down the wicket and hit everything on the full toss, or camp on the back foot and play you off the pitch
d) to have at least 1, preferably 2, decent variations - either change the direction of spin or mix in some topspin or backspin.
e) to develop a reasonable understanding of tactics - setting the field, reading the batsman, making the necessary adjustments

I'll be controversial (unlike me) and say I don't think all those things are necessarily needed to be a good spinner.

a) Getting good revs on the ball is a bonus rather than a necessity I'd say.
b) Consistency is the key. Landing the ball on a good line and length most deliveries is more important than "turn".
c) I kind of agree here, there's no magic pace you have to bowl at though. Everyone has to discover "their pace" by just bowling.
d) variations aren't necessarily key (you don't need to develop a flipper, slider, doosra or Jeff straight away). You can get some natural variation by changing how far back you bowl from (the 24 yard ball is your friend) or how close you get to the stumps. Subtle changes in pace work too. You can have one delivery that you bowl from different "angles" and be just as effective as the guy with 38 different deliveries!
e) This comes with experience and practice.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on January 15, 2020, 11:13:54 AM
From experience this is very hard. I don’t bowl much these days mainly due to my keeping moving on at a rate of knots over the years as that’s what I really wanted to do. But I spent a lot of time as a 2nd 3rd change bowler because I bowled medium pace and very tidy line and length and had an economy of about 2 mainly bowling in middle overs. This took me years from a young boy to do.
Now tying to switch to a spinner or slow bowler as I don’t spin it much is a lot harder and I find that my economy is a lot higher so there for I’m not much use to the team in hat regard. It’s also better for the batters I bowl to for my to walk up and bowl with the same medium pace action but reduce the stress one body that throw down pies which they don’t get in a game situation.

So basically my view is if you want to change then fine but it will take a long time in my view to become half as good as you have been as a medium pace bowler and will you be the same asset to the team
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 11:59:35 AM
I'll be controversial (unlike me) and say I don't think all those things are necessarily needed to be a good spinner.

a) Getting good revs on the ball is a bonus rather than a necessity I'd say.
b) Consistency is the key. Landing the ball on a good line and length most deliveries is more important than "turn".
c) I kind of agree here, there's no magic pace you have to bowl at though. Everyone has to discover "their pace" by just bowling.
d) variations aren't necessarily key (you don't need to develop a flipper, slider, doosra or Jeff straight away). You can get some natural variation by changing how far back you bowl from (the 24 yard ball is your friend) or how close you get to the stumps. Subtle changes in pace work too. You can have one delivery that you bowl from different "angles" and be just as effective as the guy with 38 different deliveries!
e) This comes with experience and practice.


If you don't get revs, you don't have drift, you don't have dip, you don't have turn. There's absolutely nothing to worry a batsman at all. Any halfway competent batsman is just going to take you to the cleaners from any length.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Kulli on January 15, 2020, 12:00:22 PM
I’d say it depends hugely on the level you play at, or want to play at.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: jamesisapayne on January 15, 2020, 12:03:45 PM
I'll be controversial (unlike me) and say I don't think all those things are necessarily needed to be a good spinner.

a) Getting good revs on the ball is a bonus rather than a necessity I'd say.
b) Consistency is the key. Landing the ball on a good line and length most deliveries is more important than "turn".

Not for me - accuracy without turn is much easier to play. A spinner who turn it a lot but bowls a lot of loose deliveries is always more likely to get a wicket from my experience keeping and batting - Getting the skipper to keep you on however is a different matter!

I think Shane Warne said spin it as hard as you can first, accuracy will come later as it's harder to progress the other way round. If it's good enough for him it's good enough for me.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on January 15, 2020, 12:09:11 PM
I’d say it depends hugely on the level you play at, or want to play at.

Not a particularly high level and no real aspiration to play at a higher level as I know my limitations as a cricketer!
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on January 15, 2020, 12:17:48 PM
If you don't get revs, you don't have drift, you don't have dip, you don't have turn. There's absolutely nothing to worry a batsman at all. Any halfway competent batsman is just going to take you to the cleaners from any length.

My clubs all time leading wicket taker is a "leg spinner" who confesses himself he couldn't turn a doorknob, let alone a leg break!

He must've been lucky to come up against 670 totally incompetent batsman down the years...
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: edge on January 15, 2020, 12:28:12 PM
Something I've been half considering lately - I started out as a pace bowler who could hold a bat and have gradually swapped roles, which has sent my bowling downhill pretty sharply. Don't want to give up bowling, do I slow things down and trundle or try and bowl spin? Trouble being that my offpsin efforts, while fairly accurate, don't turn.

On the topic of turn, I'd say SLA has a point - if you're bowling against decent batsmen and can't beat them in the flight then it doesn't matter how accurate you are, if you don't turn it fairly sharply you'll get carted. If you're at a level where you're not worried about deceiving the batsmen and they'll frustrate themselves out, then accuracy will do. Wouldn't worry too much about variations either way though, leave that for later!
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 12:29:56 PM
My clubs all time leading wicket taker is a "leg spinner" who confesses himself he couldn't turn a doorknob, let alone a leg break!

He must've been lucky to come up against 670 totally incompetent batsman down the years...

In what sense is he a legspinner then?



Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on January 15, 2020, 12:36:11 PM
In what sense is he a legspinner then?

He has a short run up and tries to bowl leg breaks.
He's therefore not a seam bowler or an off spinner
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: LEACHY48 on January 15, 2020, 12:42:23 PM
He has a short run up and tries to bowl leg breaks.
He's therefore not a seam bowler or an off spinner

😂😂
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Buzz on January 15, 2020, 12:46:20 PM
In my experience, in most club cricket, the non turning slow bowler is the leading wicket taker.

People give their wickets away to pie chuckers every single week.

So in answer to the opening question.

Make sure you can bowl a length and can vary your line and pace a little. Try to turn it, but playing on the batsmen's ego will get you plenty of wickets.
If it turns great. If not it is always fun to pretend it is ripping and dipping. A new batter won't know.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Mfarank on January 15, 2020, 12:52:03 PM
I have been exactly there myself. Used to be a (left arm) medium pacer all through my childhood and school. During college, coach told me you're accurate and disciplined but just not fast enough to be threatening. So switch to finger spin. I did that. Here's the funny part though. It has been 12 years since then. And i can count on 1 hand the number of times i got one to spin away from a right handed batsman. For some reason it doesn't matter how many revs i try to put into it, it always skids on and sometimes even goes further in like a doosra. I get good drift too if the ball is in good shape. But mostly i find myself effectively because i try to keep it simple. Subtle changes in Angle of release, variation in flight and pace and reading the batsmen is how i outfox most of them.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on January 15, 2020, 12:54:31 PM
@SLA do you notice how every thread you contribute to ends up with you putting down everyone’s comments unless that happen to agree with you ( which seems to be very few and far between) and then what could have been a good topic of discussion and insight into others views ends up in the exact opposite. Now please just accept others views and contribute constructively or not at all.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Vulcan Cricket on January 15, 2020, 01:27:36 PM
I did it and found it easy tbf
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on January 15, 2020, 01:52:01 PM
@Vulcan Cricket I've never found any part of cricket very easy but glad there's hope yet!
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 02:10:25 PM
He has a short run up and tries to bowl leg breaks.
He's therefore not a seam bowler or an off spinner

So he tries to bowl legspin, but he fails? Or does he just not really try.

You're not making a very compelling case.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: alexhilly1492 on January 15, 2020, 02:11:45 PM
So he tries to bowl legspin, but he fails? Or does he just not really try.

You're not making a very compelling case.

short run up and a leggy action, to me thats leg spinner whether it turns or not....
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 02:12:55 PM
@SLA do you notice how every thread you contribute to ends up with you putting down everyone’s comments unless that happen to agree with you ( which seems to be very few and far between) and then what could have been a good topic of discussion and insight into others views ends up in the exact opposite. Now please just accept others views and contribute constructively or not at all.

I notice that this website is extremely argumentative, yes. People are unwilling to listen carefully, and simply attempt to beat you to death with their often wildly misinformed opinions.

I'm a specialist spin-bowling coach, you would think that on the topic of spin bowling, people MIGHT be willing to hear me out before rubbishing everything I say because "some bloke in their club" does it differently. But no.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 02:19:42 PM
In my experience, in most club cricket, the non turning slow bowler is the leading wicket taker.

People give their wickets away to pie chuckers every single week.

So in answer to the opening question.

Make sure you can bowl a length and can vary your line and pace a little. Try to turn it, but playing on the batsmen's ego will get you plenty of wickets.
If it turns great. If not it is always fun to pretend it is ripping and dipping. A new batter won't know.

Our leading club wicket taker is similar, although he would describe himself as "medium pace" (he bowls slower than the spinners)

Truth be told, he's the leading wicket taker by 20% because he's bowled the most overs by 50%. I expect this is the truth in most cases.

I've skippered him for several years, so I know when this type of bowling works and when it doesn't.

It tends to work when:

you're playing a very low standard, with very dodgy wickets, in longer-format games when batsmen get stuck in 2 minds.

It doesn't work: on flat pitches, against decent batsmen, or in T20s.


There's nothing wrong with bowling slow dobbers onto dodgy tracks. But don't confuse this with actual spin bowling.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: LEACHY48 on January 15, 2020, 03:07:00 PM
Our leading club wicket taker is similar, although he would describe himself as "medium pace" (he bowls slower than the spinners)

Truth be told, he's the leading wicket taker by 20% because he's bowled the most overs by 50%. I expect this is the truth in most cases.

I've skippered him for several years, so I know when this type of bowling works and when it doesn't.

It tends to work when:

you're playing a very low standard, with very dodgy wickets, in longer-format games when batsmen get stuck in 2 minds.

It doesn't work: on flat pitches, against decent batsmen, or in T20s.


There's nothing wrong with bowling slow dobbers onto dodgy tracks. But don't confuse this with actual spin bowling.

This is literally just semantics. You're claiming he doesn't bowl spin well and therefore isn't a spinner. Tell that to Michael yardy or Joe root. You'd think as a specialist spin bowling coach you'd recognise the value in someone bowling darts wicket to wicket with the threat of one turning as a variation especially in t20 cricket on a flat one.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Kulli on January 15, 2020, 03:17:15 PM
Not a particularly high level and no real aspiration to play at a higher level as I know my limitations as a cricketer!

