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Author Topic: Grade Grains Performance  (Read 1561 times)

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GarrettJ

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #15 on: July 10, 2018, 12:41:54 PM »

i went to Kippax a few years back and they had some amazing clefts .... really special ones.
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prim0pyr0

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #16 on: July 10, 2018, 01:33:26 PM »

Ditto for me John.

But then how do you grade something like this...



Much better to let supply and demand work it out.
A bat seller (maker or retailer or ebay frankly) has to work out a price they think the bat will sell at. They will use branding to make it look prettier, but in all reality when you buy a bat either you are happy with it and will pay or you wont.

Whether it is a g1 or velum is mostly ego...

But those pro bats are magnificent 😂😂

Butterfly =g3
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CricketXI

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #17 on: July 10, 2018, 02:30:01 PM »

As for the normal pros- most of them gets what ever is the best graded and looking bats available to the manufacturer/Supplier, or they allow the player to pick from their collection.
But I am not so sure about what the star sponsored players like Kolhi, Dhoni, Smith or Root etc are getting.
As many sponsors like to send out  6-8 bats to the player to chose from to play with. In which some could be stunning looking bats and some could be extremely average looking bats.
Some supplier like to send 2-3 bats based upon the availability of a cleft deemed good for a pro player

For sure they are getting the cleanest bats with no visible blemishes(Which is a marketing thing for the manufacturer), but I am not sure about the straightness and number of grains. Have seen big stars playing with wobbly grained bats.

For a pro-bat all  the controllable factors(right from raw cleft, weight, balance and finishing) are optimize to produce a master piece with all the major and little details nailed to perfection.

But my point is why cannot the manufacturers/makers can use some scientific method to determine the performance of a bat (As baseball bat are  determined by BBCOR rating system).
This will allow the customer to make a more informed decision in place to picking something with no guarantee of performance.
Currently the bat market is like going to a shop and buying a mystery  box.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2018, 02:32:52 PM by CricketXI »
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DorsetDan

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #18 on: July 10, 2018, 02:45:56 PM »

It is a variable product. You would have to test every bat which isn't the case in baseball/ golf/ etc. Time and cost would be huge with no benefit to the manufacturer.

The "worst" bats I've always had score the most runs too so why care about ping if it is perfect in the hamds
« Last Edit: July 10, 2018, 02:49:05 PM by DorsetDan »
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WalkingWicket37

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #19 on: July 10, 2018, 02:54:34 PM »

For a pro-bat all  the controllable factors(right from raw cleft, weight, balance and finishing) are optimize to produce a master piece with all the major and little details nailed to perfection.

Is this actually the case though? If so why would so many pro's take their bats for weight reductions etc. (Dawid Malan in Australia being a recent example).

A lot of pros are using bleached bats recently I've noticed. These are likely bleached to hide the fact they're far from a beautiful piece of willow.

As for finishing and the little details, bats like the old (big profile) Warner's wouldn't last very long at all. Surely as long as the sponsors stickers are applied the maker or player are unlikely to care about the small details, so long as it pings!
How often does anyone get close enough to a pro bat to scrutinise the finishing, anyway?
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InternalTraining

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #20 on: July 10, 2018, 03:07:38 PM »

@CricketXI , Cleft grading process as we know it is a pretty much a joke. It is based on flexible "standards" (nobody can really define what is a true "Grade 1") to grab highest prices from consumers. Either way, as consumers, we are pretty screwed. Your best bets are: 1. Look for discount and deals on (great) bats picked up by someone else; 2. Work with an intermediary like Mueleman and others to hand select finest bats that somehow escaped the "pros"; 3. buy used bats. 4. Buy them when they are cheap - stock up on great bats. In this case you might still end up paying a premium but in the long run, you will come out ahead. :D
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sanredrose

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #21 on: July 10, 2018, 03:22:51 PM »

You will end up with good bats if you go with performance over grade. GM 808 bats are a very good example. These are usually classified as G2 but some of them are extremely good. I have one such GM Octane 808 which is my match bat while a GM original sleeps in my closet :D.
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CricketXI

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #22 on: July 10, 2018, 03:30:14 PM »

@WalkingWicket37:
I have never seen a Pro-bat myself but I am assuming that they should be made to absolute perfection and liking of the player using it.
And can not say anything about pro using bleached bats but if they are its just because of product marketing-"The product should be pleasing to eyes".

