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Author Topic: Bowling machine vs throwdowns  (Read 2565 times)

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SLA

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #30 on: November 05, 2019, 01:31:03 PM »

I couldn't disagree more.

- Bowling machine do take time to get used to but it is not impossible. Absence of a "realistic" bowler actually improved my batting as my ball-tracking (with eyes) improved.
- Maybe there are plenty of human ball throwers in England who can "swing, cut and spin" a ball using SideArm. Zero in my location.
- Machine is available when humans are not.
- My Bola JR can land a ball anywhere I want! I have yet to meet a club cricketer who can land the ball on the same spot like McGrath! None. You are completely wrong here.
- There is no "large margin of error" with a bowling machine. The balls are not dropped on a dime but between the speeds of 55-65, the pitch is accurate enough. I can practice all my shots with a Bola JR. To build muscle memory, all you need is a machine set on low speed.
- How many balls can you throw in an hour session or longer? Bola JR never complains about shoulder aches or pains.


Hey look, its cool. You've spent a lot of money on your bowling machine, and now you've got a lot of psychological baggage that requires you to constantly convince yourself that this was the "right" decision. Nothing anyone says here is going to convince you otherwise. So why argue?
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InternalTraining

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #31 on: November 05, 2019, 01:42:33 PM »

^ Nah, just great results.

But you are free and entitled to your stone-age methods. People like you cannot suppress the truth for long.
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SD

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #32 on: November 05, 2019, 02:47:04 PM »

Personally I find a bowling machine much more useful for both developing my own game and getting into form for the start of the season.  Even up to a decent level, the biggest single improvement you can make is simply by hitting a volume of balls.  A BOLA with an autofeeder gives you the volume of practice that the amateur or paid league cricketer isn't going to get otherwise.

The Trueman version of the BOLA is great but unfortunately i haven't seen a net outside of the indoor centres of the first class counties with one yet
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SLA

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #33 on: November 05, 2019, 02:47:52 PM »

^ Nah, just great results.

But you are free and entitled to your stone-age methods. People like you cannot suppress the truth for long.


hahahahahaha. "people like me" who "suppress the truth"? Do you think there is a conspiracy against bowling machines? This is absolute gold mate. Please, start a youtube channel, it would be hilarious.



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SLA

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #34 on: November 05, 2019, 02:53:41 PM »

the biggest single improvement you can make is simply by hitting a volume of balls.

Literally no coach in the world would agree with this.
Its like thinking that the best way to become a F1 driver is to jump in your car and drive as many miles as you can.

You need deliberate, dedicated practice with feedback from a knowledgeable observer in as close to match situations as possible. Mindlessly smacking rubber hockey balls on a plastic indoor strip is more likely to ingrain bad habits than good.
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WalkingWicket37

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #35 on: November 05, 2019, 03:04:41 PM »

Literally no coach in the world would agree with this.
Its like thinking that the best way to become a F1 driver is to jump in your car and drive as many miles as you can.

You need deliberate, dedicated practice with feedback from a knowledgeable observer in as close to match situations as possible. Mindlessly smacking rubber hockey balls on a plastic indoor strip is more likely to ingrain bad habits than good.

This!

As much as we all love a bowling machine sending down 50mph half volleys to make us feel like Don Bradman, does it actually help anyone?

And as much as you can try to convince yourself that you aren't premeditating when facing a bowling machine, the nature of the practice a machine provides you will be (even if subconsciously). If you're, as InternalTraining puts it, practicing all your shots at a low speed "to build muscle memory" are you not premeditating in order to do that? i.e if you're "building muscle memory" by practicing your cover drive, even if you aren't in position to play the shot before the ball is bowled/fired you will be subconsciously premeditating said cover drive.

While I like a machine session to have a hit in the winter, I don't think they're that great a means of practicing or developing your game. That's just my opinion though, I won't try ramming it down your throat to suppress anyone's perspective of the truth ;)
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alexhilly1492

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #36 on: November 05, 2019, 03:15:14 PM »

Literally no coach in the world would agree with this.
Its like thinking that the best way to become a F1 driver is to jump in your car and drive as many miles as you can.

You need deliberate, dedicated practice with feedback from a knowledgeable observer in as close to match situations as possible. Mindlessly smacking rubber hockey balls on a plastic indoor strip is more likely to ingrain bad habits than good.

surely to ingrain you want to take out as many variables as possible.. a person feeding (in my opinion) wont be as accurate as a machine.