If you can land 5 an over in a half decent area and have half a cricket brain you’ll go ok, and then build it up from there.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SOULMAN1012 on January 15, 2020, 03:22:10 PM
I notice that this website is extremely argumentative, yes. People are unwilling to listen carefully, and simply attempt to beat you to death with their often wildly misinformed opinions.

I'm a specialist spin-bowling coach, you would think that on the topic of spin bowling, people MIGHT be willing to hear me out before rubbishing everything I say because "some bloke in their club" does it differently. But no.

Personally i think people would be willing to listen if as you put it on your own words you didn't ‘’beat people to death with your own wild opinions’’. Your approach is very direct and argumentative in my opinion and if you put this approach to your coaching i.  Would really struggle to buy into your approach. Now this is just my view and you seem very passionate about what you say but just seems you may want to tone it down buddy
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on January 15, 2020, 03:27:19 PM
I notice that this website is extremely argumentative, yes. People are unwilling to listen carefully, and simply attempt to beat you to death with their often wildly misinformed opinions.

I'm a specialist spin-bowling coach, you would think that on the topic of spin bowling, people MIGHT be willing to hear me out before rubbishing everything I say because "some bloke in their club" does it differently. But no.

Have you thought maybe your combative posting style trying to shout down everyone else may be part of the issue? You say this website is extremely argumentative, but you're the one at the heart of most of the arguments!

As far as rubbishing everything you say who has actually done this? There has been some reasonable debate where people (myself included) have engaged in discussion where they have agreed with some aspects of your opinion, but shared a different viewpoint on other aspects (being a forum, this is exactly what a thread like this is for). You've then shot down the replies in an "I'm right because I'm a coach, you're wrong" manner.

Anyway, this is yet another thread that's gone wildly off course.

@Jimbo as someone who switched from medium pace to offies years go, if you need any help please feel free to PM me and I'm more than willing to help you out. It seems counter productive trying to reply to the thread now as answers get lost between the other back and forwards going on
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SD on January 15, 2020, 03:57:38 PM
If possible, I would suggest if you are working on this over winter nets, trying to bowl in a lane without a batsman.  Nets are a pretty unforgiving place for spinners, with batsmen able to play shots without the consequence of getting out.  Generally speaking i don't think that nets are the best place for any bowler to develop a new skill, let alone a new type of bowling.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 04:01:31 PM
This is literally just semantics. You're claiming he doesn't bowl spin well and therefore isn't a spinner. Tell that to Michael yardy or Joe root. You'd think as a specialist spin bowling coach you'd recognise the value in someone bowling darts wicket to wicket with the threat of one turning as a variation especially in t20 cricket on a flat one.

Just so I'm clear, are you claiming that Joe Root and Michael Yardy don't spin the ball?
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 15, 2020, 04:09:21 PM
In my experience, almost anyone can be an offspin bowler, but it's very hard to be a good offspin bowler.

Here's what I think makes a good off spinner hard to face
1. accuracy
2. Subtle changes of pace
3. Changing position on the crease
4. Drift
5. Bowling to a plan

Also, don't be afraid to get hit for six
Yep, totally agree
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 04:12:16 PM
short run up and a leggy action, to me thats leg spinner whether it turns or not....

Of course, its perfectly possible to have a short run up and then bowl seam up with a "leggy action".
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on January 15, 2020, 04:13:19 PM
@WalkingWicket37 Appreciate the offer mate, will bear it in mind once nets get underway!

@SD I take your point but otherwise it'll be getting on for the start of the season before I get much chance to work on it. Will see if I can nab myself an empty lane for 20 minutes or so at each net though.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: LEACHY48 on January 15, 2020, 04:21:45 PM
Just so I'm clear, are you claiming that Joe Root and Michael Yardy don't spin the ball?

Correct, root undercuts the ball and doesn't get much if any sideways movement, yardy was the same
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 04:29:14 PM
Correct, root undercuts the ball and doesn't get much if any sideways movement, yardy was the same

I'm terribly sorry but I think you're mistaken. To start with, you're confusing spin with turn. Just because a ball doesn't turn off the pitch, does not mean that you haven't spun it hard.

I suggest you watch some footage where the rev-counter was being used by Sky. Both Yardy and Root bowl with good revs and spin the ball harder than most amateur spinners. Root gets as many revs on the ball as any offspinner I've watched since Murali.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: alexhilly1492 on January 15, 2020, 04:48:35 PM
I'm terribly sorry but I think you're mistaken. To start with, you're confusing spin with turn. Just because a ball doesn't turn off the pitch, does not mean that you haven't spun it hard.

I suggest you watch some footage where the rev-counter was being used by Sky. Both Yardy and Root bowl with good revs and spin the ball harder than most amateur spinners. Root gets as many revs on the ball as any offspinner I've watched since Murali.

Hang on how are spin and turn not related?

to get turn you have to impart spin on the ball....
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Buzz on January 15, 2020, 04:54:11 PM
Hang on how are spin and turn not related?

to get turn you have to impart spin on the ball....
You can give the ball a massive rip and the ball doesn't turn for a number of reasons.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 04:56:08 PM
Hang on how are spin and turn not related?

to get turn you have to impart spin on the ball....