I am no expert but I guess David Malan might be looking for a lighter bat to counter extra bounce offered by Australian pitches (** Its just a guess but many players tweak their bats or gloves or pads to suite their need).
He might have a set weight range and would have carried all the bat in the same range and after looking the conditions there he might have felt the need of bit lighter bat.
As per my understanding most of the pro like to have different bats for different countries (* batting condition).
« Last Edit: July 10, 2018, 03:32:05 PM by CricketXI »
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six and out

Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #23 on: July 10, 2018, 03:38:15 PM »

Walk into a reputable cricket shop, pick up as many bats as possible in as many different brands and price ranges. Whichever feels right for you and goes well off the mallet, job done. One of the best feelings is trying bats in a cricket shop so do it.

Am I over simplifying it?
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KettonJake

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #24 on: July 10, 2018, 03:44:15 PM »

@WalkingWicket37:
I have never seen a Pro-bat myself but I am assuming that they should be made to absolute perfection and liking of the player using it.
And can not say anything about pro using bleached bats but if they are its just because of product marketing-"The product should be pleasing to eyes".

I am no expert but I guess David Malan might be looking for a lighter bat to counter extra bounce offered by Australian pitches (** Its just a guess but many players tweak their bats or gloves or pads to suite their need).
He might have a set weight range and would have carried all the bat in the same range and after looking the conditions there he might have felt the need of bit lighter bat.
As per my understanding most of the pro like to have different bats for different countries (* batting condition).

I've seen and repaired enough pro bats to tell you the majority of them don't care about finishing, looks etc. Is the balance right for them? Does it go like stink? That is all that matters.

They treat them much worse than we do on the whole as well, because they can just get another one.

Mfarank

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #25 on: July 10, 2018, 03:51:06 PM »

Walk into a reputable cricket shop, pick up as many bats as possible in as many different brands and price ranges. Whichever feels right for you and goes well off the mallet, job done. One of the best feelings is trying bats in a cricket shop so do it.

Am I over simplifying it?
The problem is when u go to said shop and start picking up bats regardless of grades or brands, u pick up a bat that feels well balanced and pings well yet has 6 grains, a few knots and 50% heartwood, and suddenly that bat turns into a super pro grade 1+++++ bat because it is "graded for performance". All too common practice nowadays.
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six and out

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #26 on: July 10, 2018, 03:55:32 PM »

The problem is when u go to said shop and start picking up bats regardless of grades or brands, u pick up a bat that feels well balanced and pings well yet has 6 grains, a few knots and 50% heartwood, and suddenly that bat turns into a super pro grade 1+++++ bat because it is "graded for performance". All too common practice nowadays.

But surely that is the point isn't it..... it is doing the job a cricket bat is meant to do. So what if it has been priced as a grade whatever million + , you are using it to hit the ball to the boundary. No stand there and look good.
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Bats_Entertainment

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #27 on: July 10, 2018, 04:34:33 PM »

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JK Lewis

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #28 on: July 10, 2018, 04:41:57 PM »

Serious question then fellas. If you had the opportunity to select your own clefts based on your own personal criteria, from a big pile of them, would you be interested?
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Gurujames

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Re: Grade Grains Performance
« Reply #29 on: July 10, 2018, 04:45:39 PM »

No. I would want to see how they were handled, pressed and shaped. A great looking cleft could be made into a total plank and an ugly duckling be transformed into a swan.
Im sure many on here would love that but I see enough timber at work and the end product is of more interest to me.
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