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Author Topic: England tour of West Indies  (Read 26839 times)

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liscon12

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #30 on: December 10, 2018, 02:58:39 PM »

Am I reading this correctly, Bairstow has the gloves back??
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ppccopener

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #31 on: December 10, 2018, 02:59:31 PM »

Right call this time if Roy was picked it makes it even harder to play Pope, as it is he can't get in the side so better he does not carry the drinks around.

Interesting we have stuck with Denly, it would of been easy to have him just for the Sri Lanka tour .

Wonder if England do see him playing at all on this tour, if so...where?

Spose he could bat 3 ?  :)
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ppccopener

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #32 on: December 10, 2018, 03:00:18 PM »

Am I reading this correctly, Bairstow has the gloves back??

What? Surely not?
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Manormanic

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #33 on: December 10, 2018, 03:07:10 PM »

Exposing Buttler to give Bairstow an easier gig at 5? I wonder which county you are from  :D

I think it makes perfect sense. 

Assuming both of them are in the side, we know that Jonny is the better keeper (so the reserve for Foakes) and also the more likely to make test centuries.  We also know that a left right opening partnership, with one more attacking player, would be prefereable to Burns and Jennings, who are both lefties and one paced. 
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liscon12

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #34 on: December 10, 2018, 03:12:51 PM »

What? Surely not?
Clearly someone made a mistake and has changed the team sheet. Before it had the wkt symbol next to Bairstow, now its next to Foakes
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LateBloomer

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #35 on: December 10, 2018, 03:23:37 PM »

I think it makes perfect sense. 

Assuming both of them are in the side, we know that Jonny is the better keeper (so the reserve for Foakes) and also the more likely to make test centuries.  We also know that a left right opening partnership, with one more attacking player, would be prefereable to Burns and Jennings, who are both lefties and one paced.

I would say your keeping argument whilst probably correct is pointless as Foakes will have the gloves for the foreseeable future

And if, as you say, Bairstow is more likely to make Test Centuries then he should make them from the spot that is available. You don't shuffle a team to fit in one guy because you are worried his feelings might be hurt.

But to be honest at the moment Butler IS a better Test batsman than Bairstow anyway. He has been brilliant since he came back into the team, proving very adaptable with his batting style at number 5/6, knowing when to consolidate and when to attack. Why on earth would you want to change that?
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Tailendfielder

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #36 on: December 10, 2018, 03:35:33 PM »

Realistically though, is Curran a good enough bowler to be in the XI?

Curran-tly, no. (see what I did there?)  :D

I think we (myself included) are letting his batting prowess cloud judgment of his primary skill, bowling.

This
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Manormanic

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #37 on: December 10, 2018, 04:00:13 PM »

And if, as you say, Bairstow is more likely to make Test Centuries then he should make them from the spot that is available. You don't shuffle a team to fit in one guy because you are worried his feelings might be hurt.

Nope, but you do shuffle it to get the strongest possible team.  This way you separate the two left handed openers, and move Jennings a tad further from the new ball, whilst allowing for some top order impetus. 

But to be honest at the moment Butler IS a better Test batsman than Bairstow anyway. He has been brilliant since he came back into the team, proving very adaptable with his batting style at number 5/6, knowing when to consolidate and when to attack. Why on earth would you want to change that?

Errr, no he isn't.  He has done enough to show that he is a bit more than a luxury player, but the fact is he has made one century in a futile rear guard and played some nice attacking cameos.  He can do that at the top of the order - the innings of substance are far more likely to come from Jonny. 
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Rob580

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #38 on: December 10, 2018, 04:11:47 PM »

the innings of substance are far more likely to come from Jonny.

And the best place to do that, is at 3.

Case closed.
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ManHOOS

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #39 on: December 10, 2018, 04:24:52 PM »

Westindies on homeground s are not easy to face.
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LateBloomer

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #40 on: December 10, 2018, 05:22:47 PM »

Nope, but you do shuffle it to get the strongest possible team.  This way you separate the two left handed openers, and move Jennings a tad further from the new ball, whilst allowing for some top order impetus. 

Errr, no he isn't.  He has done enough to show that he is a bit more than a luxury player, but the fact is he has made one century in a futile rear guard and played some nice attacking cameos.  He can do that at the top of the order - the innings of substance are far more likely to come from Jonny.

You've downplayed Buttlers recent performances there to further your argument, which is fair enough. But I think you'll find he has the highest average in the squad since his return to the team. Against the same Indian attack that went through Bairstow like a hot curry

If Jennings isn't good enough to face the new ball he should be dropped, simple as that. He's an opening bat, score runs or go home. Or should we start the innings with a day watchman for him?

We obviously don't agree but as a whole package I value Buttler over Bairstow in this England team at the moment. Consistent runs, positive attitude, cool head and intelligence. Isn't he VC? I wouldn't be changing his role, think he is perfect for it
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ppccopener

Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #41 on: December 10, 2018, 05:56:56 PM »

Hugely disappointed to read on this forum Butler 'a bit more than a luxury player'. The two series we just had I watched virtually everything and read virtually every article (sad I know!). He's played crucial roles in most of the last two series batting intelligently to steer us thou some tricky waters,as did Ben Stokes....

He's an understated individual from his interviews happy to bat anywhere for the team but shoving him up any higher would just be madness.
We can't change the whole team around just because Bairstow no longer keeps.

In an ideal world, which won't happen I know, Bairstow fits in at number 4, behind Root...but England are just going to have to keep trying the two openers and it could well be as Smith hinted...team selection is based on what tour we are on, if there's loads of spin Jennings is as good as anyone, if it's pace maybe he ain't the bloke we need at number 1..

That presents a problem of not getting match experience but perhaps that's the answer to not having outstanding players we have done in the past, where all the batting just picked itself regardless of where we were playing
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Kanak

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #42 on: December 10, 2018, 07:48:56 PM »

Jennings
Burns
Bairstow
Root
Stokes
Buttler
Foakes
S Curran
Ali
Leach
Anderson
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Manormanic

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #43 on: December 10, 2018, 09:47:32 PM »

You've downplayed Buttlers recent performances there to further your argument, which is fair enough. But I think you'll find he has the highest average in the squad since his return to the team. Against the same Indian attack that went through Bairstow like a hot curry

Interesting viewpoint, given that in the first two tests of that series, Bairstow made 70, 28, 93 to Buttler's 0, 1, 24. Two match winning performances, before that awful finger injury....
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LateBloomer

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Re: England tour of West Indies
« Reply #44 on: December 10, 2018, 11:25:11 PM »

Interesting viewpoint, given that in the first two tests of that series, Bairstow made 70, 28, 93 to Buttler's 0, 1, 24. Two match winning performances, before that awful finger injury....

Bairstow averaged 25 in the series. Buttler averaged 38. Thats how averages work. You cant just pick and choose the matches your guy did well in and forget the rest. My lasting memory is stumps going everywhere

We'll see if Buttler does indeed open the batting in Barbados. My money is on him staying where he is




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