They're related, but they're not the same thing. Spin is what you do to the ball - its the number and direction of the revs. Spin can have 4 different effects: turn, bounce, drift and dip. I'd argue that they're each equally important.

You can't have turn without spin (unless the ball hits a stone), but you can have spin without turn. For example, a topspinner has a lot of spin, but it doesn't turn.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on January 15, 2020, 04:56:31 PM
@SLA I've just tried to send you a (rather long and thought out) PM but I got an "Unable to load page" after pressing send. Can you confirm if you received it or not please... :-[
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 04:59:12 PM
@SLA I've just tried to send you a (rather long and thought out) PM but I got an "Unable to load page" after pressing send. Can you confirm if you received it or not please... :-[

No! Sorry. Did you happen to save it anywhere before you lost it?

Maybe it will come through in a minute.

Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on January 15, 2020, 05:01:16 PM
I worried you'd say that!
No copy is in my sent box, guess I'll type it all out again...
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 15, 2020, 05:10:27 PM
I only try to really turn when I am sure that the wicket turning a lot.
Mostly I don't try to turn much, as long it's turns enough to put the batter in doubt, how much it's gonna turn, from there onwards I try variations of slower, faster and strait deliveries, in between a delivery which leaves the batter which is a bit faster one, fast yorkers and slow yorkers.
Last season I ended up bowling overs if the innings, what means average was 4 an hour, but still acceptable in the situations of the match, team mates appreciated, which feels good 🙂
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: sfa82 on January 15, 2020, 05:12:30 PM
I have read this thread with interest having made the change from medium pace to becoming a off-spinner about 6 years ago. A lot of the inputs are very true and I found I experienced the same things mentioned here. An important aspect is of course the level at which you play. At lower levels, bowlers dish up bad balls regularly and the more accurate consistent bowlers do very well. Batsmen also manage to get themselves out rather being out-thought by bowlers. My biggest struggle was limiting the bad balls initially. It always appears easier to be more accurate bowling slower, but it definitely takes a lot of practice and figuring out how to go about the task. Another important aspect is figuring out the best pace to bowl at on a particular surface or to a particular batsmen.

All that being said, I'm still learning and I wouldn't be able to pull it off at a higher level.

Out of interests, in the leagues you guys play, are the spinners massive turners of the ball?
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 15, 2020, 05:19:32 PM
I practice a lot on bowling fuller length and yorkers. What you don't normally see, this works for me as I don't like to let the batters free their arms. It didn't always go right but this is the I do it.
One think to remember is any kind of bowling takes hours of  preparation.
Compared to me other off spinner does the opposite, a lot of flight, extra bounce and turn get him wickets, he's a tall guy.
So everyone does it own, which ever works 🙂
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 15, 2020, 05:22:42 PM
I have read this thread with interest having made the change from medium pace to becoming a off-spinner about 6 years ago. A lot of the inputs are very true and I found I experienced the same things mentioned here. An important aspect is of course the level at which you play. At lower levels, bowlers dish up bad balls regularly and the more accurate consistent bowlers do very well. Batsmen also manage to get themselves out rather being out-thought by bowlers. My biggest struggle was limiting the bad balls initially. It always appears easier to be more accurate bowling slower, but it definitely takes a lot of practice and figuring out how to go about the task. Another important aspect is figuring out the best pace to bowl at on a particular surface or to a particular batsmen.

All that being said, I'm still learning and I wouldn't be able to pull it off at a higher level.

Out of interests, in the leagues you guys play, are the spinners massive turners of the ball?
Surrey league 4 XI, yes
And I agree with your post, slower deliveries with a faster straighter ones, here and there 😀
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 15, 2020, 05:23:28 PM
I have read this thread with interest having made the change from medium pace to becoming a off-spinner about 6 years ago. A lot of the inputs are very true and I found I experienced the same things mentioned here. An important aspect is of course the level at which you play. At lower levels, bowlers dish up bad balls regularly and the more accurate consistent bowlers do very well. Batsmen also manage to get themselves out rather being out-thought by bowlers. My biggest struggle was limiting the bad balls initially. It always appears easier to be more accurate bowling slower, but it definitely takes a lot of practice and figuring out how to go about the task. Another important aspect is figuring out the best pace to bowl at on a particular surface or to a particular batsmen.

All that being said, I'm still learning and I wouldn't be able to pull it off at a higher level.

Out of interests, in the leagues you guys play, are the spinners massive turners of the ball?


Hmmm, its a mixture. Personally I find the bowlers that really turn the ball square easier to face than the ones that just turn it a bat's width at good pace, because you can just use the angle to guide the ball into gaps.

Getting revs on the ball isn't just about generating big sideways turn of course, its also what provides the drift and the dip and sometimes the bit of extra bounce that conjures a wicket up out of nowhere.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: InternalTraining on January 15, 2020, 05:57:08 PM
As the title suggests, I'm debating making the switch this year due to a longstanding shoulder niggle which is exacerbated every season by about the 5th indoor net. Have found that turning my arm over doesn't have the same impact so keen to give it a go, even if only just at nets.

Has anyone else made the same switch, and if so any tips would be welcome?

