Advertise on CBF

Pages: 1 2 [3] 4

Author Topic: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??  (Read 1718 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

jamielsn15

  • International Captain
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1383
  • Trade Count: (+5)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #30 on: November 10, 2020, 04:19:33 PM »

When batting out of my crease if the ball goes through I'll always look to get back. Always. Even to a pace bowler. To the point its habit. That dismissal is nothing but assumption from the bat that he's fine standing out of his ground.
It's great cricket from Paine. Sloppy from the batsman. If Paine was standing up, he'd get back, if he wasn't batting in his crease already.
How is it different to the Mankad? Maybe because its happening while play is 'live.' If he'd hit to a close fielder, he'd be in his crease, why is the keeper any different?
Logged
"The more I practice the luckier I get..."

SD

  • County 1st XI
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 876
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #31 on: November 10, 2020, 04:56:08 PM »

It is hardly genius when every club keep in league cricket tries this multiplie times every week but well executed.

Under the laws of the game it would seem to technically be a dead ball since no run was attempted but in practice these will be given every time
Logged

alba caerulea

  • International Captain
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 1104
  • Trade Count: (+5)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #32 on: November 10, 2020, 05:01:05 PM »

For anyone who thinks that should be dead ball - what about when the batsmen run a bye through to the keeper, when trying to get someone back on strike for example? Works both ways
Logged

Bats_Entertainment

  • World Cup Winner
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 3463
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #33 on: November 10, 2020, 05:01:59 PM »

Going on the description alone, it's a run-out not a stumping.

I'll correct myseĺf and say it is a stumping and not a run-out. Whether it is a legitimate one is another matter.

I had something like this happen when I was doing square-leg umpire once. There was an appeal for caught-behind or or maybe be lbw. I turned my head to see the umpire judge the batsman not out and, subconsciously or not, assumed the ball to be dead. Meanwhile the wicketkeeper had thrown down the stumps and was running towards me screaming like a mad thing. I told him, honestly, that I could not give the batsman out because I had not seen what had happened. He called me a cheat and it all kicked off. I wouldn't have minded if he'd called me a fool...
Logged

edge

  • Moderator
  • World Cup Winner
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4409
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #34 on: November 10, 2020, 05:16:33 PM »

How is it different to the Mankad? Maybe because its happening while play is 'live.' If he'd hit to a close fielder, he'd be in his crease, why is the keeper any different?
Play is live when the bowler starts his run-up.

I think the deception element (again not that I agree with this but I can see where people are coming from) depends on how far through their action the bowler gets and whether they intended to bowl at all. Seen it a couple of times in club games that the bowler was clearly just waiting for the batsman to step out of their crease early. In fairness to those involved, they did just warn the batsman so no harm done.
You can't fake to bowl and then throw the stumps over, that would be not out. A batsman who waits til the ball has been released before leaving their crease can never be mankaded, there's no deception element.
Logged
HS: 156, BB: 7-20

ppccopener

  • Forum Legend
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 6664
  • Trade Count: (+6)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #35 on: November 10, 2020, 05:22:25 PM »

Not uncommon to see this in league cricket on a Saturday, as has been said most of the time the stumps are missed  :)

Ball is live and perfectly legit dismissal, in fact I may of been out this way myself once!

I believe it's actually 'stumped' in the book by could be wrong, there is no run being taken but batter is out of his crease so I can see run out being correct too
Logged

SD

  • County 1st XI
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 876
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #36 on: November 10, 2020, 05:38:19 PM »

For anyone who thinks that should be dead ball - what about when the batsmen run a bye through to the keeper, when trying to get someone back on strike for example? Works both ways

Clearly in this case the batsmen are attempting a run so the ball isn't dead
Logged

ppccopener

  • Forum Legend
  • ******
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 6664
  • Trade Count: (+6)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #37 on: November 10, 2020, 06:02:25 PM »

Also you got to ask yourself if your foot was back, but the keeper hit the stumps and the ball deflected off into a gap would you take a run?
Logged

alba caerulea

  • International Captain
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 1104
  • Trade Count: (+5)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #38 on: November 10, 2020, 06:04:09 PM »

Clearly in this case the batsmen are attempting a run so the ball isn't dead

But according to 20.1.1.1 its dead when the keeper receives it.

I think if the bye run to the keeper is universally accepted then this dismissal should be aswell. Dont like giving praise to Australians especially Simple Tim but fantastic keeping in this case.

Slightly unrelated but still Sheffield Shield - NSW declared with Mitchell Starc on 86*. Lost his head on the walk off the field and Rumours of a broken wall in the dressing room  :D

Logged

SD

  • County 1st XI
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 876
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #39 on: November 10, 2020, 06:22:11 PM »

But according to 20.1.1.1 its dead when the keeper receives it.

I think if the bye run to the keeper is universally accepted then this dismissal should be aswell. Dont like giving praise to Australians especially Simple Tim but fantastic keeping in this case.

Slightly unrelated but still Sheffield Shield - NSW declared with Mitchell Starc on 86*. Lost his head on the walk off the field and Rumours of a broken wall in the dressing room  :D

I know it is a technical point, but it is a dead ball when the umpire considers it "finally settled" with the keeper. 

It isn't a law that causes too much issue in practice and WG Grace running out Sammy Jones in 1882 probably gave us the Ashes so worth it on balance!
Logged

Bats_Entertainment

  • World Cup Winner
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 3463
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #40 on: November 10, 2020, 06:28:02 PM »

I believe it's actually 'stumped' in the book by could be wrong, there is no run being taken but batter is out of his crease so I can see run out being correct too

I had to look in the laws book. Initially it felt like run-out but now feel sure it's stumped.
Logged

InternalTraining

  • World Cup Winner
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 4357
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #41 on: November 10, 2020, 06:32:12 PM »

So Tim Paine just did this in the Sheffield Shield and the commentators lorded it, but I have always considered it a bit village whenever you see it tried in club cricket.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CHZV8zOHE1H/?igshid=173vk9hjn2iko

Smart cricket this by TPaine. I wish my keeper was this alert.
Logged

Tailendfielder

  • County 1st XI
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 685
  • Trade Count: (+1)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #42 on: November 10, 2020, 08:14:30 PM »

Ive done it a few times.

I would add i would only do it to a batsman because his going down the wicket consistently to a bowler, his trying to negate swing or disrupt the line and length of the bowler so why should i not be able to throw the stumps down.

I would not do it in a friendly.

Reading through the comments about keepers not standing up to medium pace. Standing up to me is less to do with pace and more the accuracy of the bowler. Not a chance im standing up to an uzi and wearing a full bunger or going for leg byes.

Lastly, its always a stumping. It would only not be a stumping if the umpire didnt know the rules or the batsman was attempting a run and which case this thread wouldnt be relevant.
Logged

jamielsn15

  • International Captain
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1383
  • Trade Count: (+5)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #43 on: November 10, 2020, 10:01:23 PM »

Play is live when the bowler starts his run-up.

Technically of course it is. I put it in inverted commas as the bowler can abort his run up. Mankad-ing is obviously an aborted run up. The Paine stumping is a continuation of a passage of play
Logged
"The more I practice the luckier I get..."

RPC/Blueroom Cricket - Adie

  • Forum Sponsor
  • Forum Legend
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7037
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Is this Village or Genius by Tim Paine??
« Reply #44 on: November 11, 2020, 07:57:07 AM »

Perfectly fine.. get in and stay in your crease.. really is that simple
Logged
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4
 

Advertise on CBF