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Author Topic: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions  (Read 2133 times)

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Komdotkom

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M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« on: June 27, 2019, 01:13:01 AM »

I would like to make a copy of a M&H S6 or Puma M&H made thing like Bevan used in the 90's.
I've got heaps of bats with 40mm edges, so for a change I would like something a bit different but these things are very hard to come by in Australia. Does anyone have some rough dimensions and characteristics?
I was thinking 22mm toe, 25mm max edge and maybe 18mm at the shoulder. Spine height as big as the cleft will allow, peak spine height finishes about 125mm up from the toe. I'm assuming they don't have much concaving?
When putting the 'plug' holes in the back, what do you think about using a 25mm spade bit and leaving 15mm of material at the bottom of the hole? I might use cedar for the plugs to get a nice contrast in timber colour.

Thoughts / input / tips greatly appreciated.
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potzy248

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #1 on: June 27, 2019, 02:37:15 AM »

Laver and Wood make the exact same thing as I've had one before.
James worked with Julian and has a replica in his workshop.
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Komdotkom

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #2 on: June 27, 2019, 03:00:06 AM »

Thanks mate, I've seen those on their website. I've got another bat on order from Laver at the moment, I really wanted to make this one myself as a bit of a challenge.
I'll see if I can prevail upon them to give me some basic numbers.
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Gurujames

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #3 on: June 27, 2019, 06:30:09 AM »

A Forstner drill will leave a cleaner hole. Cedar does not glue well due to the resins in it. How are you planning to make the plugs?
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Komdotkom

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #4 on: June 27, 2019, 06:49:29 AM »

I was just going to use a plug cutter. I saw on the L&W website that they have used dowels in theirs but I can't see how the end grain is going to look any good.
I've got some Zebrano timber left over from another project, that would make pretty plugs but too heavy. It's the low density of cedar that attracted me to it (plus I've got a few lining boards left over from my stairs), it's furniture grade so will be super dry - do you still think it won't glue well?
Thanks for the tip on the drill, looks like a much better option.
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edge

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2019, 07:00:40 AM »

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Komdotkom

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #6 on: June 27, 2019, 07:18:34 AM »

Thanks Edge, I don't do Facebook so wasn't aware of that video.
Certainly provided more questions than answers though. I was under the impression that the plugs were to reduce the weight of the bat, but judging by how far he drives them in, I don't think there's going to be much of a gap at the bottom of the hole. Perhaps it's more about trapping air within the blade like an air spring?
I love that he drills the holes freehand, if I did that there would be putty on the face so you couldn't see where I'd gone through! Any thoughts on why they are drilled at a 30 degree angle toward the toe? I was just going to straight down.
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edge

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #7 on: June 27, 2019, 08:09:01 AM »

I'm sure there was a video where he talked about it all in more detail, but couldn't find it. Think the whole thing was for looks as much as anything else to be honest! Drilling the holes freehand looked sloppy as hell to me but suppose it isn't actually that important.
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Scruffy

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2019, 09:01:25 PM »

Just had this post brought to my attention so thought I would answer some of the questions...

The M&H Signature which James made back in England, which we have here in the workshop peaks at 27mm in the edge, 73 in the spine, 27 at the highest point of the toe and 22 at the lowest point of the toe. The shoulders are only around 12mm.

The reason for drilling the holes on an angle is to get the hole deeper and create more of an air pocket, the dowels aren't driven the whole way down, they are more of a plug.
James has said the holes are about 45-50mm deep at most. So quite deep.
We simply mark the drill bit with a permanent marker, to make sure we don't go too far!

Paul.

Komdotkom

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #9 on: June 28, 2019, 03:04:56 AM »

Hi Paul,

Thanks very much for your detailed reply that helps immensely.
I started roughing in the shape last night so I'll transfer these dimensions on and see how they compare to my guess work.
So if the holes are 40-50mm deep, there must be about 12mm of thickness left in the face?

« Last Edit: June 28, 2019, 09:40:42 AM by Komdotkom »
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Komdotkom

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2019, 05:57:47 AM »

I've roughed the shape in for this, the edges are 1.5mm oversize so I can neaten them up a bit in the final sand after if put the plugs in it. I'm not really happy with the transition from the splice to the spine I'm not really sure what to do about it. The toe is 25mm on the edges and 27mm in the centre, pickup is not too bad for something with such a low middle. The spine peaks at 70mm I couldn't get any more out of the cleft, Christ knows where GN were getting the clefts for the XP80's.
The handle is much nicer on this than the last one I made, I may have to revisit that after learning a few things.
The one in the centre is the bat I'm making a poor copy of.






« Last Edit: June 29, 2019, 06:26:46 AM by Komdotkom »
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Vicbats

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2019, 06:13:36 AM »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuyRnzPsH5A&feature=share that is the YouTube video of james talking about the bat
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Komdotkom

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2019, 06:37:05 AM »

Thanks for the link I hadn't realised they were two different profiles, that certainly explains a lot. I've gone for the English version (low middle) but since I like to plant the front foot and tee off that should suit me perfectly on the odd occasion when I make contact with the ball.
Does anyone have any theories about what the dowels are for (apart from looking different) and the best implementation of them?
I think a forstner dill is the go, my question is how much meat should I leave in the face and how much air gap for the plugs. I think I'll drill a hole with an 18mm bit then turn down a 19mm pine dowel to an interference fit.
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Vicbats

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Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2019, 07:01:14 AM »

No worries, my take on the dowels would be a balance point. I know over here in Australia you could get either 4 dowels or 6 dowels.

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Komdotkom

Re: M&H S6 / Puma Original dimensions
« Reply #14 on: July 02, 2019, 09:37:17 PM »

Holes are drilled, now I just need to work on the dowels.
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