I did, many moons ago and then I just quit bowling. There are younger guys in my team with better fitness who enjoy bowling. It was an easy decision that I haven't regretted. Bowling is hard work and takes a lot out of me during a game. I'd rather conserve my energies for batting.

For clubbies, I am assuming you are one, I feel it is important to know what you enjoy and how much effort your body can sustain over the period of a game. The ratio should be in the favor of "fun" or "enjoyment". Knowing my limits helped me enjoy club cricket so much more.  Probably not the suggestion you were looking for. :)
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: LEACHY48 on January 15, 2020, 06:05:35 PM
They're related, but they're not the same thing. Spin is what you do to the ball - its the number and direction of the revs. Spin can have 4 different effects: turn, bounce, drift and dip. I'd argue that they're each equally important.

You can't have turn without spin (unless the ball hits a stone), but you can have spin without turn. For example, a topspinner has a lot of spin, but it doesn't turn.

In this case we are making a similar argument. Because I was suggesting that the leg spinner walking wicket mentioned would still be classified as a spinner if the ball did nothing. Hence my examples of yardy and root.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: adb club cricketer on January 15, 2020, 06:10:07 PM
I made the switch about couple years ago as some really good folks who I trust mentioned that I would be better off if I made the switch to spin and i was always interested in spin bowling.

First one year was not great, I was experimenting with my action, grip, run up, delivery stride, etc and was always afraid of bowling loose balls every over, which held me back I felt. Then i realized that I dont have to worry so much about bowling the loose balls and rather only focus on bowling as many good balls as possible with the understanding that it is ok if i didnt bowl good balls at 100%. At some point later, I figured out the perfect action, grip and technique in the middle of one a game and that was the one that I could stick to to repeat over after over with confidence. Now I have confidence of my ability to keep the bad balls (full tosses/half trackers) to almost a minimum. And where I know I might bowl a loose ball, I try to protect with my field placings. So then, I started experimenting with some variations. Again when I try those variations, I ended up bowling bad balls. However, I am confidant just like my initial struggles, i will get over those at some time. Overall, the learning process and results has been very interesting and exciting.

Lastly, no matter how many videos you watch or people you talk to, I realized one needs to figure out what works best for them and that happens only with lot of practice and games and taking a learning/positive approach to failures.  Good luck..



Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Tom_90 on January 15, 2020, 06:35:01 PM
@SLA

I have a question if you don't mind.

If i bowl spin with a cross or scrambled seam, would that create more turbulence and therefore more drift? I find it easier to generate more revs by using the seam as a lever with my index finger if that makes sense?
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: bigblue365 on January 15, 2020, 06:40:35 PM
I bowl part-time slow medium pace occasionally. When I tried to bowl spin at nets I end up bowling short of length balls or low full tosses. I figured out that bowling spin at certain speed helps in controlling the line/length.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 15, 2020, 07:25:17 PM
I made the switch about couple years ago as some really good folks who I trust mentioned that I would be better off if I made the switch to spin and i was always interested in spin bowling.

First one year was not great, I was experimenting with my action, grip, run up, delivery stride, etc and was always afraid of bowling loose balls every over, which held me back I felt. Then i realized that I dont have to worry so much about bowling the loose balls and rather only focus on bowling as many good balls as possible with the understanding that it is ok if i didnt bowl good balls at 100%. At some point later, I figured out the perfect action, grip and technique in the middle of one a game and that was the one that I could stick to to repeat over after over with confidence. Now I have confidence of my ability to keep the bad balls (full tosses/half trackers) to almost a minimum. And where I know I might bowl a loose ball, I try to protect with my field placings. So then, I started experimenting with some variations. Again when I try those variations, I ended up bowling bad balls. However, I am confidant just like my initial struggles, i will get over those at some time. Overall, the learning process and results has been very interesting and exciting.

Lastly, no matter how many videos you watch or people you talk to, I realized one needs to figure out what works best for them and that happens only with lot of practice and games and taking a learning/positive approach to failures.  Good luck..
good one
I've very straight long on and long off, stays in or goes out, depending on the situation and the batter
straighter mid wicket,
next to leg umpire square leg very straight point
just on the inner circle a bit wider mid off and wider mid on
they mostly stay the same each game,
other are match situation dependant
guess this unorthodox field setting, as I don't bowl many slow deliveries
for slower off spinner, i think field setting will be wider and towards the rope.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 15, 2020, 07:36:01 PM
Not a particularly high level and no real aspiration to play at a higher level as I know my limitations as a cricketer!
fair enough, most important part is to keep enjoying what you do, rest will come
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 15, 2020, 07:42:10 PM
Something I've been half considering lately - I started out as a pace bowler who could hold a bat and have gradually swapped roles, which has sent my bowling downhill pretty sharply. Don't want to give up bowling, do I slow things down and trundle or try and bowl spin? Trouble being that my offspsin efforts, while fairly accurate, don't turn.
if you are not needed as a bowler and scoring enough runs, then why bother ? other option will just keep bowling medium in the nets
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 15, 2020, 07:44:19 PM
In what sense is he a legspinner then?
yep, same question I got :D
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: brokenbat on January 15, 2020, 11:23:35 PM
Whatever you do, do NOT think of spin bowling as “slow” bowling. Being a medium pacer, you already have good shoulder rotation... use it and keep the same arm speed etc. The ball will naturally slow as you try and spin in - trying to bowl “slow” (by slowing arm speed etc) will only lead to lollipops that wont have any drift or dip.
 I would suggest picking one or two offies and then watch their clips.. you have a nice variety to choose from:
1. Swann (fast offie who’s run up is probably closest to that of medium pacers)
2. Lyon - more loopy but still quick through air. Relies more on classical ‘up and over’ type action
3. Jadeja, herath, vettori - guys who didn’t spin much (still imparted revs).
4. Ashwin - combo of Lyon and swan imo.

