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Author Topic: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire  (Read 560 times)

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Jimmy Tiwana

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Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« on: March 07, 2020, 06:25:14 PM »

Hey folks, am looking forward to purchase a camera to assist an umpire.

Wondering what would be the best for our club in terms of quality of picture, ability to instant replay to review decisions like lbw, and wifi connectivity for wider viewership. We can push our budget to 350.

Any suggestions will be appreciated, and what other accessories would be required in addition to the camera.
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imogzyboy

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2020, 07:48:12 PM »

Would being able to do reviews be allowed in league games?
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Jimmy Tiwana

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2020, 08:05:11 PM »

Would being able to do reviews be allowed in league games?

We play T20 only (unfortunately), and will allow two reviews per inning. Has had some issues in past with people being bit aggressive with umpires. Don't expect behaviour will drastically improve, but hoping to have some civility.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2020, 08:08:25 PM by Jimmy Tiwana »
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Churchy1989

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2020, 07:46:01 AM »

Slightly off the beaten track here... But waffle have a new toy out soon. https://www.wafflesport.com/

Cost is 500 for the box, then 125 subscription (4G internet box thing.

Sounds alot, but if you have 18 home games, 20 odd Sunday games that's 16 quid per game year one. 3 quid year 2. Or 9quid a game over 2 year.  You can get match sponsors!
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ExeCricketer

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2020, 09:23:44 AM »

You'll want something with good internal image stabilisation - without it, the umpire's movements will impact the footage and could ruin any chance for review, due to it being unwatchable. The other option would be to get a gimbal to keep things smooth, but that would add bulk, weight and a problem of how you'd mount it.

You'll also want to think about where you're positioning it - chest strap on the umpire may be convenient, but your umpire will need to be careful of what he's doing with his arms so as not to block the shot. A head strap could be a good option, as long as the umpire doesn't mind it. You'll probably want someone else to check on the framing of the shot from the sidelines every so often, via a connected device, so the horizon stays level etc. Also whether you can zoom may be important for decisions, either with the camera or with the software during playback.

Batteries and a big SD card are another consideration - you'll likely need at least 1 battery per innings for T20.

I assume you'd just hit record at the start of the inning and stop at the end? The other option would be to have a remote control (or have the guy with the Ipad hitting record and stop) and record every ball individually. Recording one file would be easiest, but could mean delays when reviewing - if you want to review on a device instead of the camera itself, the transfer time of a large file from the camera to a device may take longer.

I only really know about GoPros: the GoPro Hero 8 may be a good shout, as the internal image stabilisation (hypersmooth 2) is very good, it has wifi connection & has many options for mounting/wearing. The GoPro app would allow live monitoring on a device like an iphone or an ipad & you could transfer files between the two wirelessly. I think it has a basic ability to zoom in before recording, too, so you could get the framing set up nicely.



« Last Edit: March 09, 2020, 09:38:22 AM by ExeCricketer »
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Boondougal

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2020, 11:21:52 AM »

Would be fascinated to know if the reviews would actually work at club level...I'm all for technology supporting fair play but I assume you would need some rule about who's decision is final. At the end of the day if bad behaviour is present and it causes issues, I suspect the close calls might create bigger issues - someone will need to have the final say or it could create an impassion!

At the end of the day any behaviour thats aggressive or discriminatory should never be tolerated - even if the umpire has Made a howler.

Technology has been great for cricket because the pace / technicality and general temperament of the game makes it easy to implement - I also think the use of "umpires call" was a master stoke and retained that "you win some you loose some" elements to cricket that I think everyone who plays the game actually understands - but only the ball tracking can prove it (or at least calculate it) and takes the heat out of the on field outcome - at a local level I would worry that these close ones would just get 2 people - looking at 2D footage from a single angle (thats possibly bouncing around) to polarise their opinion on if something was out or not depending on how the decision effects you.

Anyway that said I admire the effort to introduce it - please let us know how it goes.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2020, 11:23:42 AM by Boondougal »
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SLA

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2020, 12:35:41 PM »

We've had an umpire film games before. We had to be very, very clear with the opposition that under no circumstances would we be reviewing anything, because the potential for serious disagreement would be extraordinary.

However, we did look back at the footage after the game, and all agreed that the one lbw the umpire gave was actually going miles down the legside.
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InternalTraining

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2020, 07:14:08 PM »

I have mixed feelings about this. If another variable is introduced in the umpiring/game-flow situation, it will have to be managed. We play limited overs/ODI rules matches and over-rate becomes a factor during evening hours. The camera/review arguments could grind a game to a halt.

Unless you have a neutral reviewer, I don't see how cameras will work.

I am ok with imperfect umpiring since bad decisions go both ways.
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Psi

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2020, 09:02:32 PM »

I think could be really useful for umpires to look at their decisions after the match. But I can't see it being practical for reviews unless there is a neutral match referee and you have loads of time...
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billyb

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2020, 04:11:12 AM »

Just a tip- the field of view of a GoPro is too wide to be much use in my experience. You want something closer to a 35mm to reflect a true 'eye-like' perspective. A GoPro is 16.5- so super wide!
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ExeCricketer

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2020, 08:33:03 AM »

True, it can be wide! The hero 8 has a few digital lenses built in that you can select, though, including 'narrow', which they say is 27mm equivalent.  I think it's got 2x digital zoom too, so may be able to get something workable with a combo of the two.

Not perfect, but maybe an OK compromise to have the benefit of the other features

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Coach

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2020, 09:03:51 AM »

In theory for helping an umpire review performances this is a good idea, however I cant see it being practical for in game reviews. Would be interested to hear how it goes for sure
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Kez

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Re: Go Pro or any other camera for Umpire
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2020, 04:57:19 PM »

I like the idea of this but in reality it just doesnt work.
Using one 2d camera just doesnt give enough information to begin to review decisions.

If an umpire doesnt stand with the camera in perfect line with middle stump at both ends. Impact point will be skewed when viewing.
Frame rates will cause big jumps so impact point can be missed entirely.
Height will be easily misjudged, especially as the height of camera can change perspective easily when used front on to impact.

Hawk-Eye use up to 8 cameras in UHD running at over 350 frames per second and they still have people disputing the ball tracks provided.
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