Bowling machines have there purpose, to ignore that would be stupid, however there is a limit as to what they can achieve, to ignore this would also be stupid.

having said that every person is different, for me when im feeling out fo touch a bowling machine net is perfect, get that feeling back hit the ball great, but when im in form i like to face bowlers as its what happens in a game, if im struggling with a shot, bowling machine, if im struggling with rhythm, bowlers are better.

it all depends on what your trying to achieve
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Gurujames

Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #37 on: November 05, 2019, 03:18:23 PM »

On the rare occasions I have used a bowling machine I make sure its set just short of a length, swinging in and seaming away. I find this very difficult as there is enough random variation that a variety of shots are possible and you only have a split second to decide. However, we are not pros and enjoying a session is at least as important as improving technique.
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SD

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #38 on: November 05, 2019, 03:37:21 PM »

Literally no coach in the world would agree with this.
Its like thinking that the best way to become a F1 driver is to jump in your car and drive as many miles as you can.

You need deliberate, dedicated practice with feedback from a knowledgeable observer in as close to match situations as possible. Mindlessly smacking rubber hockey balls on a plastic indoor strip is more likely to ingrain bad habits than good.

To use one example, when Jonny Bairstow came back from his first England stint to Yorkshire, Jason Gillespie has gone on record to say that there had been too much over coaching and what Bairstow needed was simply to go back into the nets and get bat on ball without interference.  Nasser Hussain for another has spoken about his own development and his belief in batsmen developing through volume of practice.

Admittedly you no doubt have more first class.and international experience ...
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WalkingWicket37

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #39 on: November 05, 2019, 04:19:35 PM »

@SD I think there's a bit of a difference between professionals coming back to their county from the national side and a club player though

Then to play devils advocate to my own argument, Steve Smith became the best batsman in the world with a "village technique" by hitting thousands, if not millions, of balls.

At the end of the day it's each to their own, some like the machine, some don't. Just do what suits you and enjoy your cricket, does it really matter what anyone else thinks?
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edge

Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #40 on: November 05, 2019, 04:59:57 PM »

I'll throw something in here as it's getting to be a bit of a catch all practice discussion... for most clubbies, improving your concentration and decision making is much more important than technical work. It's not your 'technique' that gets you out most of the time, it's your lapses in concentration and (No Swearing Please) decisions!
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adb club cricketer

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #41 on: November 05, 2019, 05:39:24 PM »

Main issue with bowling machines for me is the fixed point of release versus the varying points of release when a bowler actually bowls. Just statically looking at the fixed bowling machine point of release and then facing actual bowler in game makes it even more difficult for me than just practicing against actual bowlers and going into the game. To each his own I guess, it it helps someone then why not, but better to be aware of the potential pitfalls.
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KettonJake

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #42 on: November 05, 2019, 09:19:52 PM »

Main issue with bowling machines for me is the fixed point of release versus the varying points of release when a bowler actually bowls. Just statically looking at the fixed bowling machine point of release and then facing actual bowler in game makes it even more difficult for me than just practicing against actual bowlers and going into the game. To each his own I guess, it it helps someone then why not, but better to be aware of the potential pitfalls.

Move yourself across the crease to vary this, much easier and quicker than moving the machine.

InternalTraining

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #43 on: November 05, 2019, 09:45:16 PM »

If you're, as InternalTraining puts it, practicing all your shots at a low speed "to build muscle memory" are you not premeditating in order to do that? i.e if you're "building muscle memory" by practicing your cover drive, even if you aren't in position to play the shot before the ball is bowled/fired you will be subconsciously premeditating said cover drive.

Not at all.

If you are just robotically practicing one shot, then throw downs won't help you either. You should do something else with your free time.

I have been very clear in previous posts about the "clown" act. Bowling machines do require some thought and planning. Keep a training log. Etc.

When practicing a shot or even learning to play a specific delivery, players must practice good judgement to leave unplayable balls, defend good ones, and hit ones that should be hit. Technique, judgement, patience.

If you think there is no "pre-meditation" when playing shots in cricket, I'd say you and I are playing a completely different sport.
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InternalTraining

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Re: Bowling machine vs throwdowns
« Reply #44 on: November 05, 2019, 09:56:22 PM »

This is absolute gold mate. Please, start a youtube channel, it would be hilarious.


No thanks. It hasn't done you any good.
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