Pick one you like and find them on YouTube. Most have tips etc online.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on January 15, 2020, 11:44:50 PM
Club spinners bowl much slower than the pros, for sure. Some of them don't spin it much, either.

If I were a better batsman...
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on January 15, 2020, 11:50:52 PM
@SLA

I have a question if you don't mind.

If i bowl spin with a cross or scrambled seam, would that create more turbulence and therefore more drift? I find it easier to generate more revs by using the seam as a lever with my index finger if that makes sense?

At higher level bowling with a scrambled seam is meant to make the spin harder to read. At lower levels, it just comes out like that?

Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 16, 2020, 02:54:17 AM
At higher level bowling with a scrambled seam is meant to make the spin harder to read. At lower levels, it just comes out like that?
it suppose to be, at any level :)
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on January 16, 2020, 04:41:55 AM
it suppose to be, at any level :)

No, no, no!  Coaching books have traditionally said that ball should spin on the axis of seam.

I know Jack Leach takes pride in being able to bowl whole spells without landing the ball on the shiny side. This wouldn't be possible if he was scrambling the seam.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: brokenbat on January 16, 2020, 04:43:16 AM
@SLA

I have a question if you don't mind.

If i bowl spin with a cross or scrambled seam, would that create more turbulence and therefore more drift? I find it easier to generate more revs by using the seam as a lever with my index finger if that makes sense?

According to murali (there is a clip of him coaching Lyon), scramble Seam makes it easier to bring dip, but it limits the drift. It’s a nice variation to have.. each bowler has his own style - so just experiment and see what works best for you. In my case, a scramble seam gives me more margin of error (I get bite off the surface even when I start undercutting the ball, instead of the correct up-and-over action). Some days I need that extra margin of error and I use that grip throughout the game - other days the swann/Lyon grip works better.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on January 16, 2020, 05:26:41 AM
No, no, no!  Coaching books have traditionally said that ball should spin on the axis of seam.
I know Jack Leach takes pride in being able to bowl whole spells without landing the ball on the shiny side. This wouldn't be possible if he was scrambling the seam.
okay :D
well said!
am i right in saying that scrambled deliveries are meant to go at the same pace of stock deliveries but they are suppose to stay straight? try fooling batman?
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 16, 2020, 09:13:16 AM
@SLA

I have a question if you don't mind.

If i bowl spin with a cross or scrambled seam, would that create more turbulence and therefore more drift? I find it easier to generate more revs by using the seam as a lever with my index finger if that makes sense?

I'm not aware of any scientific reason why it would make any noticeable difference to the strength or direction of either the magnus force or the reaction force off the ground.

However, as others have said, as a batsman I find it much harder to pick variations when the bowler is bowling with a scrambled seam.

I also bowl like that when the ball gets wet and the seam swells and it becomes impossible to grip in the orthodox fashion.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on January 16, 2020, 09:19:43 AM
I like to use the scrambled seam delivery when bowling at the death.

There's no scientific proof to any of this, but my theory is it could grip and behave normally or the seam could hit the pitch at a strange angle and do funny things.

Like I say there's no proof to this but it is something I've had success doing for about 6 years, so I'll stick with it  :)
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Psi on January 16, 2020, 10:21:11 AM
One question: why don't people switch to leg spin? I don't bowl, but when I do try and spin it, a leg action seems just as natural as an off spin action. Or am I missing something about how specialist leg spin is?
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 16, 2020, 10:42:20 AM
One question: why don't people switch to leg spin? I don't bowl, but when I do try and spin it, a leg action seems just as natural as an off spin action. Or am I missing something about how specialist leg spin is?

Some people do. A lad at our club switched from rubbish medium pace to rubbish leq spin. Its at least a bit more entertaining now.

I think the reason most people don't is because the learning curve is more dispiriting. I think a bad leg spinner is no more likely to get tonked than a bad offspinner, but its bad in a more embarrassing way. More wides, more long-hops. It looks worse in nets.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on January 16, 2020, 01:23:08 PM
Fewer legspinners around to give advice too. My club has optimistically 3, whereas every batsman who has to turn his arm over in nets bowls offies.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Tom_90 on January 16, 2020, 04:26:18 PM
I'm not aware of any scientific reason why it would make any noticeable difference to the strength or direction of either the magnus force or the reaction force off the ground.

However, as others have said, as a batsman I find it much harder to pick variations when the bowler is bowling with a scrambled seam.

I also bowl like that when the ball gets wet and the seam swells and it becomes impossible to grip in the orthodox fashion.

Thanks, and thanks to everyone for their contributions!

I tend to bowl mainly conventionally, but sometimes bowl scrambled seam if the ball feels uncomfortable to grip for whatever reason.

I watched a lot of baseball last year, and they use the seams in many different ways to generate movement on their pitches. really fascinating stuff. I wondered if there was any evidence for cricket ball movement being affected by how the seam was rotating.

I guess the main difference with baseball is the design of the ball is obviously different and they throw the ball harder than we cricketers bowl it. A curveball for example is usually the slowest pitch thrown at 70-odd MPH.

Always fun having a play with different deliveries in the nets!
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on January 16, 2020, 04:47:12 PM
Thanks, and thanks to everyone for their contributions!

I tend to bowl mainly conventionally, but sometimes bowl scrambled seam if the ball feels uncomfortable to grip for whatever reason.

I watched a lot of baseball last year, and they use the seams in many different ways to generate movement on their pitches. really fascinating stuff. I wondered if there was any evidence for cricket ball movement being affected by how the seam was rotating.

I guess the main difference with baseball is the design of the ball is obviously different and they throw the ball harder than we cricketers bowl it. A curveball for example is usually the slowest pitch thrown at 70-odd MPH.

Always fun having a play with different deliveries in the nets!


The main distinction in baseball between similar pitches that vary seam orientation are the 4-seam and 2-seam fastball.

The 4 seam fastball is held across the seams and thrown with backspin. This is supposedly the hardest, straightest pitch the pitcher throws.

The 2 seam fastball is thrown in a similar manner but with the long seams oriented towards the batter. This is supposed to induce sideways movement (perhaps like a touch of swing).

In reality, the way pitchers get their 2-seamers to move is to combine this grip with increased pressure on one finger to introduce a small amount of sidespin onto the ball. Press harder with the index finger and you have a cutter, press harder with the middle finger and you have a sinker.

These used to be my two favourite pitches when I was a pitcher in the British leagues.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on February 01, 2020, 02:11:08 PM
First attempt at it today, not absolutely awful but could use a few tips! Big issue was the high full tosses, almost felt like the ball was slipping out the top of my hand. Any advice on how to cut down on that?
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on February 01, 2020, 02:39:27 PM
First attempt at it today, not absolutely awful but could use a few tips! Big issue was the high full tosses, almost felt like the ball was slipping out the top of my hand. Any advice on how to cut down on that?
Oh man, this game is so funny 😀
Last week I bowled after 6 months break
Thought action was right, bowled head high full toss! 😀 Next ball, tried to bowl slower, another high full toss! I bowled 6 full tosses! Never ever happened that before, trust me 😀 7th delivery was precise, so that batsman called for, 'well bowled!'
From there onwards not even 1 off was off target 🙂
I think my radar was set high and was bowling faster than I thought!
I only have softer grip when I bowl slower flighted deliveries which is not often. I do that when try to deceive batter on the flight or if the wicket is turning a lot.
Otherwise bowling only flighted isn't effective for me, I think.
So I would suggest that you should hold the ball tighter and try to ball on the off stump or just outside the off, what you think about it? 🙂
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on February 01, 2020, 02:47:15 PM
I thought at the time and afterwards bit couldn't really find exact reason for those 6 full tosses. Then I guess that I was trying too hard to bowl on the spot.
You see it's a very learning game if we try to relax and have fun 😀
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on February 01, 2020, 02:48:22 PM
I'll give a slightly tighter grip a go next week, cheers!
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on February 01, 2020, 04:35:42 PM
Fewer legspinners around to give advice too. My club has optimistically 3, whereas every batsman who has to turn his arm over in nets bowls offies.

Not to mention every seamer who's had enough of running in for today.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Buzz on February 01, 2020, 06:25:55 PM
First attempt at it today, not absolutely awful but could use a few tips! Big issue was the high full tosses, almost felt like the ball was slipping out the top of my hand. Any advice on how to cut down on that?

Work hard on really driving through your action.
That will help get drift too.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: blindowl on February 01, 2020, 06:51:41 PM
One question: why don't people switch to leg spin? I don't bowl, but when I do try and spin it, a leg action seems just as natural as an off spin action. Or am I missing something about how specialist leg spin is?

I've tried a leg spin action and I feel super uncomfortable. Feels like I've either got to dislocate my shoulder to get my arm over or bend so far at the waist that that it verges on the ridiculous. On top of that the ball did not spin. All in all I gave it a miss!!  :D

Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on February 01, 2020, 07:05:07 PM
Work hard on really driving through your action.
That will help get drift too.

As in driving my back leg through towards the stumps or?
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on February 01, 2020, 07:45:26 PM
Not to mention every seamer who's had enough of running in for today.
Off spin comes feels natural/easy option.
Leg spin for me, is a specialist job! Mostly one does that from childhood,
There's one guy who played in the 4th, as opener but loved bowling leggies, then he was selected for the 3rd XI as leg spinner all rounder. Year later he he's playing for the 1st XI as leggie, batting at no. 8/9, t he's a successful leggie now!
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on February 01, 2020, 07:53:44 PM
Off-spin is like decorating. Everyone can do it;  few can do it well.

Leg-spin is like...  let me think about it...
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on February 01, 2020, 07:56:45 PM
It has definitely had the hoped for benefit of putting less strain on my shoulder than bowling medium pace at least. Worth persevering with.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on February 01, 2020, 08:06:47 PM
As in driving my back leg through towards the stumps or?

Get up and over the ball at about half past one (45 degrees).  A lot of people think in terms of 3 o' clock.

(Sorry, separate point. I'll let Buzz answer the question.)
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: AJ2014 on February 01, 2020, 08:09:26 PM
Off-spin is like decorating. Everyone can do it;  few can do it well.

Leg-spin is like...  let me think about it...
Yes! 😀 Leg spin is an art! Only few can do well 🙂
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Bats_Entertainment on February 01, 2020, 08:13:17 PM
If can do leg-spin at all - land a spinning ball - you are pretty much guaranteed a gig.

Still trying to think of a comparable trade...
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on February 01, 2020, 08:34:26 PM
If can do leg-spin at all - land a spinning ball - you are pretty much guaranteed a gig.

Still trying to think of a comparable trade...

Plumber. Toilets never stop breaking and people never stop wanting one that works.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: shadowlight on February 01, 2020, 11:40:54 PM
What is considered good length for spin bowling and where do you measure that distance from?  I am assuming from the wickets and about 4 to 6 meters.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on February 02, 2020, 12:08:10 AM
What is considered good length for spin bowling and where do you measure that distance from?  I am assuming from the wickets and about 4 to 6 meters.

Hedley verity was on the money when he described the optimum spinners length as a short half volley.

Always err on the side of overpitching rather than underpitching. A low full toss is better then a long hop.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jaffa on February 02, 2020, 01:15:15 AM
What is considered good length for spin bowling and where do you measure that distance from?  I am assuming from the wickets and about 4 to 6 meters.

I've started quite late to cricket in general, nevermind starting out as a spinner. Here's what has worked for me so far and I assume it's mostly the same for any type of bowler.

Time in the nets. Not only with mates but also on my own. That and looking where I want to put the ball has helped me in getting about the length I want. The approx length depends on what I'm trying to do, cramp him, aim at the wicket or get him to play to the field. No guarantees of course but it's good to have a plan. Using red/white balls and filming what I am trying to do with the ball and what the ball actually does helps in getting the gap between the two to be smaller. Vary your pace and position on the crease so you're disturbing his rhythm/timing without disturbing yours. Don't vary it too much though. Was told to 'always keep your arm as high as possible on release' then realising I can bowl spin with my arm being lower causing a flatter/turning delivery which is quite handy on bouncy wickets. It's not above their eyeline but it can threaten their wicket or at least make them think. For batsmen who have good/quick footwork, it's normally your stock ball or an awful delivery that gets them out (if you're lucky). Don't ignore that voice in your head.

Accept that even your best ball is going to get hit. It doesn't matter if all you can do is admire the shot. The next ball, the stakes are still about the same for both of you.

I did get a training session from a proper spinner but I think due to my age (old dogs etc.), the most I got out of the session was more confidence.

That's my take on things. I've found it to be a great learning curve.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Buzz on February 03, 2020, 12:46:26 PM
A good tip from the freddie wilde book, as an offie if you are under the cosh, set a deep point and bowl short and wide outside the off stump, effectively giving the batter a single.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on February 09, 2020, 11:49:22 AM
Much improved at nets yesterday, felt the ball was coming out much more easily and was a lot more accurate. Tighter grip definitely helped but the big change was a much shorter run up, just a few steps. What kind of run up are other club offies using?
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on February 09, 2020, 11:56:33 AM
I come off 10 and a half steps for "rythm" but I can come off about 2 steps if I want to rush through some overs
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: Jimbo on February 09, 2020, 01:02:44 PM
I come off 10 and a half steps for "rythm" but I can come off about 2 steps if I want to rush through some overs

Jesus, I come off 10 steps when I'm bowling mediums 😂
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: WalkingWicket37 on February 09, 2020, 01:45:27 PM
Jesus, I come off 10 steps when I'm bowling mediums 😂

A lot of that is walking up and waving my arms though...
I think calling it a run up would be false advertising  :D
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: jamesisapayne on February 10, 2020, 07:10:05 AM
7 steps for me
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: FattusCattus on February 10, 2020, 09:49:43 AM
A lot of that is walking up and waving my arms though...
I think calling it a run up would be false advertising  :D

I think calling it 'off spin' is a bit of a stretch.
Title: Re: Switching from medium pace to offspin - any advice?
Post by: SLA on February 10, 2020, 11:28:11 AM
A good tip from the freddie wilde book, as an offie if you are under the cosh, set a deep point and bowl short and wide outside the off stump, effectively giving the batter a single.

I don't really see this. Going short and wide, you're basically giving up on taking a wicket. Bowled, lbw, stumped are all impossible, and getting an edge or a mishit shot in the air is extremely unlikely, compared to, say, bowling full and getting the batsman driving.

So you're giving up on wickets and just looking to contain at 6 an over. But even with the best sweeper in the world, some balls are going to go to either side and the batsman can run 2. So its more likely to be 8-9 runs per over.

Maybe in a high-scoring pro T20 game, a spell of 4 overs, 0-32 might be considered a success, but I can't imagine in scenario in amateur cricket where that would be the case.


Bowling a full length outside off with a 5-4 field, incl a sweeper and a long off is a better idea - at least then you have a chance of beating the bat and getting some dot balls.